Okay so assume I have a bike and nothing else. No power meter, no trainer. I am looking to solve 2 needs
A way to do controller indoor bike workouts (especially during the winter months)
I want to finally move up to training with power, at least on my indoor workouts (outdoor power can come later).
So first I want a platform to do it. Something with some videos and give me a plan. Seems like trainer-road gets good reviews, so cool - going to use that.
Now I need to figure the rest of the stuff, namely trainer and power meter. Current options seem to be:
a) Wahoo Kickr for $1100 (they really charge $100 more for the 11 speed casette? Can I buy a 11 speed Shimano 5800 on my own and save $50)
b) Kurt Kinetic Road Machine for ~$329
c) Kurt Kinetic Rock & Roll for $469
It seems like the Kickr will feed real power data into my trainer road… but the Kurt Kinetics are on the trainer road “blessed” list, and will give me virtualized power. Maybe 10-20w off my real power, but seems totally fine to train on over the winter. Kickr is cool in that it can adjust the resistance of the unit to say match a hill in a trainer road video (not sure they even do that?), but on the Kurt Kinetic I can just shift up or down a gear when I want to make it easier or harder.
Tell me why I should spend another $700-$800 on a kickr? I am not seeing why, but clearly I am missing something. Also the Rock & Roll is tempting to not feel so static and boring…
For the most effective workouts and race pacing you will want a power meter and a good reliable indoor trainer. I would suggest a Powertap and a Kurt Kinetic road machine. This way you will have power when you race and train(on the trainer and on the road) and you will have a good trainer that will last damn near forever (KKs are built like tanks in a good way). Kickrs are awesome pieces of tech, but you can’t take the power part of it on the road with you which is important for pacing and for knowing yourself. At the end of the day you will spend about what you would on a Kickr, but it will be a lot more versatile.
Okay so assume I have a bike and nothing else. No power meter, no trainer. I am looking to solve 2 needs
A way to do controller indoor bike workouts (especially during the winter months)
I want to finally move up to training with power, at least on my indoor workouts (outdoor power can come later).
So first I want a platform to do it. Something with some videos and give me a plan. Seems like trainer-road gets good reviews, so cool - going to use that.
Now I need to figure the rest of the stuff, namely trainer and power meter. Current options seem to be:
a) Wahoo Kickr for $1100 (they really charge $100 more for the 11 speed casette? Can I buy a 11 speed Shimano 5800 on my own and save $50)
b) Kurt Kinetic Road Machine for ~$329
c) Kurt Kinetic Rock & Roll for $469
It seems like the Kickr will feed real power data into my trainer road… but the Kurt Kinetics are on the trainer road “blessed” list, and will give me virtualized power. Maybe 10-20w off my real power, but seems totally fine to train on over the winter. Kickr is cool in that it can adjust the resistance of the unit to say match a hill in a trainer road video (not sure they even do that?), but on the Kurt Kinetic I can just shift up or down a gear when I want to make it easier or harder.
Tell me why I should spend another $700-$800 on a kickr? I am not seeing why, but clearly I am missing something. Also the Rock & Roll is tempting to not feel so static and boring…
Couple of thoughts:
The $100 upcharge - I think part of that might also cover the 11 speed compatible freehub. So an 11 speed cassette may not fit on their older freehub. Not sure…
You are right in that you can use the KK with trainer road, but the difference of course is that it is up to you to force yourself to the ‘suggested’ wattage they are telling you to do. With the ‘erg’ mode on a Kickr (or computrainer) it takes care of that for you. IMHO that is worth a ton!
Oh, and if you are going to go with a KK style trainer, I wouldn’t pay the extra for the Rock and Roll. I tried it for a couple months. It did not feel real, and in fact it just felt like my bike was trying to lean over more that usual, I really didn’t like it.
If money is a concern, maybe try to find a used computrainer?
The $100 upcharge - I think part of that might also cover the 11 speed compatible freehub. So an 11 speed cassette may not fit on their older freehub. Not sure…
Ah that is plausible
You are right in that you can use the KK with trainer road, but the difference of course is that it is up to you to force yourself to the ‘suggested’ wattage they are telling you to do. With the ‘erg’ mode on a Kickr (or computrainer) it takes care of that for you. IMHO that is worth a ton!
Ah good point… so you never really need to shift, just sit there and keep your cadence and you will hit your RPMs. Hummmmmm
Oh, and if you are going to go with a KK style trainer, I wouldn’t pay the extra for the Rock and Roll. I tried it for a couple months. It did not feel real, and in fact it just felt like my bike was trying to lean over more that usual, I really didn’t like it.
If money is a concern, maybe try to find a used computrainer?
Oh, I thought most people were reviewing it as nicer. I have never given it a try. I know sitting on a trainer makes me more sore than on the road because the bike is so static… I was hoping that maybe a little leaning would make it spread the pain around a little…
For the most effective workouts and race pacing you will want a power meter and a good reliable indoor trainer. I would suggest a Powertap and a Kurt Kinetic road machine. This way you will have power when you race and train(on the trainer and on the road) and you will have a good trainer that will last damn near forever (KKs are built like tanks in a good way). Kickrs are awesome pieces of tech, but you can’t take the power part of it on the road with you which is important for pacing and for knowing yourself. At the end of the day you will spend about what you would on a Kickr, but it will be a lot more versatile.
Ya that is kind of what I am thinking. Except I am not buying a powertap right now, because there are too many power meters in the news right now. Rather give it another 6 months till spring to see what shakes down. (plus just bought a house, rather not buy a PM right now if I am going to be inside for the next 6 months)
Correct, no shifting, and it doesn’t matter what your cadence is, the trainer will increase/decrease resistance to force the wattage on you. Very mean!
Regarding the RockRoll, I think comfort on the trainer has a lot more to do with getting yourself out of the saddle like you would once in a while on the road (without thinking about it). The leaning of the bike won’t make your butt feel better, etc. IMHO.
I bought a Kickr last year before I got a PM for some of the same reasons. I only ride in ERG mode so the cassette doesn’t matter as I don’t shift at all. I did almost all my winter rides in my garage. I did go outside for some long rides, but the real training was in my garage and I had a very good tri season…hopefully because of the Kickr.
Personally, if that investment level is something you’re ok with, then go with a proper power meter and a KK or Cycleops fluid trainer off craigslist (we just got the lady one for $120had been used maybe 3x). The supposed advantage to the kickr is that you don’t really have to “think”. No matter what you do the workout will be done at the prescribed power levels. This in turn theoretically ensures you get a quality workout every time. For me personally I prefer to use gear selection and cadence to control my power on the trainer. IMO it makes the time go by much quicker, and I’m still getting a quality session. I actually think there was a discussion on here a few months back about whether or not thing like the kickr, CT, treadmill aren’t perfect for all your training because you lose some sense of how to pace yourself. Don’t quote me on that though, I’ll try to dig up that thread.
P.S. if you’re going to commit to indoor training get yourself some fans. Big ones.
Because you get a cool 3d environment and variable resistance for terrain which you can’t do with a simple trainer. I am not saying you need a BKool or Kickr, but if you want to be able to simulate outdoor riding these are good options. I think you get a hell of a workout with just simple trainers so if you are just going to do hour long interval rides then BKool, Kickr, Computrainer are all overkill.
Absolutely. The resistance units are identical so functionally they are no different. The frame on the on the 2.0 is a little different and supposedly more stable, but we’ve had no issues with ours (both the green and grey ones). I think the knobs/ feet are different too, but I’ve had no issues with the old ones.
A couple other things to consider in the KK vs Kickr debate. The “need” for a trainer tire, likely mounted on a spare wheel increases the cost. Also that KK has a power module, so that price would need to be added as well if you chose that route.
A couple other things to consider in the KK vs Kickr debate. The “need” for a trainer tire, likely mounted on a spare wheel increases the cost. Also that KK has a power module, so that price would need to be added as well if you chose that route.
Well if using trainer road, I think the power meter part is bunk. Can get virtual power vs kickr measured power… both work inside… both will still require a real PM eventually to race on.
So yes kickr saves tires… but how much riding does it take to burn $800 in tires? Especially if I use old tires that I would otherwise toss on a trainer wheel.
All of this really depends how serious you are about the trainer time. If you get >100 hours of indoor riding per year the nice stuff (Kickr, CompuTrainer, etc) really make the whole experience a lot nicer. Everyone gets a bit bonkers by late winter anyhow and having a better unit helps.
All of this really depends how serious you are about the trainer time. If you get >100 hours of indoor riding per year the nice stuff (Kickr, CompuTrainer, etc) really make the whole experience a lot nicer. Everyone gets a bit bonkers by late winter anyhow and having a better unit helps.
I want to be serious, at least 3 days a week in the winter, and maybe half my training year round. So happy to pay more if its better. But such a mixed bag here so far… having to use my shift on a KK doesn’t really hurt me, does it?
All of this really depends how serious you are about the trainer time. If you get >100 hours of indoor riding per year the nice stuff (Kickr, CompuTrainer, etc) really make the whole experience a lot nicer. Everyone gets a bit bonkers by late winter anyhow and having a better unit helps.
I want to be serious, at least 3 days a week in the winter, and maybe half my training year round. So happy to pay more if its better. But such a mixed bag here so far… having to use my shift on a KK doesn’t really hurt me, does it?
just get Trainerroad and the damn Kickr and never look back. You’re spending more energy than necessary worrying about minor things. The extra $$ are worth it.
just get Trainerroad and the damn Kickr and never look back. You’re spending more energy than necessary worrying about minor things. The extra $$ are worth it.
just get Trainerroad and the damn Kickr and never look back. You’re spending more energy than necessary worrying about minor things. The extra $$ are worth it.
Why is the Kickr worth $600 more
It’s a great set up in my opinion. I have a kickr, Trainerroad and a bunch of Sufferfest videos. I don’t have to shift. I don’t worry about tire pressure, slippage and wear. I get on the bike and hit my workouts and move on with my day. There’s $600 in my time right there.
