Been racing a few years and am finally ready to kick in a few bucks for some race wheels. I am on a pretty low budget with two young kids in daycare full time and have done a bunch of research so you hopefully won’t need to reset a bunch of old discussions. In fact, I just read through most of the discussions of the past few months on this board about this topic and have my questions narrowed down pretty well.
I am not particulary fast (21ish for a flat 40k thus far). My favorite race that I do every year is a 1/2 iron in Oregon called Pacific Crest with over 3000 ft. of climbing at up to 8-10% in sustained pitches. Basically, most of my races are at least hilly if not more. I weigh 165 and am well fit on my QR.
I am looking at Jet 60 or Alps front… possibly a specialized tri spoke or h3 if I get a great deal but the hed I could probably afford to buy new which feels safer.
For the rear, despite reading a ton of your opinions, I still feel in a quandry. It seems everyone agrees that disks are fastest in the back, with Jet 90 coming close and some folks liking the h3 too…
BUT, given the type of riding I do with the climbing and the fact that I am nervous in crosswinds… is a disk still the fastest option? What about the jet 90? Or should I just get a set of jet 60s or alps and use those for everything?
I hope my questions narrow the discussion down so you can help me out. Thanks a lot
Based on the above I think a wheel you could both train, if you want to, and race on is the way to go. I’d be partial to the Alps. One caveot, it would depend on how much life was left in my current wheel set. If it could get me through training for the next couple of years I would lean towards a race only wheel set targeted at the four points above.
I’d find you a pair of used 404s or the like. Much lighter and they’ll probably run you about the same as a new set of Jets and be less than a new set of Alps. I know that you said you’d prefer to buy new, but if you’re careful you can find a nice set of used wheels for a great price (bought my American Classic/404s for $560 on Ebay and they’re perfect).
Going new, I’d choose the Alps. They’re a bit lighter and probably overall better wheels.
thanks guys. You didn’t directly address the disk issue on the rear. Sounds like by omission you both think getting a set of alps/404s makes more sense that thinking about a disk or jet 90 on the back??? I am really interested in when the amount of climbing negates a disk.
The weight difference between a Renn 575 disc (for example) and a Jet 90 is about 100 grams. If you want to believe Physics, then that’s not enough to even notice. An Alps rear is only about another 100 grams lighter than the Jet 90 (this is why I suggested the 404s - they’re about 500 grams lighter than the Alps and they’re very aerodynamic). However, Physics can’t convince you that a disc just feels heavier when you’re climbing. Plus, if you’re nervous in cross winds, and you ride in cross winds often, then maybe you won’t like the feel of a disc.
Other wheels to consider, if you’re going tubular, are the Hed Stingers/Carbonlite. I think they’re cheaper than the Alps and a bit lighter, too. Same rim depth. I’ve heard good things about the Spinergy Tiliums, too.
Have you considered a Nimble Fly on the front and a Nimble Crosswind on the back. May be a bit pricey, but there’s always ebay to look at. This addresses your racing criteria and nerves in the wind.
I am also going to be looking at lower priced race wheels come this summer. I was wondering if anyone has feedback on Aerospokes? They are like Spinergy Rev-X’s but with 5 spokes instead of 4, the rim appears to be 35mm. They are heavy though.
Otherwise, I think a Jet 60 set would be good for your uses, and usually sell back rate on those wheels is decent so you could always go more expensive. I don’t know about how a disc fits into your picture.
Before cerveloguy jumps in here I’m going to recommend a factory second Hed3 ($400 or $450 depending on tolerance) in the front and a CH aero cover in the back (around $65, and it’s USAT legal). At around $500 (i.e., less than the price of a 575), you can get pretty much the best aero performance around. It’s what I would do. If it’s windy, you can ride your regular rear wheel, but I’m sure the experienced disc wheel riders here will tell you that it’s no problem. If you need a new rear wheel, get an Ultegra wheel w/ a Mavic Open Pro.
I concur exactly with jhendric based on your criteria
New: Hed Alps
Used: Zipp 404
Dream: New Zipp 808s
The Zipps are very light for race wheels. I have ridden a lot on mine and have had no durability issues (I go about 160lbs). I used to have some Hed3 clinchers that I managed to “ding” the aluminum clincher surface and they were quite a bit heavier than the 404s. I don’t feel the 404s are worth the price premium new over the equally good Alps.
If you are skiddish about wind and race/train a lot in the hills, the disc will probably not be much of a benefit to you.
jhendric and rroof and I think alike about wheels. That said, I just got a new 808 front to replace a perfectly fine H3. If nothing else, it looks better on my black and red bike. I’ll be eBaying the H3 very soon…I’ve seen they’ve been going for circa 300.00…that will pay for nearly half of my 808.
With only a 35mm deep rim, pass on the aerospokes. That’s only slightly larger than American Classic 420’s or the Velocity Deep V’s.
If you are waiting until summer 2005, Renn said they are working on a cheap but sturdy and aero front wheel. Maybe it will be done by then. I know my next rear will be a Renn.
Interesting ideas. I am not that worried about weight specifically (If I was, I would lose 10 pounds from my middle before worrying about 100g on my wheels), just looking for the best options for my race conditions. I have seen a lot of debate about discs and it seems clear that they are absolutely the fastest, some people even seem to think discs are the best option when you climb a bunch… doesn’t seem like the replyers to this post think so.
I noticed in other posts that people find a disc to be MORE stable in crosswinds than a h3 or spoked wheel. that’s why I mentioned the fact that I have no interest in feeling blown around. I am not too nervous about getting a disc. The disc cover thing makes me nervous for some reason. I just want to get a feel for what the best call is for a hilly race and I can go from there. The used 404 idea sounds really cool but I rarely see them for $560. If anyone has mint condition 404s to sell me for that price, let me know. I am happy to save you the ebay charges.
What size wheels were you looking for? I’ve got some 650c wheels that I am selling (Zipp 404 front/Specialized Tri-spoke rear). P-mail me if interested.
Just for your info-- I called Hed the other day to inquire about H3 closeouts-- I was told that they don’t have any, or very few of them anymore-- that the production has gotten better rarely see the factory “seconds”
.
They actually sell some factory seconds on EBay. Used to see a lot more I bought one new about two years ago, amazed how much the price has gone up since then. (25%)
I’m going to recommend a factory second Hed3 ($400 or $450 depending on tolerance) in the front and a CH aero cover in the back (around $65, and it’s USAT legal). At around $500 (i.e., less than the price of a 575), you can get pretty much the best aero performance around. It’s what I would do. If it’s windy, you can ride your regular rear wheel, but I’m sure the experienced disc wheel riders here will tell you that it’s no problem. If you need a new rear wheel, get an Ultegra wheel w/ a Mavic Open Pro.