A while back I did some research here on the slowtwitch forums about the benefits and detriment of doing a spring marathon in preparation for an IM. From what I read, the benefits of include establishing a great run base, extra mental preparation etc… downsides includes the recovery time that will eat into my overall IM fitness level. SO my great (or not so great) idea is to run a treadmill marathon. I figure running a marathon on a treadmill will reduce my amount recovery time required and help me better mentally prepare for another marathon (i’ve only run one).
Background:
Plan is IMWI
1 Marathon complete -a pathetic 4:30, on about 30/mpw in the 2007 chicago heat
Winter average MPW = 50
Log run pace: between 7:50 - 8:05
Last five sunday runs: w1 - 13, w2 - 14, w3 -21, w4 -18, w5 - 8
my plan for my treadmill marathon is to wear a heart rate monitor (to keep HR low) and shoot for about a 4hr marathon (I think i’m in about 3:35 -3:45 shape). Essentially making this an extremely long run…not a race. Also I plan on playing with the elevation every 3 miles or so…to change it up.
I realize this is a bit crazy…but how crazy? I’ve asked a few ppl I run with and they don’t see the benefit. However, I really don’t see the risk either. To me the mental benefit is important…as I’ve only done one marathon. Thoughts?
Finally, yes…i like to run on the treadmill…during a snow storm this winter I did 18 on the treadmill and I kind of wanted to keep going.
To simply answer the question you pose in your post title - Not no, but hell no.
There is no benefit to doing something like that, you run a big risk of getting an injury, and the recovery time is too long for your purposes, and finally…it’s boring as all get out. Yes, you did 18 and wanted to keep trucking but there is a HUGE difference between running 18 miles and running 26 miles indoors or outdoors.
I did 17 on a dreadmill. Once. I wanted to to hurl myself through the window and just get that agonizly slow death the hell over with.
But suit yourself. You’re going to anyway regardless of what anyone here says. We all do.
Log run pace: between 7:50 - 8:05
(I think i’m in about 3:35 -3:45 shape).
I agree with the others, 26.2 on a treadmill is not useful due to potential for lost training. a 3 hour run should be plenty.
I do wonder if I understand the above correctly. You believe you are in shape to run a 3:35-3:45 pace, but you run your long runs at a pace faster than 3:30 pace? Normally, it is recommended to run your long runs 30-90 seconds slower than marathon pace to teach your body to use fat effectively. A fast finish for the final 25% percent is a common training run periodically, but not running the whole long run less than marathon pace.
I did not read anything but your title…the answer is no. Are you loony? Bored? Lonely? Treadmill marathon? Where shall we send the folks with white outfits and padded rooms?
Also, FWIW, I find that treadmill running is different than “real” running. If
your race isn’t on a treadmill you don’t get the full benefit.
With outdoor you have to propel yourself forward the whole way. On a
treadmill you can propel forward and up and let the belt go under you
It is slightly different. Slightly different over 26 miles results in WAY different.
I realize recovery time is increased with a run that long. But I also think recovery time from a treadmill run would be shorter than on a run on the open road…expecially when it’s not at ‘race pace.’ And TC suggested 20 miles…is 20 that much different than 23 or 26? Do you really have that much increased risk for injury with another 6 miles?
I am not insane…just a young and zealous ex-swimmer that grew up on 20,000 days and 8000 IMs. Miles don’t (usually) scare me
Spring…i wish…march means it is still snowing here.
For one thing: you have roughly enough glycogen in your body to pull you through 2000 calories worth of exercise, which = 20 miles or so. Go beyond that and you start literally breaking down muscle tissue (gluconeogenesis, synthesizing glucose from protein). THIS IS NOT GOOD!!!
Stuff breaks down when you run long. Bones, muscles, ligaments, tendons, all have “elastic” and “plastic” points. Do you know how much force is on your skeleton with every step? It’s roughly equal to 3 times your body weight. WITH EVERY STEP. How many steps are in 20-26 miles? Anyway back to the elastic/plastic stress curves for bone and stuff - things can only break down so far until they break. And running over 20 miles or so (why is that the magic number? don’t know) you really are pushing it.
Grab a copy of ‘Advanced Marathoning,’ Pfitzinger talks about running long and over 20 (some of his training plans have 22-24 mi long runs in the plans… some of the very very high mileage ones). I’d look it up for you but my run coach confiscated my copy of that book on account of it being a “bad influence.” I was drooling over the 70-93 mile per week plan again
I have been running 70+ mpw on the treadmill for 5 or 6 weeks or so. Longest run has been 20. I’d never run 26.2 on the treadmill on account of if I run a marathon it better be an actual event so I get a legitimate time for all that effort.
And TC suggested 20 miles…is 20 that much different than 23 or 26? Do you really have that much increased risk for injury with another 6 miles?
yes. Think about it. 6 miiles at 8:30 pace is 51 minutes. 20 miles is just short of 3 hours. An hour is plenty of time to screw something up. Another way to look at it: 6 miles is almost 25% of 26.2 miles. So that lousy 6 miles is nearly a full quarter of the marathon.
ya. you are right. that probably doesn’t make sense. problem is I really don’t have an idea what type of marathon shape I am. I warm up 2-3 a little slower than drop down to about 8:00ish around depending on the run (or so the guys with the garmin tell me). I can hold a conversation at that pace and the HR seems ok. A couple of the guys I run with, ran marathons this winter and went 3:4X, however they backed off at the 1/2 'cause they are doing boston and didn’t want to trash their legs so they could jump right back into training. I figured i’m somewhere around there…who knows.
