The basis for the dedicated Tri bike is pretty well established i think. Better handling for the forward position which decreases aerodynamic drag (especially important when riding in a non drafting race) and the added benifit of muscle recruitment that allows for better running off the bike.
Now it has also been stated that the steep seat angles do not benifit all riders for whatever reason.
Also ITU riders are still riding slack. Now I know that they donot have to deal with the aerodynamic issues due to drafting, and those watts do tend to pile up over races with bike legs over 25 miles.
Finally the question(s). 1. How does one know that they are not meant to ride steep? 2. How are ITU riders affected by slack ST angles, or do they not care so much because of the short distances that they are riding and running.
These questions are ultimately geared toward my long recovery and building of a new bike. Over the course of the next year or two I will be forced into shorter distances (oly and maybe a 1/2 in a year or two) and i have begun to wonder if I need a dedicated Tri rig or if I woudl be better served by an ITU style rig liek a Soloist or a Vortex with shorty bars and deep section rims.
That is a great question. I went through it for 2 YEARS. For me, I raced an entire year mostly on a tri bike (Guru) and road races (Vortex) and switched around some with the Vortex in tris. Next year, raced everything from road racing to tris (sprint to IM) on a Soloist Carbon (as aggressive as possible for tris). This year road race on Soloist and tris (again sprint to IM) on a tri bike again (Planet X). I now know for sure what suits me best (again, factoring in the added fitness from year to year, weather, yadda, yadda).
How else to know? I have no idea. Only took me a little over 2 years to figure it out!
I have been riding steep for years now. My Blue T-12 has the multi-position seatpost and I have it set up for steep riding. My bike prior to the Blue was a 650 wheeled, 78 degree setup with the saddle forward so I was riding about 80 degrees. I have been considering adjusting the seatpost to the mid-level steepness (around 76 degrees) and actually raising my bars up one spacer so that my position would not be entirely “Slowtwitch Approved” anymore. I have some clip-on aero bars on my road bike and have been riding my regular routes as fast or faster on it than my TT bike that has way better aerodynamics, components, wheels, and is lighter … which has gotten me thinking of an experiment in position modification to a slacker angle, slightly less-aero position that allows me to generate more power. I’ll likely be making that change over the next day or two and fortunately, the bike that I have allows changes to position and experiments like this to be done very easily.
After five years of riding steep on a QR Kilo and Cervelo P2K I’ve just made the swap to a dual purpose Kestrel Talon. Best road bike AND tri bike I’ve owned.
I’m actually a bit faster on the Talon in the 76ish position than I was steep. More importantly I’m one heck of a lot more comfortable. I always had neck and crotch issues on the other tri bikes. They’re completely gone now, which may explain the performance gain.
I’ve never found that riding steep changed how well I ran off the bike. IMO, the only reason to ride steep is to rotate your body around the bottom bracket to maintain an open hip angle while laid out on the aerobars, thus allowing you to drop your front end down and get your chest out of the wind.
It appears to me that triathlon’s recent obsession with power has diverted people away from achieving the most aerodynamic position possible. Who cares how much power you generate when the bottom line is really speed? They don’t give awards to the guy who generates the most power.
How steep you need to ride ought to be a fairly easy experiment. Just move your seat forward or back on the rails and then see how it feels when going hard. I recently borrowed a P2C and by using a Profile Tri-strike (a very long saddle) was able to get the nose out to about 4 cm in front of the bb where I normally ride. When I moved to the back of the saddle it was much more shallow than I would ever ride with that much drop (about 24cm) and it constricted my hip angle to the point where power loss was very apparent under hard pedaling. When I scooted back up to hang off the end of the nose then I could really hammer again. I raced it once that way and rode in excess of 25mph on a course will rolling hills and wind. On the race pics I noted that most of my helmet was below the top of my back.
For ITU riders in a pack there is no need to ride with a lot of drop because they are in a pack and visibility and control are a big deal. Aerodynamics are far less important unless you plan to break away from the group. Thus, they don’t really have any reason to ride steep.
In the end, I think riding steep and low is really a question of how motivated you are to go fast. If you want to be fast then work towards achieving a flat back with a low head position and then adapt yourself to it until you can ride it well. Don’t have expectations it will be remotely comfortable.
I would always recommend having two bikes. Your tri bike is there to ride steep, low and hard. The road bike is there for long rides, recovery rides or when you go out with a group. One bike cannot do two things well, despite what manufacturers will try to tell you and sell you.
What did all of you do about the head tube heights? especially you rod? I feel like I ride an aggressive position on my roadie, but the HT is like 18cm and the ht in my tri bike is 10cm. I ride about the same drop on both right now.
Could I go to an all purpose bike and split the difference on the drop?
"Could I go to an all purpose bike and split the difference on the drop? "
The Kestrel Talon has a relatively short head tube (for a road bike). It’s shorter than the Cervelo Soloist. I ride it without spacers in the tri position and I’m happy. Not as low as my Cervelo was, but that’s my point - I’m now riding a bit slacker and higher for more comfort and power. You can also get a negative angle stem if you want to get lower.