Pacing Advice - 1/2 marathon - RESULTS

Triathlon Forum
1

Well, got some good advice from lots of people here. Wish I had done a better job executing on it though.

Was shooting for a 1:25 yesterday, even though I thought it was a bit of a stretch. Woke up to conditions that were absolutely horrible for fast times (windy & humid), but started off with great legs.

First three miles was basically into a headwind coming off the ocean, and I started off just running ‘comforatble’ which turned out to be 6:34, 6:33, 6:42 (over a bridge in mile 3). Legs felt awesome, but it was too fast into that headwind even though I tried to stay tucked in behind people. Ran miles 4 and 5 right at 6:35 with a cross/slightly helping wind and then decided to start to move. Mile 6 was a 6:23, Mile 7 was a 6:25 and both felt fine but we started to head back into the wind and the pack I was running with during mile 6 and 7 broke apart. I pushed to stay up with two people who I know have run 1:25s and kept just off the back until mile 10 when they started to pull away and I sort of started to suffer with some 7 minute miles into a very strong headwind. Really had nothing left in the last mile and was just trying to hold on to the finish.

Wound up with a 1:28:55, which is a huge PR for me but left me a little disappointed as I really felt I was fitter than that. The fast early miles into the wind and some of those 6:20s to catch up to a group I thought would be good to tuck in with going into the wind really cost me in the last few miles. However, after looking through the results I found that most people were between 2 - 3+ minutes off their times from last year (winner was exactly 3min slower than last year) or a recent 1/2 time, which makes me think 1:26 low was possible on a better day and maybe 1:25s would be doable with a smarter race.

I did learn a lot from the race both for pacing and future training. Big thing is that conditions can make a huge difference and I have to do a better job taking those into account. I also think I dropped off my mileage about a week too early, and probably didn’t spend enough miles at tempo pace. My running is a work in progress though, and I know I didn’t have an ‘ideal’ build up for this race as mostly this winter has been about building a base for tri season with a few running races thrown in. I think with a solid year of consistant running (would really be my first ever) I can move a lot closer to where I’d eventually like to be and where I think my potential is as a runner (not a ‘real’ runner but a triathlete who runs :)).

Thanks to everyone who chimed in.

Original Post -

As part of the 100/100 challenge I signed up for a few road races this offseason to help with motivation to keep my going through it. Well, my big target for the offseason is this weekend, and it will be my first ‘open’ half marathon and I’m really not completely sure how to pace it…or whether my goal time is even feasible, although I think I’m close.

Basically, I’d like to give myself a decent shot at going 1:25:00 without blowing myself up. My run training this offseason has been focused around the 100/100 challenge and I’ve been doing about 6-8 runs per week with an average week right around 40-45 miles. Most of those have been just steady miles, although my ‘steady’ pace has gotten faster as the weeks have gone by. I now find myself running comfortable 7:30’s for everything up to even my longest run of 15 miles. I’ve done a handful of tempo runs over the last few weeks after I got my mileage built up without a problem and was running right around 6:20 - 6:30’s for those. I’ve done a few hill workouts but have yet to get to the track for any real ‘speedwork’ cause I didn’t think I was quite ready for it and knew I needed to get my miles up without worrying about injuring myself. I have done 2 5k races and brought my pr down by 40seconds from last year even though I pretty much trained right through my most recent one (18:38 about 3wks ago).

I’ve thought about just going out and trying to run even 6:30’s the whole way, but I don’t know if that’s too lofty a goal based on my recent 5k time. Looking at McMillan’s calculator, my recent 5k would indicate that I’m capable of about a 1:26 (low) or 6:35 pace. My other thought was to go out and run 6:35’s for the first 4 miles or so and see how I feel. If I felt strong I’d try to drop to 6:30s for til about mile 10, re-assess and then let it rip for the last 5k if I have the legs.

I tend to race better when I have a plan, so I’d like something I can stick to (and adjust if necessary) on race day and would appreciate some input from those more experienced than I.

Thanks.

2

Nothing ventured nothing gained.

If you’ve been doing all your training at a steady pace with no threshold or speedwork, I’d guess that your recent 5K time is not an accurate predictor of your half marathon potential. Also if you just knocked 40 seconds off your 5K time I’d also guess that you are on a pretty steep improvement curve brought about by your new training regimen.

You’re in a situation where its very difficult to predict with much accuracy how you’ll perform on any given day at any given distance because your body is adapting to all this new mileage. If I was in your shoes and 1:25 was an important goal, I’d run 1:25 pace. If you come up a little short, you’ll get it next time. If you decide to be conservative and run 7:00 pace and feel great at the finish you won’t really know much of anything other than you didn’t reach your potential.

go for it.

3

Being part of the 100/100 challenge as well, and being in a similar boat (not speed wise) for having few prior benchmarks: go for it. Start at the pace you need, and reassess 4-5 miles in. All I really know in comparison to last year this time is I’m faster, likely a pretty good amount. At least you have the 2 5k’s- I’ve got a NOV 5k (my 1st), and a trail 10k run at 0 degrees in a couple inches of snow, so no good recent benchmarks.

Think of it this way: even if you blow up, you’ll learn something, and it won’t take that long to recover from a half-mary. Find another race soon after and apply that newfound knowledge. This way, you can start running close to your potential and setting goals that will challenge you. One of the big benefits of this 100/100 challenge is that its giving us a huge boost, much bigger than I could have dreamed of a few years ago.

4

Start slow, finish fast. If you go out at 6:35 or 6:30, I’ll just about guarantee that you blow up. Start at around 6:45-6:50 to avoid the “happy feet” trap that always kills you when you’re stepping up from 5K… It’s that tendency to find your 5K pace because it’s so comfortable but way too fast for a half. Watch your HR and keep it in the v3+ range, about 6-10 beats below what you’d experience at a 5K. Get 5 miles in, letting yourself settle into a comfortable pace after mile 3 (6:30?). By that time you’ll have gone far enough that the “happy feet” won’t carry you away and you’ll be about 30-45 second down from your goal. With 10K left, drop the hammer as hard as you think you can sustain.

If you run the second half a minute faster than the first, you’ll have nailed it. If you go out a minute too fast (first half) you could lose 2-3 minutes on the back half, not to mention the hurt you’ll feel over the next week. Recovery from a negative split is always easier and faster

5

check this link, it is a pacing plan for a marathon, but if you cut it in half and pace it as a 5-5-5, it works very well for a half marathon
http://www.centralparktc.org/training/coach01.htm
.

6

Start slow, finish fast. If you go out at 6:35 or 6:30, I’ll just about guarantee that you blow up. Start at around 6:45-6:50 to avoid the “happy feet” trap that always kills you when you’re stepping up from 5K… It’s that tendency to find your 5K pace because it’s so comfortable but way too fast for a half. Watch your HR and keep it in the v3+ range, about 6-10 beats below what you’d experience at a 5K. Get 5 miles in, letting yourself settle into a comfortable pace after mile 3 (6:30?). By that time you’ll have gone far enough that the “happy feet” won’t carry you away and you’ll be about 30-45 second down from your goal. With 10K left, drop the hammer as hard as you think you can sustain.

If you run the second half a minute faster than the first, you’ll have nailed it. If you go out a minute too fast (first half) you could lose 2-3 minutes on the back half, not to mention the hurt you’ll feel over the next week. Recovery from a negative split is always easier and faster
Wow. That’s different advice! Have you had success with this approach? Are you able to negative split consistantly in your races? If so, you are very rare indeed. I agree on the “happy feet” issue, but I can’t imagine going out and intentionally building a hole to dig out from. I would love to hear more.

7

I recently ran my best half marathon in 10 years by going out on pace and holding it. My last 2 miles were my fastest but all miles were within 10 seconds of each other. YMMV but for me I felt like I ran a perfect race. You do risk blowing up…but I think it’s worth it if you have other race options later in the year.

8

+1 for the start slow approach. Use the first mile to three miles to warm up and calm the butterflies down, then settle into your race plan. I paced the Chicago Distance Classic this last year at 1:25 at even splits because I had to. The year before I ran a 1:16 with the first two miles at 6:45 to rein myself in, get the muscles going, and evaluate my body before letting it loose. I’m confident I wouldn’t have performed as well as I did if I had ran even splits. It’s too easy to blow up your race in the first half that it’s a much safer option to use the first miles as a warm up.

9

I happen to recently have the same experience as Keyer_Soze. After the first mile being 20s slower than final avg. pace, I hit target pace and ended up finishing with my last full mile being the fastest. Wasn’t my intention to rip the last two miles, but I latched on to a good group that came from behind. Unless you’re well warmed-up, I would say definitely allow a mile or two at a slower pace to get settled, then go to goal pace. Looking back, it was a good thing there were a few thousand people to sift through for the first mile, otherwise I think a 6:15 up the bridge would’ve bitten me later. “Happy feet” in the beginning can turn into unhappy quads at mile 10. Here’s hoping for a “cool,” dry SoFla morning eh? (I’m assuming you’re talking about A1A…I’m in for the full.) Good luck.

10

“The year before I ran a 1:16 with the first two miles at 6:45 to rein myself in, get the muscles going, and evaluate my body before letting it loose.”

Impressive and interesting. Do you recall at what rate you picked up the pace after the first two miles (was the 3rd mile sub 6?) and what your fastest mile was? Also, how much do you warm up and were the easy miles a planned part of that?

11

“Wow. That’s different advice!”

    • Negative splitting is differnt advice? You need to check who your advisors are!

“Have you had success with this approach?”

    • Always. I’ve been plagued by the happy feet in a lot of races where I wasn’t in as good a shape as I once was. So the pace that felt really good was way too fast. I think that’s good advice to the OP who has been doing a lot of LSD and might be tempted to go out too fast because it will feel great until mile 2 or 3 and start to suck big-time by mile 9.

“Are you able to negative split consistantly in your races?”

    • Only at my good ones. For me, the pace that feels good when the gun goes off is usually anywhere from way too fast to ridiculous.

“If so, you are very rare indeed. I agree on the “happy feet” issue, but I can’t imagine going out and intentionally building a hole to dig out from. I would love to hear more.”

    • I’ve had so many races, especially halves where I’ve found my groove during the first mile and found myself sucking wind by mile 9. Especially at the bigger events where you’re boxed in at the start and can’t run right away. You get the feeling that all hope of a good race is lost, so as soon as you get some daylight you immediately jump into your 5K pace
      I honestly don’t think that it’s rare. Any time one of my athletes PRs at a long race, it’s always by pacing judiciously, IOW, holding back early.
      Again, based on his statements, I saw the OP queueing the happy feet even while he was contemplating the event. Going out slow is the safest way and it’s not that tough to make up 30 seconds over the last six miles, but trying to dial it back after going out too fast just doesn’t work.
12

Thanks for your insights!
I’ve been struggling recently with some races, and this might be part of the reason. I’ve been trying to go pretty much even paced. Of course, that is much easier said than done.
It seems that people talk about negative splits, but very rarely can people actually acheive it. Regardless, holding back for a bit really does make some sense. Why speed that lactic build up any more than necessary?
When I started running a couple years ago, I really had no idea what pace I should be aiming for, so I just started out easy, and picked it up. It was great passing people through the entire race, and I still left everything out there. Yesterday, I did a half, and started out a tad quicker than my goal. It did indeed catch up with me, and I struggled massively over the last few miles - Unable to do more than trundle along. I’ll be smarter for my next race. Thanks for this thread!

13

“It did indeed catch up with me, and I struggled massively over the last few miles - Unable to do more than trundle along.”

    • If you nail the pace, running every mile the same (assuming a flat course) has merrit, but it’s a gamble. There’s a margin for error in going out too slow, but none if you go out even a little too fast. The two things that kill you at longer events are the buildup of lactic acid and local muscular fatigue. When you run faster than mid zone 2, you are using a significant contribution from fast-twitch muscles. Once these fatigue, they’re basically done until tomorrow (or at least half an hour after the race). So postponing that is crucial, and especially difficult if there are hills early.
      The LA thing is easier to deal with and can be ameliorated if you practice in training by running fast and slow miles or 1200s/1000s/800s whatever works for you. So the idea there is to push close to threshold (V4/TH pace) for a few minutes and then drop back to your long pace. Your lactate levels will yo-yo and your body gets used to operating at a higher level and at recovering, which you’ll need if there are hills. This kind of workout is definitely tough and shouldn’t be an everyday kind of thing.
      A good example of proper pacing was Cheruiyot at Boston this year where he ran a steady pace that had some buffer in it, and then blew everybody away with a ~4:30 mile with about 10K to go (and that under hideous conditions of cold wind and rain).
14

I like the 5-5-5 approach that Mike Plumb suggested…I tried it a 2 halfs so far this season. Blew it the first time, went out too fast…but the second time it worked like a charm.

15

Hello, we are taking about the A1A half right?

If so I don’t know what your current plan is but I am also looking to run a 1:25/1:26 so if you want a running partner to ease the mental exhaustion let me know. If not no big deal but I might draft you :slight_smile:
Send me a message if you are interested in meeting up.

-Jason

16

Yep, A1A half. Should be fun. I’m just hoping for light winds, as it was pretty damn breezy this morning.

Sent you a PM.

17

Mark,
If your tempo runs at 6:20-6:30 were no problem, I would not start out at 6:35s. I know you said you like to have a plan, but the best plan for this one might be to see what pace you do mile 2 at (after the initial adrenaline wears off) and then make a plan.

I also don’t think you should plan to rip the final 5K…I think you should plan to get to 10 miles and then gut out the final 5K if you want your best shot at a good time.

If it is windy, I would spend as much time as possible tucked in behind someone. Good luck!

18

Impressive and interesting. Do you recall at what rate you picked up the pace after the first two miles (was the 3rd mile sub 6?) and what your fastest mile was? Also, how much do you warm up and were the easy miles a planned part of that?

  I jogged to the start from my car which was probably about a mile then stretched with some strideouts before hopping in the the box.  The friend I was running with and I decided to use the first few miles to gauge ourselves (we were both coming off of injury) as well as use it as the real warmup.  First two miles were between 6:45 and 6:30, we had to dodge around a lot of people which probably helped keep us in check.  After that I believe we dropped to around 6:15 and 6 for another two miles before our bodies just sort of dipped below on their own.  The fastest mile was 8 around at 5:28 if I remember correctly.  We backed it off a bit after seeing that split.

I’m a big fan of running/biking or anything based on feel. Too many times I see people having a great race only to shut themselves down because their HRM goes off or another gadget tells them to back off. The fear of becoming one of those people is what’s kept me from purchasing a HRM for myself.