"SEC Team Speed" equals "SEC Team Doping"?

The Coffee Shop
1

So, I imagine that I’m not the only one who is looking through the world the lens of the cycling fan that now thinks that everyone is a doper…and it seems to me that the most suspicious sports feats these days are the ones that are disparate in their nature. That is to say…someone who is a the best climber and the best time trialists for instance….or someone who weighs 300lbs, but can run down running backs….or someone who can win the 400IM and the 100 free in the pool (by seconds over everyone else). I guess I am suspicious of attributes that are normally mutually exclusive showing up in a single person.

So it occurs to me that the SEC (and their fans) never seems to shut up about their team speed and how fast they all are….and I have to say, watching lineman run down smaller guys in the NCAA champ. game was remarkable. The Florida players were extremely fast, all over the field.

Now there are no shortage of way that one team can be faster than another team: conditioning, better local talent pool, etc. But there is one way to make a whole bunch of people on a single team faster pretty reliably, and that way is institutionalized doping. They bragging about team speed is like a red flag in the air “we’re cheating”.

I predict a MASSIVE doping bust on Southern football teams in the next few years, and the list of products is going to look pretty familiar to cycling fans….EPO, Testosterone, Steroids.

I am not making a swift value judgment here on Southern schools particularly (although Florida is known to have some seriously weak anti-doping laws), but if you are looking for cheaters….it makes sense to look at the front of the pack.

2

There is too much money involved for anyone to try a stop drug use there. It will continue on as it always has.

3

Could be. But what the heck does this mean?

although Florida is known to have some seriously weak anti-doping laws

The University of Florida (only FL school in the SEC) has weak anti-doping laws/rules? Huh?
The State of Florida? Which presumedly would apply to FSU, Miami, etc, etc.
Do states make doping laws? Huh? What?

I get it . . this is what they call a troll and he got me . . good one.

4

I read an article in ESPN Mag, and I am paraphasing here, that anabolic steroids are not illegal in Florida…or weren’t illegal up until very recently…and that was unusual for the rest of the country.

Ironically for me it was an article about the blightest clusterfuck that is the Arnold Fitness Classic -held every year in Columbus.

Yes, I am an OSU fan.
No, I do not think thay are above cheating.

5

That was another thought of mine. Money in College Football (I would guess), makes the money in cycling look like pocket change.

I don’t see why the normal cocktail of cycling drugs wouldn’t help a football player…ergo…

6

The thing to remember about steroids, is that it’s usually the below average guy that improves to average or above that uses steroids (that’s not to say anyone that is below average and improves to average or above is a steroid user, but it’s usually that type that uses).

Which conferences would fit those descriptions?

I wouldn’t even begin to guess how many college football players use steroids, but when I see a guy that went to a small college as a tight end or something and ends up as a “pro prospect” lineman, I’m immediately suspicious. I had a classmate do this and spent 10 years in the NFL, and that’s how “got it done”. When a guy is all-state in hs, all-conference in college, and good in the pros, chances are they’re just damn good regardless. When someone bursts on the scene or comes out of nowhere, you have to wonder why. Since most guys are already working hard, it’s usually not a “special workout” or a “new regimen” that’s credit.

7

Oh come on! That is a pretty ridiculous conspiracy theory. The “whole” team doping somehow? No doubt there a some college football players doping - scattered across all the NCAA (and I’m sure not just Div 1A).

Florida beat the Buckeyes in a well executed game by them and a very poorly played game by OSU.

For the record - I’m a Buckeye fan.

8

My point is that it’s odd when you have clusters of people on a team who are all fast.

…like Astana in the Dauphine…they were playing with the field.

OSU did play like shit, but Florida was a great team to be sure. OSU looked like they were in slow motion.

9

My point is that it’s odd when you have clusters of people on a team who are all fast.

Odd? Seems to me to be standard in the SEC. You play in warm weather, clear sky games week in and week out, and in a style of play that favors “fast” players.

Compare that to the say, the Big 10, whose RB’s are more “power” runners (or even mudders), and where lineman are mosters.

That’s like saying it’s odd that Iowa always has very large lineman (or Nebraska).

The SEC teams are fast b/c they recruit speed, and they have the reputations that the more talented (usually faster) players want to play for.

It’s not like the SEC recruits slower players that “magically” get fast while in the SEC.

10

Right…and that standard of speed is suspicious to me.

I think that the B10 is probably doping too, just in a more old timey way to build power and not speed.

It’s possible to be a good doping team and a bad doping team. I think cycling has taught us that. Riders go to certain teams and ‘POW’, they’re fantastic.

–
*It’s not like the SEC recruits slower players that “magically” get fast while in the SEC. *

-or is it?

…I agree that teams have specialties (Penn State LB’s, Wisconsin O-Line), but there’s too much money for doping not to be in the mix in CFB…and I just find the team speed of the certain teams to be a red flag. It’s not the only one, but maybe the biggest one. I would put USC at the top of this list, too.

11

If you want to imply doping, I think it exists, in likely decent amounts across all college football … even in D3.

But, I don’t get singling out the SEC. They recruit speed. Other conferences recruit power. Why not suggest that USC uses more steroids that the rest of the PAC 10, they always seem to be “faster” than their conference opponents.

All the factors in the SEC and style of play focus on speed.

Clearly the Texas high school association has instituted a state-wide steroid program. There’s not other explanation for how they continually turn out so many more college prospects than neighboring states. =)

How long has the SEC been a “speed” conference? Surely, in this “copycat” sports society with coaches and staff going from team to team, that a Big 10 team would “recruit” one of these coaches and install their “drug program” and dominate college football for the next decade.

I wonder how many high-school all-americans or “blue chip” recruits the SEC gets as compared to other conferences? I’m betting it’s quite a bit more. Again, they’re not getting the 100th rated DB prospect and turning him into a pro prospect. HOw many years did FSU have eventual pro prospects on the bench behind the current pro prospect (both of which were likely blue chip recruits) … and that’s FSU of the lowly ACC.

Recruits would likely rather go to South Carolina in the SEC versus going to a “better” school in another conference because they know pro scouts are going to bring a lot of attention to the best teams, and they’ll also be seen playing against those teams.

Talent collects in regions … like the PAC 10 for baseball, the ACC in basketball, etc. The best want to play against the best, and the best know where the scouts focus. Why would these players go to say, Boise ststae, where (for the most part) they’ll be ignored by the media?

If there’s steroid use in the NCAA, it’s across the board. To the guy playing back-up LB at Illinois, his performance is as important to him as the starting LB at Georgia. The thing is that the starter at Geo likely knows he has the talent to make it (or at least keep his position), the BU LB at Illinois, knows he needs a “little help”.

12

I think that they starting player at a top tier school is more likely to have someone explain how to dope correctly and administer a program than the backup at a shit school. It costs money to dope and I have to assume that if it’s happening at schools, they players aren’t funding it themselves, by and large.

The backup might be on HGH and Steroids…but there’s more out there than just those two things…a lot more. I wouldn’t count out EPO and blood transfusions for these guys. I would guess that testosterone supplementation would be bit big too to help with injuries and recovery.

13

I’m naturally suspicious (or realistic), and you’re making me look like an ostrich. =)

If the players aren’t doing it on their own, where are they getting these services done? I say that from one who was friends with a “local steroid guy” in high school … the kind of guy that sold a few steroids to pay for the weed he smoked. He was a teammate. If anyone wanted to use, they knew where to go. It doesn’t take long to figure out who to go to based on who is “in” with the steroid culture. These guys all seem to have networks, and steroid know-how isn’t as complicated as one might think. Again, checkout some hardcore bodybuilding boards and there’s a ton of information of what to take for this, what to take with this to block estrogen, what to take for this tor educe acne, how long to take this and in what amounts, etc. There’s also quite a few books regarding this. I’d be willing to bet there’s a “Jose Canseco” on most teams. The “go to guy” so to speak.

Why hasn’t a former player who didn’t go pro made a nice chunk of change writing a book about it (even anonymously)? I can think of other sports fields where guys have done this? Seriously, imagine how much attention/profit a book outlining just “how” the SEC achieves football dominance.

I’m, trying to envision Reggie Bush getting blood transfusions among other things/services without anyone noticing or spilling the beans (for profit) after he’s already in the pros and no real punishment can come to him.

I think that they starting player at a top tier school is more likely to have someone explain how to dope correctly and administer a program than the backup at a shit school.

Hypothetically, how would this be achieved? Strength-coach? Team trainer? A grad student doing hours as a trainer?

14

Perhaps a booster takes care of the details and they players come to his house or place of business. Who the F knows.

I agree that the number of people that would have to be invovled would be massive, but we see it in other sports. No one talks because everyone’s scared.

15

Where I played baseball (1 year, not a top school for baseball), there was at least one guy on the team who used. He went from getting cut one year to a masher and a starter the next, added well over 30 lbs and all his maxes improved drastically. I knew as I was in the weight room as much as he. The pace, volume etc that he could maintain in his workouts was ridiculous, and I had seen him the year before. He was also no fun to be around when he drank, and had been a nice guy the year prior. Our coach never said anything.

This was also the heyday of creatine, so that may have also played a role. I wouldn’t be shocked if a lot of guys my age end up with some liver damage as a result of using it.

We had a pitcher whose fastball from his Junior to Senior year jumped at least 5 mph, he also no longer was enjoyable to be around.

So I concur that the information is out there, and while some athletes who use may not be the brightest in the world, it’s not that hard to find the right info or person. Plus, NCAA testing is very easy to get around in most instances.

I would also agree with you that the preponderence of users of steroids aren’t at big time programs, but HGH is probably the go-to for the SECs of the world. I don’t even know if the NCAA tests for that.

16

I have to wonder if drugs for speed would make sense at the NCAA level. We know sprinters at the world class level may take drugs, but these guys are sub-10 second 100 meter guys, and the competitive advantage they are looking for is maybe .02 seconds or something like that. While this may be a factor in world class track and field, running straight line, I’m not sure it would matter so much in NCAA football.

I suspect they are HGH and other drugs, but more for strength and recovery. Obviously, speed can be impacted by either of those, but there are more traditional ways to work speed that would likely have a greater impact for many of these guys than steroids would. That is, unless they are already wicked fast and looking for that .02 second advantage…

17

I see endurance-style doping helping in the 4th quarter of hot games -or for WR’s or DB’s that basically run 40 yards at speed every play. Being able to catch your breath faster then the other guy is never a bad thing in most any sport.

I think that a lot of doping exists to allow much harder training, not just performance on game/raceday. I will also add that I think that this doping to train is one of the reasons that dopers are so sure they haven’t cheated. They feel like they deserve it because they did work their asses off…albeit with the help of drugs.

18

A football player at our school, a strong safety, on the day of the “powerlifting competition” (for FB players) skipped the preliminaries, walked in, full-squatted 545 (school record) and walked out. His "vitamin program was well-known. All for naught, career ended with a neck injury (non-paralyzing).

19

I think that a lot of doping exists to allow much harder training, not just performance on game/raceday. I will also add that I think that this doping to train is one of the reasons that dopers are so sure they haven’t cheated.

I have talked about this before. This is the reason why some of my buddies have used steroids (for private, non-competitive use), they are simply basement behemnoths or garage gorillas. If they aren’t able to train, or train with lighter intensity, they simply don’t know what to do with themselves. Taking steroids allowed them to complete intense workouts on multiple consecutive days. Of course they got bigger and stronger. Progress in the gym is directly related to the number of progressive workouts you can strong together. Most of the rest of us have to have sufficient rest days in between.

Also, being on “cycles” made it easier for them to take light weeks here and there for their joints to recover. The steroids helped their muscles recover, but tendons and ligaments are different animal.

Not to get this debate started again, but when I hear of athletes that are famous for “outworking everyone” (even the drug users), I’m suspicious. When I read Armstrong’s book and he wrote of “riding standing up” b/c his testicles were swollen to the size of oranges. When I read that and saw the desire to train, and based on that same desire/committment in people I knew, my first thought was “profile of a steroid user” (well, I mean first thought after I envisioned orange-sized testicles.) Fair or not, that’s what I thought.

Many steroid users aren’t looking for a shortcut, the just have a"unhealthy" desire to train all the freakin’ time.

20

Drugs for speed make sense in football- get the jump on a guy off the line and you go to the endzone untouched, vs. a 5-yd gain. About 8-10 years ago I remember hearing that one of the biggest problems with the baseball steroid users was that their newly powerful muscles were ripping apart their connective tissue. Add in the stress of all the cutting, dodging, and being hit of football, and I’d be willing to be something that keeps your knees from blowing apart would be the hot ticket in football. Do all the HGH and “recovery” drugs do this?