It was extremely hot this past weekend when I went out Biking and running on Sat and Sun. My question is if I am going to go ride for example for 2 hours at 145 bpm on the bike and it is really hot and that raises my heart rate even though my power output is low. should I work out at my prescribed power output or heart rate zone? I noticed that my heart rate was higher than normal but it was 97 when I was riding. Do I still get the same cardio benefit riding at 145 bpm when it is about 15 hotter than normal. Also on the run it was hot and I noticed my pace was slower for the given heart rate. should I still be running at the 145 bpm or at the pace I know i can hold for that heart rate.
Am I still getting basically the same cardio benefits working out at 145bpm at a normal temp as opposed to working out at 145 bpm when it is near 100 F? or do I need to adjust my heart rate according to the heat?
FWIW, this is the way I understand training in heat. The bottom line is your heart rate does not know what your pace is, your pride does. If your HR is 140 while you are walking for 5 minutes during your long run, your HR does not know you are walking!!! Only you do, but your heart is getting the workout it needs. If it is super hot, you can literally be walking and still be aerobic, possibly anaerobic for that matter. Stay within your guidelines but know there will be a drift in your HR. I live in south Louisiana and during this time of year it is almost impossible to get a long run in and maintain an aerobic HR. I usually break the run up into 2 segments. For example…If the run is 135 mins in HR 2, I might do 90 mins with a low HR of 1-2 and know it will creep into low HR 3 towards the end no matter how slow I go. In the evening, I will add 45 mins but go a little higher into HR2 to mid HR 3 towards the end. Hydration (water) and electrolytes play an important role in getting in these runs.
If anyone has any medical/scientific info relating to this topic, I would be interested!!
HR is too variable in my experience to be relied on solely. Power on the bike and rpe on the run are better. And to maximize the quality of my workout, I avoid training outside during the hottest part of the day. Better to do focus training on the trainer or tm than battle the heat and humidity.
I think this largely depends on where you race. If the majority of your races will be in hot/humid weather, there is no better training IMHO than hot/humid training. You might have to tweak it to avoid excesses and pay close attention to hydration but the only way to really sense how your body will react is doing it and seen your progression. Coaches and experts might dissagree and I could be totally wrong of course.
I personally try to maintain the HR within the parameters for the training runs, during rides I dont see much difference due to the speed cooling effect. As with a race in hot/humid weather, your time/pace will be slower on hot/humid training. Again this is just my opinion having lived all my life in really hot/humid places.
The key is to remember that heart rate is an indirect response to exercise, it is not a direct measure of exercise intensity. Your heart rate may be high for a variety of reasons including heat, hydration status, relative state of rest, anxiety, etc. Excercise intensity clearly influences heart rate, but as you’ve noticed, environmental conditions also can play a large role. I advise my athletes to use heart rates as a guide but there are times when you may want to just keep doing what you were doing.
yeah, I basically just wanted to know if I would still be Aerobic/Anaerobic at my specific heart rates.
I don’t think there was a danger of you going anaerobic, don’t worry about that.
yeah, I basically just wanted to know if I would still be Aerobic/Anaerobic at my specific heart rates
Once again for all of ST - HR is a response to pace or power output. It does not determine if you are aerobic or anaerobic, pace or power outpout does.
so if I am reading your post correctly then, if it is extremely hot and I run lets say 1min/mile slower(or bike 30W lower) than aerobic pace but my HR is higher than at my normal aerobic pace I am not aerobic at that heart rate even though it is beating at a higher rate than my normal aerobic pace under normal conditions?
some of you guys are not understanding the basic definition of anaerobic
Try a search and Paulo, et al. have gone over anaerobic workouts vs. non with endless other posts and debates (some good stuff). Long and short is very few workouts are not aerobic.
And theres no way you are not aerobic walking - maybe if you sprint at 1000 watts you might be anaerobic for 5 or ten seconds.
To answer your original question I’d train by power and be concerned more with staying hydrated and recovering from the workout vs. aerobic/anaerobic. HR tend to go higher when its hot but it does not mean you can’t go hard. You might take air quality into consideration when determining your zone for the ride.
so if I am reading your post correctly then, if it is extremely hot and I run lets say 1min/mile slower(or bike 30W lower) than aerobic pace but my HR is higher than at my normal aerobic pace I am not aerobic at that heart rate even though it is beating at a higher rate than my normal aerobic pace under normal conditions
Your HR is higher due to the enviromental demands not a lack of less power or slower running. Once again HR is a response to the demands that the workload and the enviroment are placing upon the organsim (you). 7:00 min pace per mile at high temps = higher HR. 7:00 min pace per mile at lower temps = lower HR.
Here is a true example to illustrate this point:
I live in AZ. I have an 11km loop that takes 48:30-50:00 consistently to run and I typically leave my house at 5:30am to run it. In the winter I can do it at an avg HR of 145bpm. In the summer I avg about 170bpm. The difference is due to the fact in the winter it is 40F and no humidity. In the summer it is not uncommon for it to be 85+ already at 5:30am and humidity at 30% or greater. The difference in HR is due not to any speed changes but due to enviromental factors. Now if I run this loop slower in the summer, given the enviromental conditions that I face, lets say I run it in 52:00min, my summer avg HR will still be about 160-165bpm. This is higher than the winter avg hr even though I’m running slower than in the the winter. The reason again is enviromental conditions.
So even though you are running slower you are aerobic.
This is why I’d advocate for you to establish 3-8 normal running/riding loops and know how long it takes you to ride/run them. When you do your testing you can establish paces or wattages if cycling, that correlate to the proper training paces/wattages your need to be riding to accomplish the goals of that days workouts.
This is why I’d advocate for you to establish 3-8 normal running/riding loops and know how long it takes you to ride/run them. When you do your testing you can establish paces or wattages if cycling, that correlate to the proper training paces/wattages your need to be riding to accomplish the goals of that days workouts.
That’s HUGE! It’s taken me 4 years to find Lydiard, but that’s sounds like something straight out of his playbook.
That’s HUGE! It’s taken me 4 years to find Lydiard, but that’s sounds like something straight out of his playbook
I’ll take that as a compliment as i’ve never read anything by Lydiard. To me it is just common sense, something many triathletes need more of.
It is very common to base your goal hr for a given workout on your hr at functional threshold or possibly ventilatory threshold or lactate threshold etc.
However if your workout conditions are significantly different from the test conditions then your hr estimates will be a little off. So if you got your goal hr based off of a test you did when it was 85 outside, then when you workout when it is 85 outside you goal hr estimate will be pretty darn close. But if you did the test when it was comfortable and then go workout when it very hot you have to make some adjustments.
On the other hand it may be easier to say that the different heart rates aren’t really going to make that big of a difference and just do it at the intended hr and don’t get too worked up about it either way. I could easily see some coaches saying that.
Mostly you need to get out there and ride, whether your hr is a little too high or your pace a little too slow on a couple of workouts isn’t going to matter come race day. If your hr is CONSISTENTLY higher than recommended or pace is CONSISTENTLY slower than recommended then you probably have a basic disconnect and need to look into it further.
if the Heart Rate was what mattered then all the top male triathletes would stay at home with adult magazines and choke the chicken for 5 hours a day.
you get better at running and biking by Running and Biking. adjust your ‘zones’ by percieved exertion and do not exercise staring at your HRM. it’s just a tool.
as far as biking goes, with the cooling effect of the wind there should NOT be any noticable effect on your HR in the first 2 hrs, assuming you are acclimatized and healthy. (noticable meaning, it may be 2 or 4 BPM higher but you’ll never know if it’s the heat or something else). if there is a noticeable increase in HR you started off in a less than optimal physical state. i did 4 hr bike rides all summer long in florida with 90temp and 90% humidity and never noticed an effect in the first two hours on the bike. same here in bermuda, mid 80temps and humidity, the water is also mid 80s so the wind is just as warm and the first 2 hrs on the bike it is not a factor. now the run, that’s a different story…
Heart rate was higher because i did 5 hill climbs and that was almost 4000ft of elevation gain on the 5 climbs. that is when I started noticing the heat, as I was soaking wet on the top of each hill. I never really sweat on a bike ride(well at least not much) because of the cooling effect of the wind. and like you said i can go ride in 90F no problem as long as there are no climbs. but these where steep at least for me. I was pushing just under 300W for most of the climbs and i was going under 4mph. I almost fell off the bike once as I had to reach down and get water that slowed me down enough where I almost tipped over. I had to get up off the saddle and pick up some more speed. that is what also made me realize that my RPE was lower at a high heart rate mid 170’s. As I was able to get up off the saddle and accelerate to maybe 5.5 mph!!!
my RPE was lower on the day I biked and on the day I ran but my heart rate was a little higher, specially on the bike and the hill climbs(as that was closer to 100F. on the run the HR was just a little higher with a lower RPE temp that day was in the low 90’s F, but my pace was about the same. I attribute that to getting in a little better shape. as the run loop is one I do regularly. As far as the bike climbs, that was the first time I had done 4 of the 5 climbs. But judging by the riders i rode with(I thought 3 of them were better bikers than me) my RPE was lower than what it should have been for the given heart rate during the climbs and I finished right there with them.
I don’t “Solely” rely on heart rate. it was just during this past weekend that I noticed my HR was higher.
So I take it from all the post I really should be relying more on Feel and pace on the run and feel and power on the bike?
sorry, from your original post it sounded like you were cruising along at a moderate 145bpm and not powering up a hill. yes, you hit the ‘worst case’ scenario, uphill (slower, not breeze) and increase exertion.
to me everything is based on feel or PRE. all the other things (power, HR) are tools to help quantify that.