My brother visited Argentina a few weeks ago. He’s been living in Spain for a few years now. Within the first week, he got sick, some kind of strong flu, even though climate isn’t that cold and he took care of himself. Without a doubt he got sick because there are lots of new viruses in my country that can’t be found in 1st world countries. The misery and famine lead us to a situation where, even though you have food, shelter and health care, most of others don’t, and therefore they get sick and spread the diseases all over the region.
What got me started on this post is the fact that I actually saw this coming, and posted on the subject here, months before the new viruses spread over the country and the news started talking about this new, health emergency, which proves that talking, thinking and sharing ideas with like minded people (you guys), does help to see things coming and prepare for them with enough time. So I started thinking about several issues, what I learned (either the hard way or thanks to this forum) after all these years of living in a collapsed country that is trying to get out an economical disaster and everything that comes along with it. Though my English is limited, I hope I’m able to transmit the main ideas and concepts, giving you a better image of what you may have to deal with some day, if the economy collapses in your country. Here is what I have so far:
I guess the key thing is to get out of the urban environment. But if you must stay you better learn to acquire water (if there is none), food (because JIT inventories will result in shortages), and how to defend yourself against the entitlement dependent rabble that will likely stay until there is absolutely nothing left. The rest has been covered ad nauseum in other threads.
I read parts of that blog before. What is really interesting about it is it is about a real situation in Argentina rather than some hypothetical “end of the world” fantasy which runs through most of the survivalist stuff out there.
Heres a basic description of the economic crisis that ended up destroying the Argentine currency which in turn lead to a virtual shutdown of all banks in the country for a year. It also resulted in massive movement of capital out of the country which among other things brought huge numbers of businesses to their knees. There were riots, the economy was severely disrupted and it really sucked for alot of people but it was not the typical everyone head for the hills and try and live off the land stuff that many survivalists preach. There is actually alot of practical advice to gather from how people actually made it through this crisis, from basics like security to how to not just survive but actually make out well in a realtively well off economy that suddenly ends up mostly being a barter economy for a period of time. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Argentine_economic_crisis_(1999–2002)
Moving from Missouri to Pennsylvania for college: I got majorly sick a few times.
Moving from Pennsylvania to Washington DC: I was majorly sick, including allergies that sprouted up and persisted for pretty much my entire first year here.
The point is that you get sick adapting to things your body isn’t used to. It’s not something unique to undeveloped regions.
I don’t get it. I read the Wikipedia entry on the “collapse” of Argentina in 2001 so I’m an expert now. It appears GDP dropped 4%, some riots, etc. Government fell, but was pretty quickly re-established via Constitutional measures.
How hard was it to “survive” during that? Even if you get a spot of the flu.
If your focusing on the flu thing, then you didn’t read past the first few paragraphs.
It gets worse. He makes no connection between what actually happened in Argentina (3 days without power…ooooh), and all the knowledge he’s projectile vomiting at the poor reader.
This on sound suppressors:
"All I’m going to say on this subject is: Have one if you can. That’s it. I’ll leave the rest of it to your imagination, don’t make me say it. Today it may seem like a “nice to have” feature… after the SHTF, it may be an “O God I’ve got to get a suppressor!!” feature.
What does that mean? I have no idea what he’s talking about. I guess I’ll have to wait until the “SHTF” to find out why I’m going to go “OMG! I need a silencer!”. When SHTF I guess everyone turns into Delta Force wannabees.
“And those that don’t want to adapt to the new reality they live in, will die young, thus cleaning the gene pool and ensuring the continuity of the specie.”
Oh. Dear. My survival advice: stay the hell away from those who start talking about “cleaning the gene pool.”
i was traveling around argentina at that time. petty crime had definitely increased, and apparently big hollywood-style bank robberies too. but i wandered around buenos aires and many other parts of the countryside as a solo (22-year-old) traveler and never had a hassle. shelves were well stocked, restaurants and hotels were open for business . . . i had some amazing parties and met some cool people. lots of business were hurting (and many lost everything), and i don’t want to gloss over how difficult it was for many, many people, but it’s not like the streets were littered with corpses.
With airline travel easier than ever , we can be in contract with a sick person from anywhere .
Larger public tourist spots or stores . Having been where the road ends in much of Asia , pacific islands ,
upper S.A , …
I would agree water and some food maybe a problem . I doubt anything will
slow down a healthy traveler with street smarts for long . I had that Dengue (sp) fever twice
No doctor visit , just fluids & rest .
I don’t get it. I read the Wikipedia entry on the “collapse” of Argentina in 2001 so I’m an expert now. It appears GDP dropped 4%, some riots, etc. Government fell, but was pretty quickly re-established via Constitutional measures.
How hard was it to “survive” during that?
That’s the point kind of. The crazy survivalists are all planning for the end of the world when in reality, the stuff people need to have some plan for is more like “what do I do if my company goes under, I lose my job and can’t find another one for a year or so” or “the banks are closed and I can’t get any cash for a couple weeks.” Or, more basic, you lose power for a few days (happens all the time, even in the US) and you can’t find your flashlight because its in the far reaches of a very dark basement or you have to shave and get dressed for work in the dark because you don’t even have one candle in your house.
The thing that is interessting about Argentina is its a real situation and some people came through unscathed (even had great parties as one poster said) while some other unlucky people got more caught up in events. In most likely “survival” situations, a flashlight you can find when you need it and $500 in emergency cash stashed away somewhere is way more important than having 400 pounds of rice stashed away and a compound deep in the woods.
At a minimum, have the basic supplies listed below. Keep supplies in an easy to carry emergency preparedness kit that you can use at home or take with you in case you must evacuate.
Water—one gallon per person, per day (3day supply for evacuation, 2week supply for home)Food—nonperishable, easytoprepare items (3day supply for evacuation, 2week supply for home)FlashlightBatterypowered or handcrank radio (NOAA Weather Radio, if possible)Extra batteriesFirst aid kitMedications (7day supply) and medical itemsMultipurpose toolSanitation and personal hygiene itemsCopies of personal documents (medication list and pertinent medical information, proof of address, deed/lease to home, passports, birth certificates, insurance policies)Cell phone with chargersFamily and emergency contact informationExtra cashEmergency blanketMap(s) of the area
Consider the needs of all family members and add supplies to your kit. Suggested items to help meet additional needs are:
Medical supplies (hearing aids with extra batteries, glasses, contact lenses, syringes, cane)Baby supplies (bottles, formula, baby food, diapers)Games and activities for childrenPet supplies (collar, leash, ID, food, carrier, bowl)Twoway radiosExtra set of car keys and house keysManual can opener
Additional supplies to keep at home or in your kit based on the types of disasters common to your area:
WhistleN95 or surgical masksMatchesRain gearTowelsWork glovesTools/supplies for securing your homeExtra clothing, hat and sturdy shoesPlastic sheetingDuct tapeScissorsHousehold liquid bleachEntertainment itemsBlankets or sleeping bags
5 people in my house, where do I store 280L of water??? Do people do this? Is it like a ‘fill up both bathtubs as soon as something happens’ kinda thing?
Everything else on the list is scattered throughout my home - I even have a few of those ‘shakable’ flashlights to avoid the need for batteries… but do people somehow store all this stuff in a way that makes it transportable - an ‘easy to carry emergency preparedness kit’? How?
5 people in my house, where do I store 280L of water??? Do people do this? Is it like a ‘fill up both bathtubs as soon as something happens’ kinda thing?
I used to store a decent supply of water in plastic containers in the garage. My neighbor back then had the best storage, though- a cistern on stilts that held a couple of thousand gallons and worked by gravity feed. I personally would not recommend relying on the old “fill up the bathtub when I need it” technique, just because you might not get advance notice of a disruption to your water supply, and lacking a supply of water for anything longer than a day or two really sucks.
Everything else on the list is scattered throughout my home - I even have a few of those ‘shakable’ flashlights to avoid the need for batteries… but do people somehow store all this stuff in a way that makes it transportable - an ‘easy to carry emergency preparedness kit’? How?
Yeah, being prepared isn’t as kooky as it sounds. Like you say, most people have at least most of what they should have already- mostly I think it’s a matter of making sure things aren’t expired or about to run out, and remembering where they are when you need them. As for the evacuation kit, you should put one together that makes sense for you and your circumstance. When I lived in Idaho, both of our vehicles had an emergency kit stored in the trunk in waterproof backpacks. They held food, a couple of bottles of water, matches, change of clothes, tarp, flashlight, couple of rolls of quarters, etc etc. Back there, it was entirely within the realm of my imagination to slide off the side of the road in winter (or summer, for that matter) and be lost to civilization. Here in NJ, I don’t bother with kits for the vehicle.
Shit I was in Miami on business when Hurricane Wilma came through. A minor hurricane in the grand scheme of things, but it blew a boat into one of the causeway bridges breaking the power grid and cutting off water to all of South Beach. A lot of people do not realize how seedy Miami is (most impoverished city in America) and how South Beach is adjacent to some violent neighborhood and has a lot of drug addicts. Well come 2:00 there was rioting outside of the only stores open (liquor stores) and it become utter chaos in small sections of the area. It is not hard to see how things can get really ugly after 72 hours if normalcy isn’t restored. A FEMA instructor of mine (I had to get NIMS certified for my current position) said we are four meals from anarchy and I believe him. That is why the whole premise of urban surval is kind of looney. Getting the hell out of the city should be your first priority.
I used to store a decent supply of water in plastic containers in the garage. My neighbor back then had the best storage, though- a cistern on stilts that held a couple of thousand gallons and worked by gravity feed. I personally would not recommend relying on the old “fill up the bathtub when I need it” technique, just because you might not get advance notice of a disruption to your water supply, and lacking a supply of water for anything longer than a day or two really sucks.
Used to? So not anymore? Did you / your neighbor somehow circulate the water? I agree that not having water would suck; we used to buy the big jugs for the water cooler, but with the new house we’ve bought the fridge with the integrated chiller…so totally dependent on the muni supply… hmm…
Almost everyone has 40 gallons (150 liters) already in the hot water tank. Just make sure you know how to get it out when you need it (its really easy if you have few feet of garden hose and s screw driver). I have two 5 gallon plastic containers I use for camping that I keep filled up. They don’t take up any more room filled than they do empty so why not fill them. Once all that runs out I’m probably screwed but there are some streams and lakes close enough to get to if things go totally south.
I’m not much of a survialist but I have lost power for a couple days and have had water main on my street break and was without water for 24 hours. If nothing else, its really nice to have 5 -10 gallons around to flush the toilets if you lose water for more than a few hours.
The best thing I ever did for my “survive the appocalypse” prep was take the family on a couple weekend camping trips. It turns out, all the stuff I bought for camping will be really useful if the world ends. As it was, I was crowned Emperor and Supreme Ruler of my neighborhood because I could make coffee on the camp stove during the 2003 Midwest Black Out. Had the power not come back on, within about a week I would have been worshipped as a god.
The nuts stock food. The future rulers of the world are stocking up on coffee.
No, and I got an earful about it from my wife just the other day, actually. We moved from Idaho a couple of years ago into a situation where storing a decent water supply just wasn’t feasible. (Besides a couple of cases of bottled water for drinking.) We’re renting a different place now, though, and I really should take care of it.
