I’m looking at it from the standpoint that the church is putting it’s blessing on the marriage despite that marriage not following what it believes is right and “Lawful”, religious law. If indeed the church was convicted in it’s beliefs it would reject such weddings. I know many churches used to do this and as recently as my parents wedding were EXTREMELY strict about this. Today, “Ahhh it’s ok”.
~Matt
What are the laws you are referring to?
There is no justifying it. You’re an aethiest who got married by a religous man in a house of worship with perhaps even scripture being read. That is a complete and total farce. It’s like me getting married in a temple, mosque, or house of devil worship. I would never do it and you should have done a civil ceremony if you are serious about your non beliefs, which apperantly you are only when it’s convenient.
There is no justifying it. You’re an aethiest who got married by a religous man in a house of worship with perhaps even scripture being read. That is a complete and total farce. It’s like me getting married in a temple, mosque, or house of devil worship. I would never do it and you should have done a civil ceremony if you are serious about your non beliefs, which apperantly you are only when it’s convenient.
The first rule to follow when in a hole is to stop digging. I was married in a Unitarian Universalist meetinghouse by the Reverend Kathleen Hepler (who, I’m pretty sure, was and remains a woman). Our ceremony did not contain a single reference to God, Scripture, or the Flying Spaghetti Monster (though that would have been fun, but I think He hadn’t been discovered yet). Learn something about UU beliefs, then come back. Or not.
Why are you trying to pick a fight with Ken?
I think YaHey has a misunderstanding of Ken’s ceremony.
Not that I’m sticking up for Ken, he didn’t even invite me to his UU wedding. Jerk.
Not that I’m sticking up for Ken, he didn’t even invite me to his UU wedding. Jerk.
Entirely my loss, I assure you.
You would have gotten a kick out of Marie-Claude, wife of my bride’s uncle/cousin/something. I did a sprint triathlon the next morning (really) at which many of the out-of-town guests spectated; when Marie-Claude saw the winner (who happens to be an STer) without his shirt, she asked him (in her French accent) “oooh, can I take you home with me?” He didn’t exactly know what to say…
You indicate this guy doesn’t believe in organized religion or going to church - but does he believe in a God? There do seem to be people who find the stories of Jesus and the rest of the bible to be utter nonsense, but they don’t eliminate their own belief in a God, or higher power. However, it does appear at odds with his beliefs to get married in a church, when he doesn’t like people who go to church.
It’s not that difficult to find a place to get married. My wife and I are atheists and we got married in the back yard of her parents home. No mention of any God. We had all our family members there, many of whom are quite religious, and they all thought it was a great ceremony. In fact it impressed one of my nieces so much that when she got married about 10 years later, she had her wedding in an outdoor setting as well - and it was performed with no mention of any God. That was strange because she had been a regular church goer for many years and her whole direct family is strongly religious.
The “Laws” are dependent on the religion, for instance the Catholic faith used to not allow marriages of individuals that were divorced and both partners in the marriage HAD to be catholic or else you could not be married in the church. In fact they made you promise not only to be catholic but to raise your children catholic. No way in hell could you get married in a catholic church 40 years ago if you didn’t follow these laws.
~Matt
I just went to the Unitarian website www.uua.org. From their website, they are an organization that represents over 1000 liberal religious congregations. The operative word being RELIGIOUS. It doesn’t matter if their Rev are liberal evangelical calvanists, it is still a religion, which is against aetheism.
Is that a law or a tradition?
No idea. I’m guessing if the pope says this is the way it’s going to be, that would be law. Either way they are there because they are founded in the church’s belief system. My point of hypocrisy from the churches standpoint is that in present age they are more than willing to put those beliefs to the side. Law or tradition they have changed them to fit current day.
~Matt
There is no justifying it. You’re an aethiest who got married by a religous man in a house of worship with perhaps even scripture being read. That is a complete and total farce.
BUt can’t you use bits of scripture or other religous works if you are not religious? I mean, I used a passage from the Velveteen Rabbit, and I don’t believe stuffed animals can talk. I do, however, like it’s underlying message. We also used passages and traditions from a variety of faiths and cultures, even though we ourselves are not religious. I can appreciate the idea of committing oneself to another or of doing good in the world and can find the words themselves beautiful without having to believe in a CHristian god.
Ken - I know pretty much nothing about the Unitarians, but I’m struck by the term “meetinghouse.” I went to quaker school growing up, and the “meeting for worship” took place in the meetinghouse. but that’s also where people met to talk business. yes, it’s where people worship, but according to quakers (or at least according to the early quakers) no one place was more holy than any other place. Kind of a reaction to the Catholic tradition of putting shrines and chapels everyplace.
We also used passages and traditions from a variety of faiths and cultures, even though we ourselves are not religious.
Some folks might refrain from using them in a non-religoius way out of respect for those that do. I’m not laying a judgement on you or anything, but I can think of some things that are traditionally Spanish, Irish, and/or “Black” that I think are neat, but would not use (as a non-Irish white dude) out of respect to the heritage of the people that hold those things as sacred or highly-valued.
When we don’t value things for what they are, we sometimes treat them in a manner that could be viewed as disrespectful, without knowing it. I’m not sure how the Bible and it’s passages/teachings come into play. Depending on the importance of the religioius tradition, it could be disrespectful.
There are certainly other behaviors (wearing crosses, etc) that might fall into this area.
Ken is not a unitarian. He merely found a religion and Rev who he considers less religous than others, and perhaps more spiritual, to marry him, thereby justifying his aethiest beliefs.
Ken - I know pretty much nothing about the Unitarians, but I’m struck by the term “meetinghouse.” I went to quaker school growing up, and the “meeting for worship” took place in the meetinghouse. but that’s also where people met to talk business. yes, it’s where people worship, but according to quakers (or at least according to the early quakers) no one place was more holy than any other place. Kind of a reaction to the Catholic tradition of putting shrines and chapels everyplace.
I, and two of my brothers, graduated from a Quaker high school in Pennsylvania, so I too noted the reference. We even moved a Meetinghouse from Philly to our campus when I was there. Meeting for worship (mandatory) twice a week was far from a religious experience. The Quaker philosophy is very much in favor of individual relationships with God, not requiring intermediaries or sacred places. Good stuff.
Learn something about UU beliefs, then come back.
What is that, a Zen koan? There are no such things as UU beliefs. Hence their willingness to marry an atheist, and the atheist’s willingness to be married by them.
I have several relatives who did exactly that. Definitely not my style, but to each his own.
My wife and I are agnostic at best, and chose God’s most beautiful creation as the site of our wedding - a flowering garden on the riverfront lawn of a southern plantation. Live oaks, spanish moss, cypress trees, azaleas, rose garden… couldn’t have found a church that compared in beauty.
We did use a Southern Baptist minister (a personal friend) to perform a non-denominational, mostly non-religious ceremony that excluded none and welcomed all. Relatives who we asked to participate chose Bible readings (among other sources) or said prayers that they felt appropriate for the occasion. We didn’t prohibit or encourage anything in that respect: we felt that our marriage was a family event, and family members who were gracious enough to participate should contribute to our union in ways they saw fit, and with our blessing.
And we had a DJ-free reception; no “Rocky” theme-song introductions, chicken dancing, etc. We left NJ & all her quirky customs behind. 
me too!
funny.