And I bet you’re a retro grouch who prefers Campy too eh Fleck;-)
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Not at all. In fact I don’t think that I have ever had Campy on any bike that I have owned or had through sponsorship. It’s all been Shimano. My 7 year old Ultegra groupo is doing just fine. Mind you, it does not get used much these days. That’s the secret to getting the gear to last a real long time - don’t use it too much!
Fleck
lol…dude that is priceless…a new motto…there’s that…and then there’s taking care of your stuff…that works too…not as well maybe…but all the same. Is that how you can still move so fast after all these years? Barely using what you have. They do say every person only has so many good races in them…guess I’m pretty screwed then. Wish someone woulda told me sooner.
I’m seriously looking into one. Unfortunately there are zero dealers anywhere remotely near me. I’m going to be in the us for timberman this year, and hope to find someone in ny/nh area that i can get a demo. where i live the roads aren’t great, and the vibes through the seat can be pretty nasty sometimes. For me, the SR would be about comfort, i’m pretty certain i’d be able to match it up to my current position. i’ll look for a second hand TT 650c as that’s the wheels I have and i’ll just build the frame up using what’s on my current cheap alu tt frame.
J.
I just rode my 2004 Softride Rocket TT yesterday for the first time since buying it somewhat on impulse. I was traveliing through San Diego and stopped by Nytro to pay homage. Lo and behold they were clearing out their Softrides (scratch another SR dealer) at a price I couldn’t pass up, especially after I took a test ride. Why did I buy one? Great price, Slowman’s review, talking to a couple of friends who love theirs, the aero numbers, and a hope that the bike comfort factor will help on lronman length training rides and races. I think the Rocket TTs look a little cooler than the original softbeam but then again a) beauty’s in the eye… and b) I really don’t care what I (or my bike) looks like at the end of a 112 miles as long as I’m averaging over 19 mph and can run strong for 26.2 miles.
Bottom line, I think I’m going to love my TT based on my little 18 mile ride yesterday. I haven’t dialed in the fit, but I know I’m got at least a 78 deg effective seat angle and my cockpit length is just about perfect (I’m 5’11" and have a medium TT). The ride comfort was noticeably better on rough surfaces (where was this bike when I did IM NZ???) and as previous posters have pointed out, I think that’s going to make a difference in allowing me to keep my pelvis rotated forward, especially towards the end of longer rides. The bike does weigh around 21 lbs, but heh what few seconds I might lose on a steep uphill, I gain on any downhill. Normally my wife riding her KM40 will smoke me on any downhill with me riding my Trek 5900 (with aerobars) but yesterday, I was the one doing the smoking on the downhills. That bike is slippery going downhill!
Now I just need to figure out where my spare tire seat pack and water bottles all go???
socialsecuritynumber759company wrote: Normally my wife riding her KM40 will smoke me on any downhill with me riding my Trek 5900 (with aerobars) but yesterday, I was the one doing the smoking on the downhills. That bike is slippery going downhill!
I’d be surprised if you wouldn’t have a better run off the Softride from what I hear about the roads at IMNZ. Beam bikes are SO much easier on my lower back…I no longer am forced to use those back muscles to help raise my rear off of the seat over bad patches, or bumps, so they stay much less stressed. Consequently, when I get off the bike, I don’t have to stretch so much, and it doesn’t take so long to feel good on the run transition. At least, that’s what I feel in training!
I’ve often used your simple buddy-rider test to evaluate relative speed. It seems if one person “always” outcoasts another on all the downhills, then something is changed (wheels, bike frame, position) and suddenly the other person is always faster on all the downhills, it is a meaningful observation. I’m not talking about a couple of runs down one particular hill, I’m talking about a ride through the countryside.
It’s really easy to demonstrate how much faster some wheels are by just coasting downhills with the same buddy rider. Why not bikes, too? I was convinced a certain supposedly aero wheel was not better than a 32 hole Mavic Open Pro, partly by using this test. I also found my Kestrel Talon is much faster downhill than I realized. I don’t ride it very much (back problems, as mentioned ad nauseum), but, it sure appears to be very slippery. The Titan Flex is even a little faster, but, that’s not surprising since there’s no seat tube…the neat thing is, it’s even faster than I thought it would be when fitted with a rear disc. I guess the beam bikes tend to be that way since there’s no seat tube fairing for the rear wheel to hide behind. Try a disc on that Softride…you might find even more benefit from it than you calculated compared to a disc on a double-diamond frame.
Just to head off some comments: Of course, the great majority of aero drag depends upon the rider’s position…that’s why I think this coasting test is easier to evaluate wheels…you assume it’s easier to replicate the rider positioning if all you did was change a wheel or two.
I absolutely refuse to belive there is that much diff. in 40K times between those 4 frames with a rider in a real world situation. I don’t care what anybody says!!!
What do you guys think?
Time differences from wind tunnel tests are always extrapolated based on a flat course with no turns. This gives a good base for comparison, but it also means that real-world differences are almost always significantly less. Every time you climb a hill, slow down for a turn, etc. you are reducing the amount of time during the race that aerodynamic differences come into play, and you are reducing the real world time difference between a more and a less aerodynamic setup.
So you are right. But it’s not because wind tunnel tests are invalid.
Actually, I DID buy a softride (rocket TT7), but then I upgraded to a TitanFlex.
I found that the Rocket had a number of mechanical issues related to the complex beam assembly engineering. Specifically, beam pivot maintenance is complex but if you do it enough times (and you will…), you will get the hang of it. I had 2 beams delaminate and Softride replaced them for me.
This is not meant to be a flame of Softride or a suck-up to Titanflex, as I am merely a humble mid-pack triathlete. However, I do have an opinion on this issue born out of personal experience.
As mentioned above, I got rid of my Rocket TT7 (taking quite a financial hit) because of the maintenance troubles. Overall, I liked the ride of the bike, but I went thru 3 beams, 2 sets of pivots and a new seat clamp in a year, and found that the ownership experience and particularly the beam adjustment process, while certainly able to be mastered eventually (you get good at it when you replace/re-do your beam every month) was more aggrivation than it was worth. Ultimately, I lost confidence in my equipment and headed off on my first IM with my biggest worry that I would have a DNF due to bike mechanicals. I will say that Adam and Chig at Softride are extremely helpful and will do their best to make you happy.
That said, I did switch to a Titanflex and am EXTREMELY happy that I did for a number of reasons:
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The Titanflex ride is better. The Rocket beam was kinda bouncy for me, but the TF boom (there are 4 options of flex) is much more firm. It still absorbs the bumps, but the ride is more like a Porsche/BMW than a Caddy. The TF climbs MUCH better than the Rocket (don’t know if it’s the fact that the bike weighs so much less than the Rocket, or if it’s a design feature…who knows, maybe I’m just getting better…), handles more crisply and I think (I can’t measure, but it feels like it…) that the TF has less lateral deflection around turns due to the stiffer boom.
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The TF boom mechanism is MUCH more elegant (simpler and more reliable) than the Softride Beam mechanism. My Rocket Beam used 2 sets of pivot points, employing about 10 different pieces, a 2 page procedure that you MUST follow exactly (specific lubes, loctites, torques…). The TF has a boom that slides in and out and a seat post that slides up and down. No fuss, no muss. When I swapped my TF to the softest boom, the entire change took me less than 3 minutes and I have ZERO concerns about collapsing beams, delaminations, cracked sleeves…
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The TF is a much better bargain. I paid less for a TF with DA, FSA carbon cranks, Cane Creek brakes, a Look Ergo Stem, Zipp 404’s, SSM Aspide, etc… than I paid for the Rocket with Ultegra. Plus, the DA TF is about 2 full pounds lighter than the Rocket (3 pounds if I put on the Zipps). The initial price looks high on the website, but I’m sure you can work a deal. Upgrade parts (like wheels) are at less than wholesale cost, as Tom gets them at OEM prices direct to you.
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The TF purchasing/ownership experience is unmatched. As I mentioned above, the guys at Softride are great to deal with and I appreciate their patience with me after so many crisis calls and parts being fedexed all over the US. However, Tom at TF isn’t just the customer service guy, he is the owner of the company and he puts his personal rep on the line for every customer. I bombarded him with about 10 calls and countless emails concerning EXACTLY what I wanted in my bike, and he was very easy to deal with. More importantly, I always felt that he was honest and straightforward, to the point of advising me AWAY from certain things ($$$) that I thought I might want, but probably don’t need.
Just my 2 cents.
bought one for my g.f. this xmas … we both love it … she’s moving to denver and taking the bike with her …
if, or rather when, i spend some serious cash on a new bike, softride is at the top of my list.
At 48 and counting with a 7hr bike split I don’t qualify for young turk. I do want to continue doing long stuff for a long time so comfort is a factor. Please let us know what your final results are concerning comfort and perceived speed difference. How about adjustability and any other like topics?
Look for a thread in about a month. Old farts like us might find it interesting.
I don’t buy the adjustability feature. The more something is adjustable, the more things that can go wrong. My philosophy is to figure out something close to reasonable and go with it. Of course this assumes I have actually gotten close over the last five years. That is a fact not in evidence.
The young turks say they will laugh at me as they blow by. In reality, that will never happen since they will never get behind me in the first place.
Larry, I know you wrote to Art. But, I have a TF, and am also your age group. Adjustability is great, and easy. You slide the boom in or out of the receiver…there’s one allen key bolt that you loosen. Seat height is exactly like a regular bike…one allen key bolt. Seat forward-back on it’s rails is exactly like a regular bike, because it uses a regular bike seat post. It just can’t be any easier.
I’m 71 inches tall, with 33 inch inseam. I fit well on a 700cm Titan Flex either as a road configuration or a steep (up to about 78 degrees) configuration. I just fit a friend on it, he’s a couple of inches shorter, and he also fits well on this bike for a steep position…but, he’ll be getting a slightly shorter head tube on his bike…nice that Tom could do that for him. Either of us would fit very well on the 650 medium frame…and it would probably be even a better fit for steep position, because it’s front-to-center distance is so much longer than the 700 cm frame.
Like another poster stated, the bike is rock solid. It has less flex when standing and cranking hard on it than my Kestrel Talon. It is one stiff bike/drivetrain. But, unlike most stiff bikes, you don’t have to worry about the ride being brutal…because you are riding on that Titanium Boom (with four different choices in stiffness)! Elegant brilliance in design.
The Softride will probably be my next bike. Maybe as soon as next year, as long as I can find one that has a short enough head tube, and it has to be red.
jaretj
Larry,
Tom should be able to put you in touch with some TF owners close to you (Michigan?). If there’s no one closer, you’re welcome to come to Toronto to ride mine. Or we could meet somewhere in the middle for a ride. I have a 700c (Large; I’m 6’2" with a 36" inseam).
Cheers,
Rob
I bought one, a TT7. Love it.
I did buy one, and it sucked. I never got comfortable on it and it scared the bejeesus out of me at any speed downhill.
Look forward to the thread.
Thanks for the feedback. There is probably no perfect bike, but I am always interested in hearing about what someone thinks. I am a bit shorter that you (58 inches) and have leveled out at 145 as race weight. I like the idea of a steep bike and will probably go with the 650 since that is what i have now. Sounds like if you get one you will love it.
Rob,
Thanks for the info. Yes, I’m in Michigan and it would be nice to try one out just to see how it feels. Lots of $$ to just blindly put down. I’m a bit shorter than you so the bike probably wouldn’t work, but hey, it would be an excuse to go to Toronto where I haven’t been in years. Thanks for the offer and if all else fails, I give you a shout.
Larry, best wishes in your hunt for the perfect bike! The TF certainly deserves a look. If you decide on a double-diamond frame, consider talking to Ves Mandaric at Yaqui. Extremely knowledgeable guy, great to work with, and wonderful end product.