Watching the IMKY concerns which were entirely predictable (and predicted.) I have watched IMAZ, IMUTAH, IMMOO with the same continual concerns. Put an IM in a city that pays the money, negotiate the course and athletes needs after the fact. So the Grand Columbian started with course first, more or less predictable temperate weather second, a great community who wants this event, then move heaven and earth to meet athletes highest expectations. We’ve had wind, the bike is a bit of challenge in first 65. Great run. Great community. I think there is a top tier of30% of the races (all distances) that really think through all of the elements and end up with a great race. RD’s that think it through. There are no conditions historically in Grand Coulee (which we reviewed before even designing the race) that would cause us to cancel a swim. The bike couse and run could handle two thousand athletes. It’s a triathletes’ triathlon. I wonder what it would take for the majority of athletes sitting in KY to begin to think through their options and choose many really great under the radar races such as the Grand Columbian, Silverman, Cheasapekeman (sp?)…rather than spend hundreds of hours training for a less than great experience and corporate race production. Don’t know but I certainly wonder. As reputedly anal as triathletes are (and as an RD I can attest to :-))…you’d think they would put as much energy into race choice as they do towards choosing their races as equipment, training and hydration strategies.
well those are sound points…but I have to say that the WTC/NAS generally does an outstanding job of running races. I experienced all kind of stuff last year at IMWI but I have to say it was an AWESOME experience. That plus a trip to Kona–which for me is a very desireable goal–well, I’m very willing to give the WTC a pass on IMLOU. I’m doing the AV at chesapeakeman as a prep for IMFL–so I’m not avoiding the other options but make no mistake about it, Chesapeakeman is not even in the same neighborhood for me as IMFL.
IMFL = draftfest with 2000+ athletes, cattle drive on the easiest IM distance course created versus say Silverman. 300+ athletes meeting a true Iron distance challenge, fully supported but still you and the course, and a sense of personal accomplishment. More support but still you and the challenge. You’re right. No comparison. See you in Las Vegas 
If you really think you’re up to it If not, IMFL is waiting.
Having done IMFL and agreeing it’s easier than IMWI though NOT easier than IMWA (I haven’t done all the WTC races so I can’t really judge where IMFL stacks up against all IM races) I will still say it’s not easy.
Having 2000 other people in the race is a definate plus from my point of view–I do plenty of local races with 300-400 people. 300 people in an Iron distance race sounds lonely. I’m sure silverman is a good race and I hope you enjoy it.
I’m very excited about IMFL and hopefully about Kona as well if all goes well there. From what I hear, a lot of people think Kona can be challenging–maybe it’s not up to silverman standards but tough enough for me…
rc
Just curious, how many times have you finished IMFL? IMWI? IMWA"
Support Crew
IMFL is not easier, it’s faster. If it’s easier then you’re doing something wrong.
300 people in an Iron distance race sounds lonely. I’m sure silverman is a good race and I hope you enjoy it.
rc
I will NEVER understand that statement. The IM branded races are draft fests. In some cases it really can’t be helped with 500 people coming out of the water more or less at the same time. But I mean, do you really need company when you are racing? Do you really need someone around you to talk to and see? Did you have them there in training? I am not ragging on you, I just don’t understand the mindset.
Having done Lake Placid and attempted Silverman, the only difference between the two was the lack of crowds cheering for you. I suspect that is why a LOT of people go the WTC/NAS route. They want people to watch them race for whatever reason. Me, just give me the course.
The Grand Columbian is definitely on my to-do list. What a beautiful course!
I suspect that is why a LOT of people go the WTC/NAS route. They want people to watch them race for whatever reason. Me, just give me the course.
The Grand Columbian is definitely on my to-do list. What a beautiful course! <<
I think you hit it on the head. They need that external validation or whatever.
And yes, GC is supposed to be a fantastic race and on my list too.
clm
I’d say the external vailidation is important to athletes. Another though is predictability in a Brand. That’s part of what I find fascinating is that NAS/WTC does a good job, but they have a track record that is more checkered than first timers may realize. Again usually because of field size. And part of the predictability is overcrowding race courses to shoehorn as many athletes as possible. Per the earlier question I’ve finsihed IMC, dnf IMCdA (my own stupid fault). I do more halfs such as Pacific Crest, Vineman. I’ll be doing Silverman Half and Pucon this year. On a personal level, I find crowded bike courses in a tri extremely frustrating. Passing, repassing, inexperienced bikers, draftfests annoying my sense of fairplay (I am also a USAT offical), blocking. The bike in a tri is supposed to be a personal time trial. I like having room to find and maintain my pace. I would also note that the non-WTC Iron distance events may in fact be better races because we have to exceed athletes expectations in order to maintain a market in the face of WTC’s dominance.
I think most people – even independent, intelligent, adventurous, anal ultra triathletes – want to do what their friends are doing.
If races like Grand Columbian survive long enough, they may become as popular as IM events. Look at Wildflower for instance. A tough course in the middle of nowhere is now a wildly popular event that draws many newbies and wannabes.
I fully support both MDot and Independent races. I have “observed” 50 of them, a mix of Branded and Indies. I would love to see the independents supported more. Choice is a great thing.
I would also note that the non-WTC Iron distance events may in fact be better races because we have to exceed athletes expectations in order to maintain a market in the face of WTC’s dominance.
Unfortunately, in North America, history has not shown this to be true. Very few Indie races have long term success. Vineman and GFT are a couple of the exceptions. I hope Silverman can join them.
WTC is the Disney World of Triathlon. You know what they say about Disney…
“nobody goes there because of the crowds”.
I agree athletes need external validation. Aren’t you looking for validation by posting a thread on a Public Forum to justify your personal choice in races?
hey sue–I’m no Joe b for sure but I have finished each IMWA, IMWI and IMFL once. I’m a late comer to this sport as I only have started and finished 64 triathlons so far–10 half-IM, 3IM, 2 ITU LC and the rest short course.
I actually like having lots of people in a race because it’s more people to race. I like the idea of passing lots of people–I passed 901 at IMFL04 (I’m kinda slow on the swim).
Some of the above comments strike me as a little aggressive and judgemental–especially since I’m sure those who posted them don’t know me. At 50 years of age I’m not looking for external validation–my motivations for doing IMs are more complex than that. You know, different strokes for different folks. sometimes it’s fun to race in a big race. sometimes its fun to race in the little ones–I loved finishing 3rd OA at metroman and that’s never going to happen at a WTC race. I’m not sure why people get so bent out of shape over this–who cares what I like in a triathlon? why should it matter if I like M dot races. It certainly doesn’t matter to me that you don’t. Have fun and thank the Lord you’re healthy enough to get out there and do it–it won’t always be that way.
rc
That’s a good point.
-Brian
I was replying to the OP… I agree with your post 100%.
Support Crew
The only mark against the Grand Columbian is that it is a bit of a rustic town for the silver spoon crowd that does Ironman.
It’s not a high-end destination full of 5-star resorts, fancy restaurants, etc…
It’s an upstate washington blue-collar town, with modest accommodation options, and only a few restaurants.
Sometimes it’s not about the event, it’s about the destination. I can’t understand why anyone would want to go to Louiseville though…
To me those were the reasons I travelled over from London, UK to do the The Grand Columbian last year, I like rustic.
I don’t care about brands, Kona slots, large crowds, 5star hotels or fancy restaurants, thats not what drives me - give me a well organised race, somewhere interesting with a challenging course. The Grand Columbian ticked all those boxes…
I guess I’m just strange 
I’m not knocking the race… just giving reasons why a certain crowd might not appreciate TGC for all it’s worth.
I did the Ironman race in 2004.
I was the hardest bike ride I’ve ever done to this day!!!
When I finally do the move to interior BC… I will likely do this race every year. Right now… it’s a looooong drive from Edmonton.
I did the GC that year(2004) and it was right up there with the hardest Ironman days I've ever had in 16 IM's.Bloody cold and windy that day,not to mention the odd hill or two thrown in ;).
Awesome location and a great course.
A little off from the OP, but I am also looking at Pucon for January 2008. Are you going on your own, or are you doing some kind of a guided tour thing? I just did Timberman and am looking for a exotic winter Half Iron distance event. Tim
External validation, being part of the crowd, doing the accepted thing, etc. etc. A majority of the people just have that personality characteristic that leads them to prefer to feel part of a bigger, popular and well-accepted thing. These are the “critical mass group” that use something newish only after the innovators and early adopters build the rep and work out the kinks. These are the people that tend to build extreme attachments to professional or collegiate basketball and football team results even though they don’t actually play these sports or have any talent in that area. It’s about feeling part of a group or accepted way of doing things. This is what motivates a lot of people. Not right or wrong-- just is.
Now if you are looking for an awesome and challenging event, I do recommend GC, although Centermiddy might be upset with me for promoting it to nonlocals (http://forum.slowtwitch.com/gforum.cgi?post=1174205;search_string=grand%20columbian;#1174205). (ha ha) Beautiful course, amazing local support and Jonathan does a great job catering to the athletes’ desires. Interestingly, it’s this very success of the Mdots that fuels people’s attachment to the “official distances” that led Jonathan to add an out and back to the IM bike course last year just so it would have the full 112 miles. I’d like to point out that this is a very difficult course, and finishers would be every bit the iron people they are for finishing the course with 110 miles as they were with minor addition. Yet, it was extremely important to some that the bike course have the full arbitrary number of 112 miles.
So-- with the cancellation of Woodlands and the way my long course training has been going, it looks like I’ll be seeing Mr. Hoskins at Silverman!!! Although, as a first iron distance, I’m just a wee bit nervous about it. I guess it’s time for me to make the commitment and register!