This is key advantage. I can easily do my 90min easy runs unfueled, but using nutrition/hydration greatly lessens how beat up my legs feel post run.
Phil you should be going by Double Doctor Phil on the forum, will garner much respect.
On a more serious note. What is everyone using to get to 100g/hr of carbs running? I have no problem reaching that on the bike with a couple of water bottles and maybe a powder refill in the back pocket, but I don’t want to put a bunch of sugar in a hydration pack on long runs. Any advice?
I generally just use my own powder mix by the way (dr. harrison specialty)
That’s exactly what I do. Sugar, sodium citrate, and flavor…in a hydration vest. It just takes a little getting used to.
If I don’t want to on any given day… I will put the mix in water bottles and put them in a cooler and run out and back loops.
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Got it. Might have to get a dedicated bladder then. The cleaning is what I wanted to avoid 
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I have an osprey duro…
https://www.osprey.com/duro-1-5-duro1point5s22-411?size=SM&color=Seaweed+Green+Limon
I’ve got the same pack actually! I like it a lot.
What are all of you doing to protect your dental health when ingesting these large amounts of simple sugars.
Are you alternating water and sugar solutions, rinsing out the sugars as best you can?
And do you have specific steps you take when your training has ended to minimize any damage to your teeth?
As someone who doesn’t have the strongest teeth, I am concerned about worsening my dental health. When I have used sugary drinks I have a good rinse with water when I get home and then chew some gum for 15 mins to get the saliva going to combat the sugar acids on my teeth and have a good brush after that. Is there anything else I should be doing?
As a very high volume cyclist or rather ultra cyclist I am appriaching 10 consecutive years of +1000 hours per year.
- For sure the more carbs I eat WHILE riding the better. I have used a lot of maple syrup over the years and have cone to use almost only maple syrup. That means I measure it in pints, quarts or half gallons to gallons for some races (24 hour tt).
- As others have said we feel better during, the day of post ride and days after (think back to back hard days or in my case multiple 100+ mile high z2 days in a row).
- I do fear the unknown long term. But also feel less stress shoet term should translate to more longevity and long term health.
- I do try to eat very little simple sugar outside training. Mostly plants and a little meat.
At 47 years old still going strong and little to no decline in FTP.
I am not especially concerned about my teeth since I have not had problems with them in my life, but understanding the mechanism of tooth decay will lead you to taking better care of your teeth. I am not a dentist, forewarning, but my sister is, and have taken enough biology classes in my life.
The best thing I think you can change is brushing before your training, not after. You have to understand that the sugar is not causing the decay. It is bacteria on your teeth that eat the sugar then produce acids that can wear away the enamel. So by maintaining brushing and flossing (and mouthwash) twice a day, you limit the amount of bacteria that can actually build up in your mouth to cause the decay. If you are extra concerned, an additional brushing or mouthwash before training will reduce the amount of bacteria in your mouth and prevent that acid production.
Also, you can change up your carb drinks. Try and limit things that contain citric acid (found in most drinks) or make your own mixtures that don’t use citric acid.
Lastly, brushing right after a workout is not a great idea. The common advice is wait 30min-1hr after eating or drinking before brushing your teeth, as the acids in food + the bacteria having their meal weaken your enamel temporarily, which your brushing can make permanent.
Basically as long as you are vigilantly brushing, flossing (especially flossing!!!) and using mouthwash twice a day, you should be fine.
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For me this is the main thing, outside of races. I keep espousing the merits of high fuel during long runs to my running partner, but I don’t think he’s figured it out yet. He’ll have some gels, but will usually consume about half the calories I do during a long run or ride.
This week, he asked me why I still have energy to spare after Sunday’s long run.
Remember those extra 400 calories?
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I have been fat adapted, on Low Carb High Fat [ LCHF ] & Intermittent Fasting for abt 5 - 6 yrs now. I eat strictly twice a day; lunch and dinner.
My BMI has always been thin / athletic; this is 100% for performance, not fat loss.
The race pic below was done fasted since dinner the night before, and was after the 2k, 39 min swim of a swim - bike [ triathlete, but can’t run ! 
]. I pushed hard enough in 40 C / 104 F & 70% humidity to increase my threshold HR 3 BPM. So yes, I was pushing, not “moderate pace”.
Before LCHF & IF, I was diagnosed as pre-diabetic, and often low-blood sugar crashed, and had to chug fruit juice, etc.
I now never crash, have energy all day, and never bonk. I’ve done 2 - 5 hr rides fasted, low - mod intensity. For the last 4 - 5 yrs my cholesterol, blood sugar, Na levels, etc, all metrics measured, have been excellent / ideal in all yearly physicals.
The amt of glucose in your entire bloodstream at any given time is 4 - 5 g, 1 teaspoon. If it rises or falls, you’ll go into shock or a coma, and eventually die; your body has to keep it there. 100g / hr, you are dumping twenty times the total amt of glucose in your entire bloodstream in, which must get out of your arteries and into your cells, as fast as you put it in, to avoid a diabetic coma, and death. Does this sound healthy?
People have to train their guts to get used to consuming this amt of sugar / hr; the body naturally rejects it. Does this sound healthy?
These are facts, that we can easily know. They are measurable, objectively, without “athletes’ feel”, RPE, “perceived recovery efficiency”, etc.
I have an Hons. BSc in Biochemistry. I am far from a tinfoil hat wearing science denier. But unfortunately we now live in a world where many “studies” are just funded advertising. They start with a goal of proving that a product is good. It’s unfortunately now to us to sift through the garbage to find the real, genuine scientific research…
While sugar consumed on the bike is burned during the ride, and not stored, it still must get out of the arteries, and into the cells. It is this process that causes the problems, not the storage as fat. That is not what we are talking about when we say consuming excessive sugar on the bike is bad for you. They now think arterial plaque buildup may be caused by the body repairing damage done to the arterial walls during this process. [ Unproven. ]
I have no doubt I could go faster, and have a higher FTP, if I chugged sugar on the bike. I could also go faster if I injected steroids, did cocaine, or took any of the other wild PEDs the pros took.
They will do anything to win, no matter the health consequences. They took horse steroids, for god’s sake.
I ride to go as fast as I possibly can, in a healthy way, to increase my physical health, energy level and longevity, and to have fun.
I would recommend the book The Obesity Code, The Art & Science of Low Carbohydrate Performance, and the documentary Fat Fiction. I would start w Fat Fiction. While there is an obvious bias, it also lays out some knowable & verifiable facts about the history & origins of why we started to think saturated fats are bad, and sugar & “carbs” are absolutely fine.
I honestly think we are now with sugar where we were in the 1950s with cigarettes; everyone is doing it. And I strongly think that in 5 - 20 yrs, we will be with sugar where we are with cigarettes, now.
Bottom line is that it only takes 2 - 4 wks to try LCHF & IF, and see how you feel. It changed my life, and I feel sort of like Superman every day, and I can race and train as hard as my body can, without bonking or worrying about nutrition.
It’s fun and freeing to not even think about it, and just go and race.
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I sure am glad to know that you have a BSc with honors. I didn’t believe you knew what you were talking about until I saw that…no one else around here has one of those.
oh, wait…nope…didn’t make a difference.
So, your version of “verifiable research” is a “best seller” and a video? Noted.
A LCHF champion appears around here with the tedious constancy of an unloved season.
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I know…the thread title made it inevitable.
@Tom_hampton I was very clear that I was not making what is called ‘an argument from authority’, which you’re right, is complete bunk ! 
I was just making it very clear that I am not ‘anti-science’. But that at the same time, in today’s world, many “studies” are not to be believed, unfortunately. That is what I meant to clarify. Apologies if I left you unclear on that. An Hons BSc Bchem is worth about $ 0.72 in today’s world !! 
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Let’s do some math - if you’re burning 800 calories per hour and absorbing 400 of sugar at the same time. Where do the remaining calories come from after your initial glycogen is depleted?
You’re saying that your body is simultaneously storing glucose while also oxidizing fat? That doesn’t sound right…
The catch here is that the glucose isn’t being absorbed all at once - you’re absorbing it at 0.03g per second, and then also burning double the equivalent elsewhere.
@timbasile I don’t consume sugar on the bike. Others do.
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And yet…you post two sources of pseudo science in place of actual science.
“Some” would be a better choice. And, that is often a matter of understanding the source of the funding, the location of publication…as well as, the methods of research, and the body of work of the researchers as a whole.
Dismissing true valid research in favor of a for-profit pseudo-science book, and a video is well…not very scientific.