I’m looking for a group set that routes the cables under the bars and have been looking at what SRAM is offering. Is it just me or do all of the SRAM products look really good. Aside from a VERY SMALL amount of weight I can’t tell why I should spend more money than Rival. Does anyone have real experience riding Rival and Red? Does Red have a mcuh better shifting action?
Ken
Ps. Sorry for the annoying x vs. y question.
I have several bikes with SRAM FORCE on it. I like how it shifts. I have worked on SRAM RED this year at events. The only thing I don’t like is the front derailleur. Its too flimsy and will fail early. Substitute a Force front derailleur and you will be very happy. SRAM RIVAL is the aluminum version of Force and also works very well if you are contemplating price point
petkos
I have Force on my Trek 5000 road bike and Red on my Cervelo P2C. I cannot tell a big difference between them and have not problems with either. If you check with Bicycle Doctor USA he sells the SRAM groupo at a great price. Otherwise, I would go with Force.
Rival is the best buy for sure. The two areas I’d upgrade are to the Force crankset & FD. That pairing seems to shift better than the Rival pair. I haven’t tried cross-matching (i.e., Rival FD with Force crankset and vice versa). But I do know the front shifts on Force seem a bit crisper than on the Rival.
SRAM’s biggest strength is definitely the rear der. I find them to be very trouble free. Much more forgiving of cable tension than Shimano. Overall I think Shimano’s front shifting is a bit better, but I think the rear shifting is better with SRAM, especially in terms of being forgiving of irregular maintenance, dirt, etc.
A full Rival grouppo is a great setup, but I definitely noticed an improvement in the front shifting when I swapped to a Force grouppo. I have used both Force and Rival only on my road bike. I’ve only used RED on my tribike.
Full Rival is by far the best overall bike setup for weight, price, function.
But, red does add much better brakes (centering/tension adjustability), ceramic pulleys in the rear derailleur (yeah, questionable improvement) and BB, front trim ability in the big ring (Rival doesn’t). I’d second a different front derailler as the Red’s titanium cage is a big “flexy” compared with the steel Force or Rival.
Yeah, I was just looking at the 2010 Cannondales, and the prices on the Red equipped bikes are surprising. The Hi-Mod 1 with Dura-Ace 7900 and a nice wheelset is about $2,000 more expensive than the Hi-Mod 2 with Red and a more modest wheelset.
A full Rival grouppo is a great setup, but I definitely noticed an improvement in the front shifting when I swapped to a Force grouppo. I have used both Force and Rival only on my road bike. I’ve only used RED on my tribike.
The rings are the same on Rival and Force so I don’t think better shifting is caused by the crank. If I had to guess, I’d say it was down to the deraileur, but I can’t discern between my Rival and Force FD’s when jumping from one bike to another. Did you replace the chain or switch to a different model when swapping from Rival to Force?
I have force gruppo on my road bike and recently crashed and bought a Red RD. I have noticed very little difference considering the large price difference. The biggest difference I have found for shifting is in the Red Cassettes. They rule! I have now switched everything to red cassettes, including on my racing bike, which is ultegra gruppo. The shifting improved a ton from the Ultegra cassette that was on previously.
The other thing that i’ve swapped out was all the Shimano chains and gone with PC 1090R’s. They are extremely flexible with the powerlinks if something happens on the road, they are supper light and work great with SRAM and Shimano gruppos.
A full Rival grouppo is a great setup, but I definitely noticed an improvement in the front shifting when I swapped to a Force grouppo. I have used both Force and Rival only on my road bike. I’ve only used RED on my tribike.
The rings are the same on Rival and Force so I don’t think better shifting is caused by the crank. If I had to guess, I’d say it was down to the deraileur, but I can’t discern between my Rival and Force FD’s when jumping from one bike to another. Did you replace the chain or switch to a different model when swapping from Rival to Force?
This is my assessment off of a lot of miles (several thousand) on each grouppo and a bunch of different chains. Crank stiffness could play a (minor) role.
The 09 Rival does have big ring trim adjustability and the zero loss internals for the left shifter from Red. I am running a full 09 Rival group and it works well, versus the previous group the front shifting seems significantly improved. My only complaint is that the crankset is kind of heavy at close to 900g with BB. I couldnt justify going with Red at minimal performance benefit for 3X the cost. Red does pop off shifts a little faster, but as I have always said my issue is never with changing gear, its usually that I cant pedal the gear I am in fast enough.
My only planned upgrade is the new GXP compatible Chris King BB that will be out at Interbike as the stock bearings arent great, and I threw away the ceramic Kool Aid quite a while ago.
Kevin
Do you happen to know if there is any difference between '09 and '10 Force Groupo? Seems like some great deals out there now on '09 Force.
Do you happen to know if there is any difference between '09 and '10 Force Groupo? Seems like some great deals out there now on '09 Force.
Where is there? I’d ride '09.
Ken
Different color anodizing on the '10 and also different graphics. It is my understanding that it is strictly cosmetic differences between the '09 and '10.
I have Rival shifters (alloy levers), derailleurs and cranks (alloy) on my crit bike. Red shifters and derailleurs on my light bike, Force gruppo on my daily driver and Force derailleurs, Red cranks and brakes on my TT bike.
+1 on Rival being the value buy. Weight differences between the gruppos are not enough to matter for tri’s.
I’ve had 2 Force right shifters fail. SRAM replaced both quickly and under warranty. Great service. My red brakes are etched from sweat. The outside limit screw is frozen on the front derailleu on my daily driver. Minor problems given the miles I ride (about 9000 yearly).
I like Force better, but if money were tight, definitely buy the newer Rival. If I hadn’t been in the right place at the right time and gotten the Red gruppos for $1250, I wouldn’t have bought it. It’s mighty nice, though.
I went from DA 7800 to 2009 Sram Rival this year. Lateral move performance-wise, but the price and aesthetics are both better with Rival. Yes, the chain is a little louder and there is no screw for centering the brakes, but I can look the other way on those. If looking for 2010, I might get the Force - pretty similar performance was the Rival, but lighter (mainly due to carbon crank) and looks sweet.
I have a new R3 with the full 2010 Force groupset. It’s a real looker! The drivetrain produces a little more noise than I’m used to on my tri bike (DA7800) but everything works flawlessly. So far I’m loving it.
Here’s a good article on some of the other minor updates to 2010 (some of which are beyond cosmetic): http://cxmagazine.com/new-sram-force-gruppo-2010-upgrades-shifters-brakes-adds-bb30-and-gore
Fred
I have a Rival group with a Force crank on my road bike. Have been very happy with it and haven’t noticed any problems with the Force crank/Rival FD combo. I’ve never ridden all Force for comparison.
Actually Jordan I believe Force got a bit of an overhaul to move it away from Rival and bring it closer to Red for '10. New brake calipers using the Red style castings and they lightened the standard GXP crank a bit and added a BB30 option.
Kevin
I have full RED on my TT bike (p2c), it worls really well, I have thought of using a DA front deraileur since it is tension, but so far haven’t had any problems with the FD. I also run XO on my 29er mtb and love it, probably not as nice as full XTR, but still sweet.
Actually Jordan I believe Force got a bit of an overhaul to move it away from Rival and bring it closer to Red for '10. New brake calipers using the Red style castings and they lightened the standard GXP crank a bit and added a BB30 option.
Kevin
Shows how much I know… Thanks.