Shiv owners (any vintage) -- can you confirm a measurement?

Triathlon Forum
1

Hey, all:
I’ve got my stack and reach #s from a fitting, and I know my general position from a current TT bike. I’m planning to get a Shiv but I’m trying to make sure the size is correct. Should be easy with knowing my current position, right?

Well, it seems that many people who are the same height or taller than me are riding frames smaller than what I was planning on getting. I know everyone is unique, but after hearing this a number of times I was hoping for some confirmation.

Can folks post their Shiv (model/year), the distance their saddle is behind the center of the BB, the distance from nose of saddle to center of pad, and the position of the pad (forward position or rearward)?

In my case, my current position is 545mm from nose of saddle to center of pads. My saddle is 5cm behind the BB center (UCI rules), so center of BB to center of pads = 495. This position is actually just a bit stretched out for me, so I was planning to get the 2012 Shiv TT in a large size. Flipping the pads means that effective reach is ~470mm.

Someone else told me that their nosecone Shiv (size 480 = medium) measures 510mm from nose of saddle to center of pads, with the nose of the saddle inline with the center of the BB. This is different from what Specialized lists on their Shiv TT geometry.

I’m trying to figure out if somehow Specialized could have quoted “effective reach to center of pads” as something other than from the center of the BB. Seems unlikely, but I’m not sure what to make of this. There are no Shivs within at least 300 miles of where I live. Specialized is closed, but I suspect they would tell me that the measurements on the website are right.

Can anyone help/confirm the sizes/measurements?

Thank you!

2

I think Pitagoras has the answer, 17 cm drop, and 51cm hypotenuse… ;D

3

I just built my large Shiv tt, uci-legal version. Size large, nose is 1.5cm behind bb, distance to center of pads is 507mm with pads in the Fwd position. Not sure if the aerobars, stem, or top tube were different on the nosecone version to make the reach different, but the stack/reach on mine are accurate to their charts.

4

They run big- get the medium.
Small-xl all have same headtube length. So you are not giving anything up by sizing down.

5

I just built my large Shiv tt, uci-legal version. Size large, nose is 1.5cm behind bb, distance to center of pads is 507mm with pads in the Fwd position. Not sure if the aerobars, stem, or top tube were different on the nosecone version to make the reach different, but the stack/reach on mine are accurate to their charts.

thank you so much! this would be spot-on with the measurements (1mm off, but that’s error in measuring).

thanks for checking on this!

6

They run big- get the medium.
Small-xl all have same headtube length. So you are not giving anything up by sizing down.

do you have your measurements?

the notion of “running big” doesn’t help me – basically i want to know if the quoted reach (horizontal) is correct. “running big” would imply that reach is understated. i tend to believe that is not the case, but if it IS the case i would love to find out.

if you can take a couple measurements, i would REALLY appreciate it!

(i’m between 2 sizes, L and XL, and i would size down in that case – but others are saying go to medium, which doesn’t seem to make sense…unless the quoted reach is incorrect.)

7

I think Pitagoras has the answer, 17 cm drop, and 51cm hypotenuse… ;D

thank you–to be clear, i want to know the horizontal reach, not the hypotenuse (saddle to pads on an angle/direct line). :slight_smile:

8

Hey, all:
I’ve got my stack and reach #s from a fitting, and I know my general position from a current TT bike. I’m planning to get a Shiv but I’m trying to make sure the size is correct. Should be easy with knowing my current position, right?

Well, it seems that many people who are the same height or taller than me are riding frames smaller than what I was planning on getting. I know everyone is unique, but after hearing this a number of times I was hoping for some confirmation.

Can folks post their Shiv (model/year), the distance their saddle is behind the center of the BB, the distance from nose of saddle to center of pad, and the position of the pad (forward position or rearward)?

In my case, my current position is 545mm from nose of saddle to center of pads. My saddle is 5cm behind the BB center (UCI rules), so center of BB to center of pads = 495. This position is actually just a bit stretched out for me, so I was planning to get the 2012 Shiv TT in a large size. Flipping the pads means that effective reach is ~470mm.

Someone else told me that their nosecone Shiv (size 480 = medium) measures 510mm from nose of saddle to center of pads, with the nose of the saddle inline with the center of the BB. This is different from what Specialized lists on their Shiv TT geometry.

I’m trying to figure out if somehow Specialized could have quoted “effective reach to center of pads” as something other than from the center of the BB. Seems unlikely, but I’m not sure what to make of this. There are no Shivs within at least 300 miles of where I live. Specialized is closed, but I suspect they would tell me that the measurements on the website are right.

Can anyone help/confirm the sizes/measurements?

Thank you!

Most people measure tip of saddle to BACK of pad, which is also an angular measure (since your saddle better be higher than your pads). Specialized measures from BB center to CENTER OF PAD in a strictly horizontal plane. All measurements on the site are correct if you measure in that way.

9

Most people measure tip of saddle to BACK of pad, which is also an angular measure (since your saddle better be higher than your pads). Specialized measures from BB center to CENTER OF PAD in a strictly horizontal plane. All measurements on the site are correct if you measure in that way.

thanks so much for confirming this, rappstar. i think this is the source of my confusion. i had told others my reach from nose of saddle to center of pad is 545mm (with saddle 5cm behind the BB) – but i measured the horizontal component of this only. i mimicked the measurements on the specialized site.

thus, others were probably thinking i was measuring the actual distance, and they scaled down my horizontal distance in their mind – and also recommended a smaller frame.

still, i’m a bit puzzled that others who are my height or taller (5’11") are fitting onto a medium. i guess they run much more drop than i do. mine’s only 12.5cm.

transferring the measurements from my current bike still suggest that i’m either using the forward position on the large or the rear position on the XL. i’m leaning toward the large. that way, if i do increase my drop over time i could more the pads closer.

i suppose an alternative is to go medium and use something like a pro missile stem setup that is longer than 75mm.

thanks so much!!

10

Heck, I know guys 5’11-6’0 riding small!

11

Heck, I know guys 5’11-6’0 riding small!

wow. very short reach? extreme amounts of drop? is this for triathlon (steeper) or UCI TTs?

just trying to imagine how this could work.

i want to thank everyone for chiming in. this forum is a great resource, and these answers – i hope – will help me determine if i can get this dream bike to work for me.

really, though…the small has 465mm of (horizontal, from center of bb to center of pad) reach. i guess that’s only 1" shorter than the large frame (495mm). in theory, i would think my UCI position with saddle further back should make me ride a smaller frame, but i guess the slacker position also means i must go with less drop to keep my hip angle open, and perhaps the two cancel each other out.

if i could ride steeper, i could ride more drop, and this would mean reach as measured in a straight line from saddle to pad would be the same, but the pads position would be further back on the bike as drop increases.

is my thinking off here?

if i dropped from 12.5cm drop to 17.5cm drop and kept straight-line reach at 560cm, then my horizontal reach would only decrease from 545 to 531mm. that means one could switch pad positions on the shiv or drop a frame size…but small still seems really small for someone 5’11-6’0. how do they do it?
unless someone has short arms/torso,

12

reach is not that short when saddle is 5cm behind bb.
drop is the same on all shivs except extra small- same size head tube on small, med, lg, xl.
I am just relaying my experience. When my team got Shivs this year almost every single guy had to drop down a size from what they ordered.

13

I’m ~5’11 and ride a med, with a compliant position. Saddle is ~6.5cm behind BB. 17cm of drop and extensions are right at 75.

14

reach is not that short when saddle is 5cm behind bb.
drop is the same on all shivs except extra small- same size head tube on small, med, lg, xl.
I am just relaying my experience. When my team got Shivs this year almost every single guy had to drop down a size from what they ordered.

thanks so much. i appreciate you relating this info. i want to be clear that i’m not questioning whether they are right – but just trying to ask a question so i can learn why they are right and why what i am seeing from the numbers is wrong.

15

It almost seemed to me like the reach to pad measurement was off by an entire size (in actual practice).

16

I’m ~5’11 and ride a med, with a compliant position. Saddle is ~6.5cm behind BB. 17cm of drop and extensions are right at 75.

thank you, carl. you are the first person who has confirmed a riding position >=5cm behind the bb.

my own issue is that i’m currently running with extensions at 80cm (when you account zipp r2c’s), which is pushing it with the morphological exception.

what were you riding before the shiv, and in what size?

are you running with pads in the forward position?

i had been sized for an XL transition in the past (didn’t go with it). so…wrapping my head around how i (or someone like me) could fit onto a small or medium is tough for my little brain. :slight_smile:

what’s your reach (saddle to center of pad in straightline), carl? my calculations show 571mm for that. (=480mm for the frame’s reach + 65mm for your saddle behind the bb, 170mm drop…and computing the straight line measurement is the square root of ((480+65)^2+(170)^2).)

i’m at 560 (straight line) based on my lesser drop (125mm) but similar horizontal reach (545mm).

correct me if i’m wrong, but since the shivs all have the same stack from S to XL, then if one needs MORE drop, they basically have to go down a size, right? in order to achieve your drop you need more exposed saddle. well, scratch that – looking at the chart the smaller frames actually have a longer (a few mm) seat tube. hm.

17

It almost seemed to me like the reach to pad measurement was off by an entire size (in actual practice).

if this is actually true, then i could see the drop in size.

that’s why i was hoping some owners could measure their frames.

(carl, any chance you could measure the frame reach (horizontal) to confirm it is 480?)

rappstar is saying it is accurate, and i would tend to believe that specialized got it right (wouldn’t there be an uproar if it were not the case?).

are you saying that your friends all got their frames and then when doing a final fitting realized they needed the smaller size? did any of them compare the actual measurements to the stated measurements? any chance you could reach out to see if they remember?

i want to (have to) go off of the published measurements since i have no practical opportunity to try one before i buy. since i already ride in the aero position, this should be a pretty trivial exercise to get the right size frame, yet it is proving to be anything but.

i really appreciate the help.

18

Carl will tell you. One of the guys I am speaking of is his coach- 6’0 ended up on a small shiv.

19

Carl will tell you. One of the guys I am speaking of is his coach- 6’0 ended up on a small shiv.

this is a big worry of mine. i know all my measurements, but if a frame shows up that is somehow drastically different than what is spec’ed, then i am hosed.

did anyone go back and question the specs? this seems like a huge issue. everyone would order the wrong size.

20

80 to end of the shifter? Just position them at a non-horizontal angle and that will gain ~3cm back. Pads are rear position.

Former bike was a 54 Transition.