Ok, I have been running for a couple of years and riding for about six months with the intention of doing some tri’s this year. I figured that I would put off the swimming for a while, how hard can it be right? Well, I just tried to swim today ( for exercise I mean, I CAN swim ), and it was a very rude awakening. It took me about twenty five minutes to get in 300 yards. My question is meant for other noobs with no swim background or coaches…Is there a rapid prgression in this sport once you get some instruction? I have access to a very good masters program which I now intend to join. I know that it takes a long time to master swimming, but can I reach the point to where I can complete an Oly swim in 3-4 months with instruction? I was totally shocked at how miserably I performed. Hopefully there will be some good news in the responses. Thanks.
yes. definitely. the learning curve is very steep.
yes. definitely. the learning curve is very steep.
Thanks for the reply, but what does that mean? Will I quickly see results with basic instruction? Again, I realize that it takes a long time to be good, but I’m talking about improving from incompetent to mediocre.
My experience: I went from incompetent to mediocre in about 8 weeks. After 6-8 weeks of hard work (coached swims 3x/week), suddenly it “clicked.” I wasn’t fast, but I was comfortable. Masters is good, but you may need some private or small-group instruction first. Masters coaches don’t always have a lot of time to devote to an absolute beginner. (I started with a beginners’ group.) Don’t waste time trying to figure it out yourself – the coaching is key. Good luck!
in my experience yes, you can improve from wholly incompetent to mediocre in a short time. likely you are doing a couple elemental things drastically wrong out of sheer ignorance and once you know better you will instantly improve.
for an adult incompetant the TI books are cheap, and at least get you thinking in the right direction on some of the very basic principles which you need. another book " fitness swimming" is also simple and cheap and accessable
i sucked so bad my first time to the pool the local masters coach was literally speechless. at 25 minutes for 300 yds you are, unbelievably - even worse than that. however, after simply reading a little about the activity i was able to go from utterly horrible and a hazard to my own health to easily ( albeit slowly ) cruising a half mile or actually - indefinitely just about overnite. i actually never did get any instruction whatsoever, and was able to enjoy solo long distance open water swims in lake michgan, and a MOP ( ok, rearward MOP ) ironman swim just fine within a few weeks and months, respecitvely- simply by understanding a few basic principles of the activity from a book which a guy is gonna be hard pressed to come up with on his own. i hated and still do hate indoor swimming and to me masters swim looks like some sort of sick recycled high school gym class hell. zillions of people have learned to swim on their own and i do not think you need personal or formal instruction to grasp the activity at a basic level, myself.
so - head over to barnes and nobles and grab a coffee and read up a little. you will have an “a-ha” moment, sure as shootin.
Ok, when I said twenty five minutes, that wasn’t swimming time. Basically I would swim 25-50 yds, wait two minutes out of fear of drowning, then repeat. 
“what does this mean”
sorry but I will be brutal - 300 y in 25 minutes is ungoldy slow
so with just a bit of instruction and a month of swimming 4 times a week - you will see large improvements - you could drop minutes off that 300 time. but until someone can see you swim that is the best answer you can get.
problem is - you are still going to be very slow even if you take 10 minutes off that 300 y time. that is not bad if you are willing to take the time and put in the effort to go from a 15 minute 300 y to something more like 6 minutes. this is what might take a year or probably more of very hard work. are you willing to do that?
with 4 month of very consistent swim training and good coaching you will be able to get through the Oly swim BOP - that is a place to start. BUT to get to a point of being MOP it will take a few years.
good luck
yeah, that is what i figured. either that, or you were doing a kicking drill with a kickboard and going backwards, like i do. stupid fucking kickboards. luckily, you don’t need to kick in a wetsuit. oh yeah, get a wetsuit - it is totally cheating - like wearing a goldang surfboard. you will be instantly not-all-that-bad in a wetsuit.
Everybody here is right, an athletic guy like you will get much more comfortable/competent in the water in only a few weeks, swimming 3-4 times a week.
I have an idea. Tomorrow, go to the pool and swim 500 yards as fast as you can. Of course it will take a while, because you will need to stop and get your breath at the end of each lap/length. But I’ll bet it takes considerably less time than you expect. Then do a month of consistent swimming, maybe with a masters program. Then do the 500 yards again. Please report back here, I, and probably many others, would be interested it hear your progression.
Happy Splashing!
-Colin
Oh, absolutely. I did master’s for a year and saw great improvements - I was even sort of fast with a wetsuit! OTOH, I tried to swim about a month ago after 3 years off (of swimming) and I couldn’t keep my heart rate within warm-up ranges no matter how relaxed I tried to be or how often I breathed. sigh
The biggest problem is usually position, then loss of position on the breath, then a bad catch.
I know may people disagree, but TI definitely helps with postion, rotation and can help with the catch…somewhat. Try the book and video. A few private lessons can really help after that, and it’s way cheaper than the weekend thing.
Drills Drills Drills… I would recommend getting a coach rather then swim with Masters… You will be surprised how soon you will be down to the 7-9 minute range for the 300 (still not fast…but a reasonable goal for you at this point). Work on drills… high elbow, catch ups, one arm drills… Don’t try to correct everything at once. Focus on one thing at a time… Make drills a large part of every workout.
I am far from an expert, but here’s my advice. Get the Total Immersion book and READ IT. You can teach yourself to swim (and swim well!). Follow the drills first before you start learning bad habits. It’s not about the yardage in the begining. Anyway, I started from scratch with no background or coaching. After 6 months of training, my first open water swim race, I pulled off a 56 minute swim for 2 miles. So, It worked for me.
I think when I started this thing 20 mins for 300 yds would have been my level: I could only swim 50 yds at a time, but had no fitness at all. I firstly went to swim school, which took about 10 weeks, and I could do the 300yds in one hit, just. it seemed like slow progress. I did my first sprint tri two weeks after that, and did the 500yds, in a wetsuit in about 13mins. I joined masters squad after that, and did very rapid improvement in terms of being able to do 500yds in a wetsuit in 10mins, comfortably, after another 4 weeks. I just had to drive myself to keep up with everyone.
So can you complete an Oly swim after 3-4 months: probably. You won’t be far off it. I couldn’t, but I wasn’t bringing any fitness into the training. If you are in wetsuit, more probably yes, that takes care of the floating, you just have to move your arms.
It took a year for me to hit a stage where any distance was OK, I could swim easily and continuously for 4.5k, my longest swim so far.
I found the Total Immersion books really helpful in explaining what was going on and I still use some of their drills when I have to sort out a problem. Swim classes tend to put you through some exercises, but not explain why you are doing them.
Is there a rapid prgression in this sport once you get some instruction?
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH
I hope that was helpful.
However, to be serious–and this is advice from someone who just learned to “swim” last year, has no athletic ability, but finished an IM swim and turned around to see about 400 people in the water behind him (after starting last), so take it for what it is worth–but the first thing is, it is all about the breathing. Constantly breathe as you would running or biking–no breath holding, no gasping.
RIGHT WAY: Grab your breath and immediately begin exhaling under water with the last little bit being expelled as your head turns for the next breath. Breathe. Repeat.
WRONG WAY: Exhale and inhale both above the water line–you will wind up not fully exhaling and just pack little gulps of air in on top of the old stale air, which never gets expelled, get to the end of the pool gasping for air.
LOOK MA! I’m giving swim advice and I can’t find my ass with both hands!!!
I think one on one coaching is much more effective than masters, so long as you find the right coach. Your problem is 95% tech and 5% fitness - so trying to slog out 000s of yards of laps is pointless unless you are doing it right.
If you get correct coaching then an Oly is certainly doable.
FWIW, it has taken me nearly three years of masters to get to be a MOP or BOP swimmer. It is amazing to suddenly be surrounded by enough people to get hit in the swim!
If you get the right help, and swim lots, you will be fine.
Thanks for the input everyone. I did get the impression while swimming that at least half of my problem was not being able to relax and breathe correctly, and that the other half or so was complete lack of technique. I may post follow up info on the forum as to how I find the progression as a new swimmer. This board seems to be very cycling specific and other noobs are probably worried about swimming the most also ( or at least they should be ) I am going to find a private coach as well as join the masters team and will report back in a month or six weeks if anyone thinks that this would be an interesting topic.
Yes–please post back.
Welcome to another rock.
I was in your situation 2 years ago when i decided to attempt tri’s. I could not swim a lap when i started. I was so bad that when I used a kick board I went backwards instead of forward.
Get a coach. I spent a year trying to teach myself and all I did was reinforce bad habits. If your masters program has a coach that will work with you rather than spend the session swimming himself you are lucky. If he knows what he is dong you should feel comfortable in the water in about 6-8 weeks.
When swimming. if you feel your stroke falling apart, stop and take a break. It is pointless to struggle with bad form. You are learning nothing at that point except that swimming is difficult.
You could probably do a race at this point if you wear a wetsuit. When in the pool I use a buoy to help simulate the effects of a wetsuit. I am actually faster using buoys than i am while doing freestyle(kick still needs work).
Don’t give up. Swimming can be very frustratiing. I still have days when i feel as if I can’t swim a lap. But the harder you work the fewer days like that will occur.
Hopefully your masters group will be encouraging and supportive in your efforts.
Good luck.