This subject deserves its own thread. It’s been touched upon in two active threads but is an issue that should be aired on its own.
With the recent death of Pope John Paul II and the election of Pope Benedict XVI there is a trend to bash everything Catholic.
I find it appalling that many on this forum are so eager to bash a religion freely without cause or justification. The beliefs within the religion aren’t popular among those who bash it so they label them as wrong, unjust and overbearing.
For people who claim to be so peaceful, open minded and “liberal” they feel the need to criticize a religion.
Brian, you are been goaded and are making yourself a target by not being able to present logical, progressive case for your view. I am sure that if you acceptaed and asked for understanding of other people’s points of view you would get a more understanding response. Don’t take this the wrong way but you seems to only reiterate your comments and fail to support them with a reasoned discourse.
Thank you for critisizing a group of people that have created and contributed to a charity benefiting those less fortunate.
Brian, you are been goaded and are making yourself a target by not being able to present logical, progressive case for your view. I am sure that if you accepting,and attempted to be more understanding, of other people’s points of view you would get a more understanding response. Don’t take this the wrong way but you seems to only reiterate your comments and fail to support them with a reasoned discourse.
“I find it ironic that those very same people who contribute to worthy causes defame and mock a particular religion based on its teachings and beliefs”
I find it ironic that this sort of thing is only upsetting when it’s about Catholicism, but not Islam or any other belief system. Then it’s perfectly ok to lump everyone into one group and to mischarecterize their beliefs.
give me a break. If you insist on posting a new Catholic thread every day, you should expect a few dissenting opinions.
Dissenting opinions and dixourse is fine. Outright hatred and condemnations that the church’s teachings and beliefs are wrong is intolerance which is freely practiced on this forum.
As a Christian you might know that Jesus said you will be persecuted for your beliefs, so just look at is as another prophecy that is coming true. Not that it is any different than it has ever been, non-Christians and non-believers have always questioned Christianity, just like non-Jews and non-believers have always questioned Judaism, just like etc etc. This isn’t a new trend in history, its almost always a constant.
However, I don’t think you or your religion are truly being persecuted. Some of the questions that have come up are people’s opinions on parts of the Catholic church and Christianity that they don’t agree with, they are allowed to not agree, and they are allowed to say they think the Church should change. Their cause or justification is that it is their opinion, they don’t need to be personally attacked by Catholicism to have a right to disagree and express their opinions (same for you too). But as you or another have responded to them with, the Church doesn’t/shouldn’t change just because people don’t like its views and traditions. Criticism of any belief is to be expected, and sometimes embraced. When people ask you questions and you can answer them in an insightful manner you are helping the Church, possibly even answering Jesus’ call to spread his word. If you don’t think Catholicism’s beliefs are wrong nor unjust nor overbearing explain it to the people and try and help them understand your view point. Obviously you don’t have to do it 40 times a day, so share it once, maybe even save it somewhere so you can copy and past it in the future. Share some resources that people can go read on their own about it.
I think there is a similarity in how you feel about many people on this board and their views towards Catholicism, and their views on how Catholicism views them. I know you, and others, feel very strongly about your views (and that’s great). And I’m not trying to belittle you, and I know it is very frustrating for you, but I’m hoping there is a way that instead of us people on the board always fighting that we can try and individually do our part to share positive information and help others understand why we believe what we believe, which doesn’t mean they have to agree, but just to understand.
And finally, I’m sorry you feel attacked. I bet if you look around besides this board you’ll find many people are excited about the new Pope (Catholics and non-Catholics alike). I work with many Catholics and it was really nice to see them so excited yesterday after the news broke, running around talking to each other, calling family and friends.
how about you making fun of the French? didn’t your lord tell you to be a nice boy to your neighbor? or do you practice only when it is convenient?
don’t talk about hypocrisy either, because the Roman Catholic Church is not in the right position to do so…(if you want an example, ask the jews what they think of Pius XII).
Besides, you seem to not see the MAJOR difference between a Religion (and I believe as I said several times that a lot of the teaching of the Christ (whether I believe he is born out of nowhere etc or no) are key to a good life) and the Church associated with this religion.
You sound so surprised that there is hatred toward the Catholic church. Read your history books, every religion has been attacked or the attacker since forever.
Be willing to acknowledge the failures of the church past and present as well as the accomplishments. Thre is no yin without a yang.
Very well stated. And as Francois wrote above, one of the primary tenets of pretty much all religions out there is love thy neighbours/do unto others/reap what you sow/etc. Let’s all keep that in mind shall we? You don’t have to like religion X but you shouldn’t feel free to slam it. If you can’t say anything nice…
LMFAO at this post. Didn’t the Jesuits help you develop thicker skin than what you’re exhibiting here? “I’m a poor little Catholic and nobody likes me.” Jeeesssuuusss!
Differentiate between religion & the church & then there is room for your discussion. Personally, IMHO, the new pope is more of the same that we’ve come to expect out of your church: 500 years behind the times. Just look at the co-written pronouncements by Benedict & JP II against homosexuality as an example. While Christianity as a religion may be about tolerance to all, the Catholic church has rarely been about those ideals. And the fuckwits on the religious right are the ones preaching their own brand of hatred. Come up with a reasoned argument of your own defending their positions & then we’ll have something to discuss.
Brian nobody is above criticism, least of all the Catholic Church. You seem to be against anyone who has anything negative to say about your Church wether it be true or not.
I don’t feel picked on nor can I not take the heat. I find it funny that on one thread people of this “peaceful tribe” claim to be so open and tolerant of lifestyles, attitudes and the like but when a leader of the largest Christian religion is getting press and in the spotlight they suddenly feel the need to cast stones and disparaging remarks about someone who has dedicated their life to Christ.
Memo to Brian: This is Tibbs’ Lavendar Room, which exists to allow people to get into crazy debates about religion, politics, and other things you aren’t supposed to talk about at cocktail parties. People here disagree about everything, including the time of day.
As noted earlier, the reasons there is so much contested discussion about the Catholic Church are (1) it has been in the news constantly, and (2) you and a few others here keep bringing it up. If people kept bringing up Islam, Judaism, Janeism, Buddhism or anything else, I would ask just as many difficult questions. Perhaps this is because I was raised in a culture (Reform Judaism) that encourages children to question everything. (I honestly think this is one reason Jews tend to do well in school. It is definitely a reason why there are so few of us and why so many of us are agnostic (not to mention left-wing).)
It occurs to me that you don’t like this because you see it as a direct challenge to your faith and, therefore, view it as “hatred” or “bashing.” As many people on this board have pointed out, if you have faith, you don’t need to worry about these debates. Maybe your faith is not as strong as you would like it to be, I don’t know. I certainly am unqualified to say, as I have no historical background for understanding that kind of faith.
Hard questions and providing answers is no problem. The hypocrisy lies when people go outside of the natural questioning and turn towards intolerance, hatred, and mocking that goes beyond being humorous.
As I said before, I don’t feel threatened or hurt regarding the content. However I will point out that such discourse is hypocritical in nature and reflects poorly on those who make comments that are only meant to be cruel.
I will point out that such discourse is hypocritical in nature
More or less hypocritical than being both a chest-thumping, liberty-spreading Iraq war supporter AND a hard line Catholic who abides soley by the Church’s teachings and doctrine?