Here in Ontario Canada we have several races with an “elite age group/amateur wave” which works really well as we head out with the pros. You always know where you stand. At Wildflower in 1996, they had such a wave, but I did not know about it. Wish I did as I was ~50th overall including the pro field (and missed a kona slot by 8 seconds to a dude who raced elite amateur). In the North Carolina Tri series, they have an elite Masters wave that heads out with the pros and based on my discussion with those folks who race in that wave, they love it, but on the flip side, they are ineligible from USAT points from those races.
For the races in the middle of the summer when wetsuits are not needed we should all start together with a 1.5 mile run, then the swim followed by another 1.5 mile run to the bike racks, Bike, and complete the race with a 4 mile run to the finish. This way the fastest will finish first and it will be far less likely that your swum over by some Neanderthal who thinks its funny to swim over folks during the mass start (only to be passed during the bike).
Dave from Va
"At Wildflower in 1996, they had such a wave, but I did not know about it. Wish I did as I was ~50th overall including the pro field (and missed a kona slot by 8 seconds to a dude who raced elite amateur). "
You hit it on the head why USAT doesn’t rank athletes in elite waves with the rest of their age group- there is an unfair advantage.
I personally like an elite wave, but I also don’t think it’s fair in terms of ranking an “elite” who gets to race on a clear course against the best competition in the race in with the rest of their age group who may not know about this wave or feel they are worthy. I also see lots of people in this “elite” wave who’s head is bigger than their legs if you know what I mean. So, if you want to win the race, race in the elite wave; if you want to place higher in USAT rankings, race in your age group (especially if the fast guys are in the non-scored elite wave).
Unfortunately, we have a race director here who has an elite wave and then turns in results to USAT with everyone in their respective age-groups, circumventing the USAT rule.
That is a pretty good idea. Related to this, have you (or anyone else) ever done any Olympic distance triathlons in this format: 1.5 k swim / 10 k run / then 40 k bike??
I have done a few races like this in Northern Calif and Nevada and, as a result, I found that I liked this format the best as you still have all the speed in your legs when you run. You can really run fast and then, when you get on the bike, you can just ride all the way to your max speed, knowing that when you are done, you will be done with the race.
I also think that most triathletes will have faster times for the whole tri with this type of format than with the traditional swim-bike-run race. A side benefit is that there is a lot less drafting potential, as the field is pretty strung out by the time the bike leg starts.
I agree that ranking first-wave racers against racers in other waves is probably not fair. How about having an “elite amateur” category for the USAT national rankings and reverting back to mandatory age-groups only for athletes trying to qualify for Worlds in races that are qualifiers for the the Age-Group World Championships?
I also agree that many people in the elite waves have “heads that are bigger than their legs”. But all the entrants in elite waves don’t have to be overall winners–they could be just racers aiming for the top 20 to top 50 overall or so. I actually think its even fine if a pretty slow triathlete seeds themselves in the elite wave, AS LONG AS they can swim fast in open water (about the same speed as the elite triathletes). Because after the swim is over, they really won’t be a hazard to anyone.
I wonder why the USCF uses ability based categories (and the masters categories) and the USAT uses all these endless age-group categories?
Just replying in general, but perhaps the name “elite” wave should be changed to “open” wave. I think anyone should have the right to race with the best if they want. Some races have nothing to speak of in the way of talent in some age groups, and you never know where you stand till the printed results come out. Also, I cant belive anyone pays attention to the so called USTA rankings. If someone races in a low ability/non interested area of the country and places high in results, does anyone believe that makes them better than the 30th place finisher in a place like San Diego?
Yes, the “elite” name is lame and arrogant, but someone other than me came up with it. But I think that many other governing bodies use the “Open” designation and that is the way to go. Perhaps ‘experienced’ would be good choice also, just to discourage people that have never raced in open water from getting flailed or drowned in a fast open water mass start.
The London Triathlon in 2003 had a Sub 2:30 category. This was for AG athletes who have done sub 2:30 in a previous race (you had to submit race and time – same season). The other benefit was that the Pro racers raced into central London and turned at Big Ben, all the other AG racers had to do a local circuit. The Sub 2:30 category followed the same route as the Pro racers with the obvious exception of being non-drafting. This made for some awesome fun and racing…
BTW London is now the 2nd biggest Triathlon in the World.
I’d like to see an open wave in more races. It gets really tedious, every race I do I’m in the last or second last AG wave, and have to spend the whole race fighting through the crowds. Though I agree with USAT’s position, those who race in this wave shouldn’t be eligible for AG points or awards, since it would be a significant advantage. But it would give the faster guys a choice, do the open wave when trying for a PR, or the AG wave when racing for AG-placing-gratification…
"I wonder why the USCF uses ability based categories (and the masters categories) and the USAT uses all these endless age-group categories? "
Because triathletes seem to need the ego gratification of having a piece of plastic to take home. Perosnally, I think triathlon would be a lot better off by getting rid of all the T-shirts and trophies. Put the money into more cops on the race course, better post race food, or cheaper entry fees.
As for the USAT ranking point, who really cares? The numbers reflect that an athlete raced a lot, not that they have any extraordinary ability. And you don’t get cash or even trophies (gasp!) for your ranking. So what’s the big deal? Ego gratification?
Actually I find the elite wave mostly annoying. I did a race in the fall with an elite wave that started first. All well and good. Except the elite wave was larger than the 34 and under men’s wave! WTF? My time was faster than 1/2 of the elites and I’m NO elite. To add insult to injury, this was a USAT race, but the race director still threw the elites into the age group awards and USAT points. So I was 2nd out of the water in my AG, no one passed me in my AG on the bike or run and I got 5th in my AG! Gotta love it.
Nearly every other race I’ve done in the last two years has had an elite wave starting first. I can’t think of a race I’ve done where first across the line wasn’t 1st overall on time.
The elite wave has it’s merits, but there needs to be some sort qualification for it. Joe Schmoe with an Ego has a little trouble with self-seeding I’ve discovered (about 1000 times over!).
Reminds me of the 5 mile run I did in Seattle that was self-seeded. I started in the front of the 2nd wave and promptly passed about 1000 people within the first mile! I finished within 10 seconds of my seed time.
Say NO to self-seeding.
Yes, the open or elite wave results should be kept separate from age-group results and rankings, no doubt about it. But, like others who have posted, I really think the USAT age-group rankings are fairly meaningless in the real world.
Doing an open/elite “under 2:30” or even an under 2:20 or under 2:10 wave is also a great idea. You would have to verify your time at a previous race. But a downside of this would be that many races do not follow the full Olympic distances, so a time from those races might not mean that much. Another downside would be pssibly more bureaucracy, delays, and paperwork for race directors. Nobody needs that.
Self seeding is simpler, but like everything, it has upsides and downsides…
The USAT rankings take an athlete’s 3 best performances, each race being graded based on the size of the race and the quality of the field and then the finisher’s time being calculated as a percentage of the top amateur finisher’s time. So it does not matter how many races a person does as long as they have done 3 USAT races and the race director turns in the results. They are important to many people as getting All-American or Honorable Mention can look good on a resume for sponsorship. As far as ego gratification, I think we all have a bit of an ego in the sport of triathlon, it comes with the territory, and the fact that we have chosen to come talk about this sport here means that it is an important part of our lives. So far as elite waves, I think there should be an entirely different class at ALL races offered to those who are up for a challenge but aren’t fast enough to be racing with professionals. Peoples’ heads aren’t necessarily “bigger than their legs,” as someone put it, they are simply trying to challenge themselves, which is the whole point of racing triathlon in the first place, so maybe you shouldn’t come down hard on them. If you don’t want to RACE a triathlon then go out and DO a century ride or something similar, and good on 'ya for getting off the couch.
You beat me to it! Well said. 
Obviously, the comments about the value of the USAT rankings were made by someone not clear about the program…or perhaps someone who ranks lower than they think they should 
While the rankings are not the holy grail, they are important to many for just the reasons you mentioned, as well as to monitor year to year progress.
G
It has been my experience over the past two seasons that the elite waves I have entered here in Wisconsin and environs needed more participants. None were crowded, most were just plain lonely after a few miles on the bike. The more I think about the elite waves, the more I worry that USAT’s fun rankings have the unintentional, I suspect, effect of sending elites back into the age-group waves. I don’t think this doesn’t benefit anyone.
The advantage of the elite wave to those who choose to enter them, in my limited experience, is not so much a clear course but the presence of a gaggle of other athletes with similar abilities. The advantage to those athletes in the AG waves is that the racers who have come out on top of their AG in the past have been mopped up by the elite wave. It’s no fun to win an AG if you showed up expecting to win. It is fun, however, to place third in you age group and win a coffee mug for the first time.
By not accepting elite-wave times, the USAT has sent some former elites back into AG waves for the points, and more back following them in search of competition. As the level of competition drops off in the elite wave, racers, particularly those in the male 25-40 age groups, stand a good chance of finding a better race in the AG rather than the elite wave. When I choose to enter an elite wave, it is for the competition, not the clearer course.
I entered the elite wave of a race last summer in which I was the first one across the finish line, though I knew someone started in a wave 10 minutes behind me who was usually faster than me. He wound up beating my time by 30 seconds, and the next place in our AG by 10 minutes. So should I have dropped down to my AG, or should he have entered the elite wave? It’s not wrong for anyone to stay in the AG wave to collect a USAT ranking, but it leaves out those racers who are looking desperately for head-to-head competition, and it makes it harder for up-and-comers in the AG to have a good day and win a spot on the podium. It seems to me that the clear course provides a real but small advantage to the elite wave and the USAT has disproportionately weighted this factor in their decision not to allow scores from elite waves.
-Mark Harms
I like the idea of having an elite wave.
What USAT could do is similiar to how one gets a pro card. You must qualify by finishing in the say top 50 at nationals, top 100 at worlds or be ranked in the top 30, 50, 70 whatever number in the end of year USAT rankings. Your annual license would need to relfect that as well so you couldn’t drop back to AG at races like Chicago or nationals. If the elite category is offered you have to race it and are not eligiable for AG awards.
Back in the 90’s tons of races had a pro/elite field. Anyone could register for it. I’d go 1:57 for an oly and someone else would go 2:48. I liked the elite classification back then b/c I was able to race in pro fields w/out a pro card and also earned tuition and beer money now and then.
I don’t like the way that the elite age-group wave is set up at the Ontario races the past few seasons. You have to have finished in the top 10 overall in one of the Trisport races to get included in the elite wave which is fine. The problem with it is that the actual elite fields have not been large enough to warrant their own waves so the first wave is typically elite man and women and men under 30. When you add in another 15 or 20 fast age groupers into the mix it just makes the wave more crowded and so much for the “clear path” compared to starting back in your regular wave. I have yet to race as well entering this wave compared to staying back with my age-group peers in a later wave. I have also found that since moving into the over-30 crowd (I race in the 35-39 now) that my fellow competitors seem to be more sportsmanlike at the swim start than the younger group (probably mature/experienced enough to realize that taking it easy for a second or two and going around someone will ultimately result in a faster swim split than engaging in mortal combat in the open water!) so my swim times are better starting in the later waves as well. Next season I probably won’t race in any elite age-group waves unless they truly make it a wave consisting only of the potential “top 30-50” finishers in the race.
I stand corrected on the USAT ranking issue. Has it always been that way? As someone who rarely buys a 1 year license, I do not usually show up in the rankings, but I have noticed in the past that comparatively slow athletes who race a lot often end up ranked higher than faster athletes. Perhaps the faster guys are not getting in their 3 sanctioned events?
As for sponsorship value, I have to question that. The only way to find out the ranking is to look in the special USAT issue at the end of the year. If I’m a company looking to sponsor an athelete, I want a guy or girl that gets media exposure (TV, newspaper, magazine, etc.) with my name on them, or somebody that is going to send people to buy my products. A tri-shop will see a greater return on sponsoring a mediocre Dr., physical therapist, or tri-club president than they will on a surly 21 Y.O. near the top of the USAT/USCF rankings. I work in a shop and I’ve seen it first hand.
The problem here seems to be “who are you racing against?”.
I like the “elite” wave but not the name - it clears the field for them and allows for a lot less complaining at the end. Elite or Open should start together only if they are racing each other and no one else - no AG benefits, etc. No big deal for a certified “elite” racing AG on a given day if he/she choses to do so depeding on their goal for that particular race.
I did a race a couple of years ago that refused to write the ages of athletes on the calf - a lame attempt to let political correctness into the sport. Now that’s hard to tell who you are racing against. The tris mentioned by the original poster - local Oly, etc. - are a combination of several individual “races” all on the same course. Elite should simply be one of them. The problems come in when folks are forced to race against athletes that are not in their wave, especially when something in on the line - Kona spot, money, etc.
Steve
Alan, true, but if you drop a fast time from another race, and flex your shaved legs to the ladies running the registration even a poser like me can get into the Trisport Elite amatuer wave. Truth be told, I prefered having a clear road in Muskoka rather than starting in the 35-39 draft fest and having to weave through all the slower 30-34 and 20-29’s. Now hopefully, next year, I won’t have a separated shoulder 4 weeks before race day and I can have a respectable enough swim to benefit from the rest of the so called “elite” competition :-), rather than being spit out the back out of the chute and having to kill myself on the bike and run !