OT - job placement after military service

hey…i know there are a lot of military folks here so i’m hoping to get some advice.

my boyfriend was in the army for 12 years. he is a west point grad (degree is mechanical engineering). he was a helicopter pilot and lots of other stuff i don’t know anything about.

he started getting bored with his jobs in the military and decided to go private about two years ago. he’s now doing outside sales for a company that sells hi-tech stuff i also don’t know anything about - hydraulics, robotics, stuff for large scale manufacturing. he hates it.

i’m trying to help him with his job search, but i don’t have any knowledge of his type of industries. he seems to be “stuck” though in that he doesn’t seem to be very open minded about his options. i personally think it would be hard to go from a more structured set of job posts to having the whole world of options open, but i’m not sure if that’s the issue or not.

but i look at him and think he’s super intelligent (okay, maybe a little biased here), has a degree from a very respected school in a very technical field, and a lot of great military-based job experience - it seems to me like he should have a ton of options.

anybody have experience with this type of thing? recommendations on how he should network and job search? i would love to help him with some pointers to get the ball rolling. no fun to watch somebody suffering at his job!

thanks for any pointers…
~geek

He’s got good credentials so should be quite marketable. It can be tough for some military people to transition to civy street. My dad made this transition as a senior air force officer to the private sector and found it a bit difficult at first.

There are employment consultants that may help him find a job or determine in which area(s) he should be looking.

Some hints on this website.

http://www.quintcareers.com/career_change.html

If he just wants to see what his options are, almost every corporate headhunter has a branch specifically dedicated to military. Lucas Group is the one that comes to mind based on the amount of junk mail I get. As for whether or not he should be able to get a job easily, the answer is yes. Any Service Academy grad can find a job without much trouble. Whether or not it will be a job he likes is another story, and he’ll have to figure out what he wants to do before you can narrow that down.

Not for nothing, but a lot of military oficers get out and do sales and hate it. He might want to look at something outside the sales realm.

What part of the country is he in? Is location flexible?

I live in DC and there’s a huge demand for former military folks working for government consulting firms/contractors.

I made this transition a few years ago and ended up going back to business school to smooth the process.

PM me if you want more details.

Andy

Hmmm. True.

It sounds like he has an excellent background and a world of options at his disposal. That said, you are only as good as how well you market yourself. It is a competitive job market. In our region the largest companies have either already declared bankruptcy (Delphi Automotive, Northwest Airlines, etc,) or are in serious financial difficulty (Ford Motor Company, General Motors).

The economy is in a state of substantial and developing adversity. That affects the job market.

That said, the defense sector remains robust with the U.S. deployed to over 60 countires and fighting two major wars.

Now, here’s the thing though- I think a lot of people think their job should “take care” of them and provide benefits, six figure salaries, relocation expenses, bonuses, time off, retirement, etc. That is an increasingly unrealistic expectation- especially in a volatile job market.

We get paid to work not because it is fun and rewarding. We get paid at our jobs because they are often times difficult, unrewarding, tedious and downright punishing. That is the fact of the labor market right now- hard work and decreasing rewards.

The people who can operate in this job market and work hard and selflessly will benefit later when things turn up again- and they will turn up again.

There are no (or at least, very, very few) perfect jobs. These days, if your check cashes, the union isn’t asking you to take a 35-63% pay cut (ala Northwest Airlines and Delphi Automotive did) and your employer isn’t in Chapter 11 then you are doing well.

Good luck to your boyfriend, and thank him for his fine and selfless service to the U.S. and the free world. I know I am not alone in expressing my gratitude for a difficult and dangerous job.

kittycat is the go-to person for this thread.

Good call…kitty…any advice? I can get you more details…

Thanks for all the suggestions everyone. I think it will be a big help to him to get some ideas and to recognize that this really is a huge transition and that it’s understandable to be a little overwhelmed.

Tom, I’m with you on the job thing, but I’m a big believer in finding some aspect you really enjoy, whether it be personal satisfaction, intellectual challenge, income potential…or, ideally, all three…but in this case, he’s really getting none of the above. I don’t think he’s being too picky, he just doesn’t seem to have a feel for what his options really are.

Yes, for what it is worth- I don’t make much in my job but I do enjoy almost all of it. For the most part, I love what I do and my lifestyle. As long as the bills get paid and I can ride, run, swim and travel then I am good. I don’t need the new car and new house.

Add regional airline Mesaba Airlines to the list of bankruptcies as of this morning.

Check out Orion-FirstSearch they are a military specific headhunting group. the downside is they wont work with you if they have a contract with the company he is currently working for without the companies permission.

it’s good that he’s gotten some sales experience–IMO, i think everyone can benefit from that. i wonder what it is about his job that he hates. prospecting, management, having quotas, or what. if he can identify that this could help can make decisions on what to do. and in reality, it’s good for you to take interest and want to help–but remember, he will have to do this work for himself to make anything happen.

as starters, if he really wants out he needs to do his resume. if he has done that then this tells me that he is serious about moving on. if he is reluctant to do that then maybe he isn’t ready, despite being miserable. (I bring this up, because at this time of year, going into the holidays, alot of people would rather “hold on” and get through this time of the year because of holiday obligations, etc)

the bottom line is–he is smart. he will do his research if he wants to. in sales, one gets to meet a ton of people. the best thing for him to do is start talking with people about what he thinks he would like to do. talk to a GOOD executive recruiter. he also needs to do his homework and identify what he likes about his job and what he doesn’t like>this is most important. once he identifies this stuff then he can navigate from there.

i’ve read that 80% of the people working feel some real sense of dis-satisfaction in thier jobs. personally, i think this comes from people doing the wrong thing in the wrong environment. so he is not alone…most people can relate.

also, how about him doing some personality profiling on himself? if he has not done so already. The DISC is a favorite of mine, as is Meyers-Briggs, and the Enneagram. IMO i think the DISC relates most to work. He can do these on-line at his own time at a reasonable cost.

so, encourage him to do the DISC so he can learn about his working style, then have him outline what he likes and dislikes. these exercises will be very telling.

there are lots of opportunities out there, he just needs to know what he would enjoy in terms of job function and environment(to find favorable for a j-o-b. ). job function and environment are the foundations of any job, no matter the industry or title.

if he has done these things, then he should have a good understanding about himself, and be ready to speak with a reputable executive recruiter, as well as his most respected career oriented friends. his career oriented friends know people and can give him ideas, as well as referral of others to talk with. he can even write a letter to all of his friends and acquaintances that outlines what he is looking for (in general terms). also, job meetings where people share ideas and network are also terrific things to attend. at this point, networking will benefit him.

in addition, most of the job market is underground. i have clients call me and tell me to look for people for openings, and none of it is advertised. talking with people is the best way…and leveraging the best executive recruiter he can find.

in today’s world, it’s this on-line application non-sense. it’s like sending your resume out in space. i don’t know how anyone gets hired like that and believe that most of those jobs aren’t even real. if he can get refered into a company via friends or executive recruiter that is the best way. if he doesn’t know what he wants to do, then he’s got to get busy on his homework–identifying his personality traits, likes/dislikes, and then start talking to others to learn what is out there.

lastly–encourage him to be patient. the longer he works, the more he will understand what is out there. it’s called experience…not just in his job, but in business generally speaking. 2 years in is nothing. most of us would agree that at 2 years of business experience most of us knew nothing. so, it’s a win win. if he looks he can possibly get a position he enjoys more, and if he stays he gets more experience about the business world in general. the first 5 years in the workforce are all about earning stripes…personally, i think they are the hardest years in the career.

kittycat

Add regional airline Mesaba Airlines to the list of bankruptcies as of this morning.

OT: That one has me scratching my head as its parent Mair, Inc. (holding company) has cash out the wazoo but NWA has apparently not been handing over the cash Mesaba earned as a code-share partner over the last couple of months. Maybe short sided but I have got to say that it is things like this (I interviewed with Mesaba after I left the service) that I have no regrets about not leaving the aviation proffesion when I did!

Maybe better suited for the Lavender Room since this is kind of left field, but does anybody else see the trying times that the countries biggest industries (Air Lines, Automakers, Energy Industry) are trying to weather as possibly a form of “economic terrorism?” Probably a lot easier to weaken our resolve by bankrupting the country that defeating us on a the battlefield. Look what happened to the U.S.S.R. - maybe the people that fund Al Queda have taken a page out of that playbook?

kittycat - thanks for all the advice.

he is starting the process - updated his resume and is doing online searches and applications, but i agree…that is sort of an abyss. but he is getting started.

i’ve talked to him about personality tests and just generally trying to get him to talk out loud - so he thinks about it - what his likes and dislikes are in a work environment…what was your favorite job? what made you like it? that kind of thing. but this is where he seems to shut down a little. i don’t think he agrees with me on this, but it sure seems like he is just overwhelmed by options, so he starts self-limiting because he doesn’t really know what’s out there and what he is qualified for.

how do you find a good executive recruiter? i know the military had recruiters he used when he first left, but he wasn’t very impressed with them. is it best to find someone local or with specific types of clients/industries?

thanks again!
~geek

maybe he feels like a dork talking out loud about it, i don’t know. maybe if he wrote it down personally, it would be better. i don’t know his personality, but my husband can clam up too. you can’t push a person to do something. i wonder why he clams up though…

but talking with others and getting involved in some association are good places to start learning what is out there. i’m sure there is some professional association in his industry that he can be a part of. this will be a huge gateway for him to start discovering options and meeting the right people.

encourage him to take his time. the average job search takes 6 months. and since he has no idea where he wants to go it could take him ever bit of that, and maybe a touch longer. he needs to get a plan. outline 10 people to talk with within the next 2 weeks, and also research the right professional association to get into. he can get into the association’s meetings this way, start meeting people–possibly even an executive recruiter, etc. not to mention have access to the website where jobs will be posted.

as for finding the right recruiter, my advice is for him to do his research and make some phone calls. also a professional association for his industry should endorse someone. he should be spending one hour a day or every other day on this. the more he works on it, the closer he is. the more he works on it, the more he will discover what is out there.

all great advice…passing it along. many thanks!!

I situation was (and still is I guess) similar to your BF’s so I can empathize a little FWIW…

Feel free to skip if you find boring sob stories, well, boring.

I graduated from a major university with an engineering degree. Since I was in ROTC I spent my first years out of college as an officer.

I became unsatisifed with my lot soon so I decided to bail when my time came. The hunt for my first job was very frustrating but I eventually found a company willing to take a chance on me.

It’s been a few years now and I think I’m in the same boat as your BF. It’s really hard to pin down what truly makes me want to retch every monday morning, but the feeling is there anyway. Doing sales and markeing has alot to do with it, but not all.

Humorously, I consulted w/ a shrink who put me through a battery of personality and career aptitude tests. After revieing my results, the counselor looked at me and asked 2 questions: 1. What made you think you wanted to be in the military? 2. What makes you think you want to be an engineer?. These were asked rhetorically, of course.

The joke was on me I guess. And I played it on myself.

My point is that your BF should do alot of introspection and figure out what he really wants. Otherwise he is just going to keep repeating this cycle. I think he should at least take some personality and aptitude tests. They will likely not offer any solutions, but they will give him a different perspective, which is something he may need. If he doesn’t know what he wants, all this networking and resume primping isn’t going to add up to a hill of beans if he winds up in the same place.

Me, I’m trying to enact a wholesale career change and leave engineering behind. It’s a slow and tedious process. Fraught with risks (mostly financial). Many of which I probably haven’t encountered yet. And it’s somewhat dispiriting leaving behind all that was emotioanly invested in my previous career choices. But when it’s just not working, ya gotta do something.

There doesn’t seem to be alot of useful info in what I’ve written. Sorry about that. Just remind him that he’s not alone in his struggle.

marty–i really believe too many people are in the wrong thing. it takes balls to move on to something that is fullfilling…especially in the midst of leaving a big salary/nice income. but i did it, and know people who have done it, and in each case, has been a fanstatic decision.
keep the faith baby!!!

thanks for the post…sorry to hear that it’s hard on you, but sounds like the changes you are making will be very worthwhile for you in the long run.

totally agreed on the introspection - and that’s hard stuff - looking at who you really are and what you really want to do. i hope he’s up for it before the job monster eats him up.

If he was “bored” with being a helicopter pilot, then there is likely no job that will be fulfilling to him. Also, getting out of the military after 12 years (with only 8 until retirement) is usually indication of non-promotion or other issues, which may hinder his hiring potential. Lastly, if he studied mechanical engineering and was a helo pilot, it was fairly predictable that he wouldn’t enjoy something as mundane/boring/non-demanding as sales. If you try to “help” him, you will really be hurting him. If he can’t get psyched to find a job on his own, “helping” him may only hurt. He needs to buckle down and get serious. On his own. Sorry for the brutal honesty, just had to add some realism to the flowerly stream of words.

Why hasn’t your BF checked with his classmates (e.g., reunions)? I’m not getting a good vibe from this. The ‘Long Gray Line’ never has problems of this sort, as they always have the ‘network’ going 24/7.

PM me please. Thx.

  • kd