On carbon vs. non-carbon wheels?
Is it because the aluminum braking surface comes undone under the heat/pressure of the brakes and we don’t want aluminum shards getting stuck in the CF braking surface of our race wheels? Heard that somewhere.
Also, what’s the difference between cork pads and swissstop or other whatever-material-that-is (rubber?) pads?
Thanks for indulging me.
The primary reason is that you don’t want metal shards from your aluminum rims scratching your carbon wheels. Also, there are different compounds, a lot of standard pads squeel really bad on carbon rims. My pads of choice for aluminum rims is KoolStop Salmons. For carbon rims my favorites are Swiss Stop yellows, followed by the new red carbon pads by KoolStop. I am using some Bontrager Cork pads now, but they are wearing out fast.
Swiss Stop yellows work well for both and are the best around solution.
Standard brake pads will quickly wear away if you use them on carbon rims…and the performance is suspect at best.
There are many pads that will work on both rim surfaces - people have already mentioned the Swiss Stop Yellow, Zipp makes some (made by Kool Stop), etc. Many people will tell you not to use these pads because you can get pieces of aluminum in them which will then ruin your carbon rims. I have been riding the Zipp pads for almost 5 years adn have never once had this happen to me. YMMV, but don’t rule out the most versatile option based on myth and lore. Not saying it doesn’t happen, but I think it is much more rare than people suspect.
I have heard that the Bontrager Cork pads work well for both surfaces as well, but have no experience with them.
If I was gonna buy a new set of pads today, I would go with Swiss Stop yellow and be done with it.
hmmmm, maybe I could just put swiss stop yellow on all our bikes, and when putting a carbon rim wheel on, just give the pads a quick sanding in case any large aluminum bits on on the surface…
Take some tweezers to them too before you sand it. I’ve pulled a few fairly deep shards out that I doubt sandpaper would’ve gotten (unless you sanded off half the pad anyway).
Sanding definitely isn’t a bad idea. I have to swap brake pads whenever I pull the race wheels out for the weekend, so I’ve gotten pretty acquainted with the brake pads on my bike. Mine don’t pick up too much Al from the rim–every once in a while I’ll see a tiny sliver here or there, but it’s definitely not like my brake pads are the most abrasive thing ever. That said, I think HED is way behind Zipp in terms of brake track coatings and I’m super leery of using anything but carbon-specific pads on my rims–my Stinger 90’s came from the year when some genius decided to clearcoat over the brake track as well, so there’s a giant ring around my wheels where the superficial layer of the coating on the rim has worn away from braking.
Every once in a while I’ll forget to take the carbon-specific pads out after I’ve swapped back to my regular wheels and I’ll see tiny bits of Al stuck to the pad, but a thorough sanding returns them to good-as-new condition.
PS, how do you wear out brake pads? I’ve had the same ones on my bike for going on 3 years now and I could still throw them in a box and sell them as “like-new”
Really?!?!?!
Admittedly, I change pads (or shoes rather), but I would probably freak out if I found metal shards in my pads or coming off the rim large enough to tweezer out
you must live somewhere with terrain that never requires braking?
I have narrow and long tweezers, and a dentist pick that I use. Never been particularly alarmed by what I’ve found but I doubt some of the pieces that get pushed flat into the pad would come out with a quick sanding either.
Unlike the time I tweezed out a decent sized piece of a razor blade that was stuck in my tire (without flatting it… specialized armadillos are tanks), that was surprising. Tire was sent to the trainer after that.
I live in NASCAR country, where we live by the motto “It’s not who goes the fastest, but who slows down the least.”
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Does anyone actually have first hand experience with brake pads damaging their carbon rims?
My rims have never shown the slightest bit of wear, marking or scratching. Some “regular” pads definately don’t perform very well on carbon but the only other drawback I’ve found is fast wear on the brake pads…not the rims.
I guess heat buildup could be an issue. I have seen one Zipp rim separate while being ridden down a very long hill by a very large guy but I believe he was even using the Zipp pads.
I live in NASCAR country, where we live by the motto “It’s not who goes the fastest, but who slows down the least.”
Theres an interesting correlation in race car driving where the fastest lap times are also always the laps with the higher % of time spent at full throttle
but then to achieve that, you have to brake very hard, and exactly enough coming into the corner, so that you can start getting on the gas at exactly the apex.
I’m rambling
I change the pads every time I put my Zipps on for racing. It takes 5min at most to change pads.
I will say I do have aluminum in the training wheel pads…no way would I use them on my carbon wheels too.
"Does anyone actually have first hand experience with brake pads damaging their carbon rims? "
Yup. Lots, including multiple denials of retail customers warranty claims due to damage from improper pad use, damage to personally owned wheels due to aluminum debris in pads, and measurable deterioration of brake surfaces in a single race due to bad weather and poor pad choice.
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…PS, how do you wear out brake pads? I’ve had the same ones on my bike for going on 3 years now and I could still throw them in a box and sell them as “like-new”
Hills + rain = done. I could easily burn through a couple sets of pads every winter if I got out more, instead of watching football/hoops on the trainer.