I purchased a Water Rover in 2009. Yesterday I got an email from Emilio explaining the “Fastest Wetsuit in the World Guarantee”. No explanation was offered as to the impetus for the email which offered Exchange/refund options during a period after which “De Soto assumes you are choosing to keep the T1 Water Rover with
the “Fastest Wetsuit in the World Guarantee†and you need not contact De Soto.”
I was/am planning on using the suit at Ironman St. George.
Can anyone provide any direct reference to rules/regulations on any developments?
The Water Rover is currently legal for USAT events, but there are questions about WTC events (and it’s not legal for many/most international federations). Just like buying those speed suits like the Speedo Lazr, there’s always a chance it will get banned (just like the recent FINA changes on speedsuits in swimming). IMO Emilio is doing the noble thing and letting you make your decision on the risk/benefit analysis of having the suit (it’s much faster, assuming you are allowed to race in it), and return it if you want to. Desoto has always been #1 for customer service.
The very best customer service is of utmost importance at the De Soto Triathlon Company.
Therefore, we have instituted the following guarantee for all T1 Water Rover owners.
Fastest Wetsuit in the World Guarantee
If you have purchased a T1 Water Rover, before February 15, 2010, De Soto gives you the following
choices so long as you act before February 26, 2010*:
• Exchange T1 Water Rover at the place of purchase for either a T1 First Wave Wetsuit or a
T1 Black Pearl Wetsuit plus a merchandise credit or refund of the difference in purchase
price or
• Return T1 Water Rover at the place of purchase for complete refund or
• Keep T1 Water Rover with the Guarantee defined below
If you purchase a T1 Water Rover after February 15, 2010, De Soto will give you a guarantee, in the
event that either WTC or USAT bans a wetsuit as thick as the T1 Water Rover. This Guarantee does
not negate the 15 day Satisfaction Guarantee T1 Wetsuit Policy.
Guarantee and Terms
This Guarantee includes (1) keeping your T1 Water Rover for use in races where it is not banned
and (2) a determined discount off of the MSRP (Manufacturers Suggested Retail Price) on any new
model of T1 wetsuit.
Discounts
If the ban occurs before:
• September 1, 2010: 60% off any new model of T1 wetsuit
• December 31, 2010: 50% off any new model of T1 wetsuit
• June 30, 2011: 40% off any new model of T1 Wetsuit
• December 31, 2011: 30% off any new model of T1 Wetsuit
Terms
• Must show original proof of purchase.
• Must show proof of entry in a race in which T1 Water Rover is banned.
• Must invoke Guarantee within thirty (30) days of date in which WTC or USAT institutes
wetsuit thickness ban, essentially banning the T1 Water Rover.
• Applies only to T1 Water Rover sales in the United States.
• If you choose not to act within the thirty (30) days following a WTC or USAT ban, you are
thereby waiving the guarantee.
• This guarantee only applies until December 31, 2011. If a ban occurs after that date, the
“Fastest Wetsuit in the World Guarantee” will no longer apply.
• It is the responsibility of the owner to invoke Guarantee with De Soto.
*Note: If you choose not act before February 26, 2010, you are thereby waiving either the refund or
exchange option. In that case, De Soto assumes you are choosing to keep the T1 Water Rover with
the “Fastest Wetsuit in the World Guarantee” and you need not contact De Soto[/quote
I agree whole heartedly. There was a ton of discussion of the risks before the Water Rover even shipped, I honestly would have thought that if it was banned that essentially the early adopters would have to eat the loss, thats one of the downsides with being an early adopter.
That being said, I’m very impressed with DeSoto’s customer service. Even if I’m not that interested in the Water Rover, my next wetsuit will most likely be a DeSoto (T1 First Wave).
It is not clear what if anything will happen. Everyone has an opinion, but the only facts are today they are legal for any event that has the USAT logo. We have no idea how the comments about 5mm wetsuits, or 76.1 water temperature were put in the Calif 70.3 athlete guide. All we know is they were there, and now gone. I do not see USAT ever making a change. Now, what WTC does with their rules, all I think we know is nothing would happen until later this year. Today, USAT would have to agree to a waiver for WTC, which I hope does not happen. My input to skip is either USAT and WTC have the SAME set of rules, or WTC such just go it alone without any USAT relationship, like results from a WTC race do not count in ranking, etc. If they want there own style of race, great, just do not use the USAT logo since it really is a different race.
“The Water Rover is currently legal for USAT events, but there are questions about WTC events”
there are no questions about WTC events. it’s unequivocally legal in WTC events (except in countries that outlaw wetsuits thicker than 5mm). but WTC’s posture is to eventually outlaw them if it gets its way. so, the water rover may have a limited shelf life but anything that might happen to the water rover’s legality would happen after this season.
What does this mean???
Does it mean it is the fastest guarantee in the world on Desoto wetsuits … or is this a claim that it really has been documented to be the fastest wetsuit in the world?? I know this is ST and not real world … but as always, if someone says they’re the fastest, shouldn’t we see some unbiased proof??? We know its the thickest suit … no question there.
Dan, not sure your words are very clear. I see no way that USAT will outlaw the suit. I can see WTC asking USAT for a waiver, but I sure hope Skip and USAT finally put the foot down. Either WTC and USAT have 100% the same rules, or WTC needs to just go it alone, since if the rules are not 100% the same, we should not be doing things like ranking folks together who be definition are doing a different race.
WTC races are such a small percentage of the races one can do, so even if they go it alone with their own rule set, so what.
Any rules technically could change for the future. The future is the future so why worry about things that “might” happen. I usually wear out a wet suit after 2 or 3 years, or the technology has improved so I am always being a new one anyways.
We technically have no idea what WTC is thinking. All we know is for some reason in the Calif 70.3 athlete guide, someone added some rules that are not approved. Wetsuit limits, water temp cutoffs, and I would add the outlaw of shoes on pedals in transistion. Until these or others are presented to USAT and approved by Skip, talk means nothing. And I have yet to hear who change the guide to put these “rules” in the guide, let alone why and who was told to remove them.
Bottom line is our sport has come to a cross road. Do we have a single Triathlon sport with one set of rules, or do we have 3 different triathlon sports with 3 different set of rules?
Dan’s reply seems much more clear and accurate than yours. Dave you have to stop posting your opinions as fact. Many get the idea that you are a USAT official, employee or some sort of insider with specific info. I don’t mind opinions, just make sure they come across as them.
That said here are mine USAT and WTC should work together. It benefits triathletes if they do. I’m not sure that USAT can put there foot down as far as WTC rules go. USATs foot wears the Olympic shoe, and WTCs foot wears IM and Kona. If push came to shove I think WTC is better placed to hurt USAT than vice versa.
As far as the rules go for the WR, my guess is next year its gone from WTC. No sense for them to have some races (US based) use tehm and some Europe based races not, then qualify for the same championships.
I think USAT may follow suit, although Desoto said they got assurances that it would remain legal, which could result in a lawsuit if they renege, so who knows.
Whoa…I just noticed that in the OAT rules (Ontario Association of Triathletes) which use the Triathlon Canada rules it states:
D.3.2 Illegal Equipment
Athletes must not use:
a) Artificial propulsion devices, (i.e. fins, socks, gloves, paddles, or floatation devices)
b) Wetsuits with thickness exceeding 5mm
c) Wetsuit bottoms only
d) Swimsuits made of material not approved by FINA in non-wetsuit events.
e) A second swim suit, which they remove after the swim in non-wetsuit events.
I never noticed if that was in there before so i can’t say whether that is new or not. Too bad if true but I am glad I didn’t buy one now.
Not that I agree with the rules. It’s BS if you ask me.
I still don’t see why this is a big frickin deal with the rules. ITU has their own rules fine, WTC has their own rules no biggie, USAT has their own rules Great!
Its not like other sports don’t have different rules depending on where you play, Hockey has different rules for NHL and olympics or european, geez even their rinks are different sizes. Baseball has different rules between conferences with the DH. Football has different rules depending on if you play in the US or some other country.
99.999 percent of US triathletes don’t race ITU so i don’t see why there 5mm rule makes a difference for almost anyone. If you’re racing in one of their races you know you need a 5mm suit.
WTC, obviously more present in the USA but if they don’t want to use USAT rules so their races are consistent across the world. Thats cool just make the rules that way.
If you know you are going to be racing in one of these races, that has different rules grow a pair and stop whining about it.
yes i know its frustrating not knowing what the rules are going to be for WTC, but once they make that decision they are fine. I don’t see why we have to have the same rules everywhere as long as people know what the rules are.
Just curious why do you disagree with the rule? I don’t care where the rule is placed, but I’d hate toi see the swim be “no devices which used stored power allowed, everything else goes”. We’d end up with people lying on carved out racing kayaks, with gigantic fins and hand paddles.
Maybe off topic, but who checks them? When do they check them? Just wondering… I did my first IM this summer and I’m by no means fast at all, do they just check Pros and top AG’s? There were so many people coming out of the water and getting stripped, I don’t see when checks would’ve been made. Not saying I would cheat, but if someone had one that was not legal when are they checked? Thanks!
Whoa…I just noticed that in the OAT rules (Ontario Association of Triathletes) which use the Triathlon Canada rules it states:
D.3.2 Illegal Equipment
Athletes must not use:
a) Artificial propulsion devices, (i.e. fins, socks, gloves, paddles, or floatation devices)
b) Wetsuits with thickness exceeding 5mm
c) Wetsuit bottoms only
d) Swimsuits made of material not approved by FINA in non-wetsuit events.
e) A second swim suit, which they remove after the swim in non-wetsuit events.
.
Those just look like the basic ITU rules. I know B, C and E are, they make a point to mention that, especially if you wear a speedsuit, if you are racing worlds.
Just curious why do you disagree with the rule? I don’t care where the rule is placed, but I’d hate toi see the swim be “no devices which used stored power allowed, everything else goes”. We’d end up with people lying on carved out racing kayaks, with gigantic fins and hand paddles.
Styrrell
i don’t see it any different as allowing disc wheels, aero helmets or aero framesets. All are designed to make someone go faster (whether they do or not is a different story) while doing the same amount of work. Seems to me this is the same thing.
And I only disagree with the 5mm rule. Not the other stuff.
USAT and WTC should work together. It benefits triathletes if they do. I’m not sure that USAT can put there foot down as far as WTC rules go. USATs foot wears the Olympic shoe, and WTCs foot wears IM and Kona. If push came to shove I think WTC is better placed to hurt USAT than vice versa.