I have two P2C bikes and really like them. I have both a 56 and a 58. Both work really well for me from a sizing standpoint
I now really want to upgrade to a P3 or P4. But when I look at sizing it probably does not make sense but want to do it anyway. I am 5’11" with a 35" inseam. So longer leg and shorter torso.
Right now I am riding the 56 P2C and it is setup less aggressiviely. It is setup how I ride for HIM length event. It has 27mm of spacers. I am new to this but looking at the Cervelo web sit I calculate the stack at 558mm. I figured this by going to the Cervelo web sit and adding the 27mm of spacers that I have to the 531mm listing for the stack.
Now when I look at the sizing on the P3C/P4C it would seem I should choose a 58 over a 56 so that I would not have to use a giant amount of spacers.
The stack on 58 P3/P4 is 535. So I would need to add 23mm of spacers. But I would actually loose some when riding in my more aggressive position. And I would have plenty of room to get to a more aggressive position.
Like to hear thoughts on this. This is all new to me but does seem to make sense. I will also have to deal with reach next. The difference between a 58 P2 and 58 P3 is only 5mm. Don’t think this would be a big deal. Seems like seat position and/or stem will take care of this.
If I went with a 56 P3/P4 and kept my present position I would need 42mm of spacers. That would be crazy.
What size (length & angle) stem are you using on your 56 P2C, and are you happy with the fit/position? Do you plan to use the same cockpit setup on the new bike?
Just to let you know what’s coming, though…
If you have to use spacers on your P2C, then the P2C fits you better than a P3/P4 would. Simple as that.
I have a 58 p2C and a 56 P2c. So not looking at moving from one to the other. Just ended up with one of each.
I am looking at reworking the cockpit. Looking at being more aggressive. But from where I am at right now a 58 P3/P4 would still give me plenty of room to get more aggressive.
I do realize my 56 P2C gives plenty of room to be more aggressive but I really want to buy a new bike :). The 58 P2C does not provide really any room to get more aggressive but that is fine.
You misunderstood me. What I meant is, if you are interested in selling your 58cm P2C (it doesn’t sound like you use it), let me know. That’s my size.
I completely understand what you’re trying to do. And, I don’t blame you. Who doesn’t want a new bike??? But, what people are going to tell you is that, while a P3/P4 will have much greater bling factor, the sad truth is that your current P2 is a better fit for you.
I really don’t mean to be a downer. That’s just the reality.
It doesn’t sound like the p2’s fit you all that great either. Why dont you go get a FIST and buy a brand new shiny bike that fits. Unless your have your heart set on a p4.
I have been sized several times. I think the P2s fit me really well. I use to tweak them pretty often but not much lately. I do adjust seat height depending on wearing tri suit or cycle shorts. I did a HIM and made the 56, which is what I ride most of the time, less aggressive. I have not really played with it very much this summer. I have had races almost every week-end.
I am now thinking of pushing my position a little more aggressive with my sizing guy. I have now had the bike for over a year and probably a bit more flexible. Maybe see where I end up after 45 days and then make a decision on P3/P4 size. I just can’t imagine that much of a change where a 56 would make sense without a ton of spacers.
I have only one more real race this year. It is really tough to work on this stuff when you want to perform your best. I have been top three in my age group for the six local races I competed in this year. The last one will actually be the toughest to finish top 3.
I had hoped to have a new shinny P3 or P4 for the race but guess there is no way I can get all of this worked out that fast.
I do think the common comment on the forum to get a fitting. First, with most bikes multiple sized frames can be made to work. Second, flexibility changes over time. Fit is a constant process. Third, there is not only fit but there is position in relation to your fit. IMHO, getting a fitting is not the end all. Just my 2 cents.
I think with the some work I could fit a 58 P3/P4 well and would have a new bike to play with and compare my times with. Going through the numbers I don’t think I can get a 56 to fit me.
But at 5’11" it bothers me buying a 58 when most would buy a 56 and some maybe even a 54.
I work with Sam at Peloton Cyclery. I have been working with him for the last 15 months. The most valuable aspect is that he takes his time and explains things to me. But since I was starting with no knowledge some things he has had to tell me multiple times.
I think the forum gives the wrong impression of a fitting. I think it is wrong to think you go and get a fitting and you are done. That the person doing the fitting is going to have all the answers. I was completely new at this when I started and still learning a lot but my take aways
Having a fitting done for a tri bike is going to take multiple visits. I had a rough fit done. Then rode for a couple of weeks and went back and he made adjustments. I then go back from time to time. But I have not been going often enough. I have not been working on getting more aggressive with my position. I should have. When I started looking at new bikes I realized how unaggressive my position really is.
You need to learn for yourself as much as you can and do some of the tweaks yourself. So my regular cycling bibs and my tri race outfit create different positions for me on the bike. I make these adjustments myself.
I have found relatively minor adjustments can make a pretty big difference. I notice this most in power.
I work towards the following factors that do interacts with one another. Everyone is different and there is not one, perfect answer. The forum gave me the impression that they measure a bunch of stuff and viola this is your sizing. It really matters on how you are built, flexibility, muscle structure, comfort level, length of races, physical atributes, pain tolerance, breathing ability in different positions, etc. There are tons of variables that have to be factored in. One of my weird characteristics is that my leg muscles are not consistent. I am much stronger, faster, etc in a TT position than a road racing position. So my position is more sensitive than others or I don’t hit my power sweat spot. Versus the average person. I have poor flexible but can tolerate discomfort longer than the average person.
You have to have good communication with the person doing the fitting. They have to be flexible and accept everyone is different. I do think there is/was some bias with the person that I work with that they see how inflexible I am and their experience with other customers have not factored that I am willing to be uncomfortable more than the average person.
I like Sam and he has been really helpful. I highly recommend him. But I do want to try another person just to get a second perspective. But ultimately I want to spend the money to get a session in a wind tunnel that also measures power. To get a really valuable fitting you need wind tunnel data, power data, and then feedback from the rider what they are comfortable with.
As I said I have about 15 months experience with this but this has been what I have learned.
No, it’s not. You ought to be able to do most stuff on your own by now.
But at 5’11" it bothers me buying a 58 when most would buy a 56 and some maybe even a 54.
Didn’t you just say that multiple sizes fit the same person. So why the heck do you care what size you are buying?
Here’s a suggestion if you want more aggresive on the P2. Buy a longer stem. Increasing your reach will do a couple of things for you. First, it will drop your shoulders a bit, the same as reducing your stack will do. Second, it will get your upper arms away from the verticle drag-creating pillars that they presently are. Both will likely help your speed and you get used to the extra reach pretty quickly.
Or buy a new bike. At least you admitted you just want a new bike instead of trying to justify it.
My 56 P2 has plenty of room to play with a more aggressive position. The 58 does not. I think I need to play with the more aggressive position on the P2 to just be sure there is no way I would blow through the possibilities with a 58 P3. In other words, I would get to a position where I want to be lower than is possible with a 58 P3. I don’t think there is anyway this could be possible.
Otherwise if I go with a 56 P3 I will have a huge amounts of spacers if I don’t get comfortable with a more aggressive position.
What surprises me is that more people don’t go up a size and get rid of huge amounts of spacers. The general principal I have read is if you are between sizes then go down a size. I know it also depends which aspect you are talking about.
All of this discussion has also made me realize I am probably more aero on the 58 P2 than the 56. The 56 with the spacers is probably not good. I always just rode the 56 because I thought it was better because it was smaller. Reach, stack, etc they are setup pretty much identically between the two bikes.
I’m very close to your size and I actually borrowed a friend’s 51cm P2C. I swapped out some items and raced it to the highest overall placing I’ve had in a tri (including my highest ever bike split). I used a 130mm -30 rise stem to get the front end where I wanted it and put on the longest saddle I owned to get the seat far enough forward. Frankly, I think the sizing differences from one frame to another are kind of silly. 2cm up, down, forward back just don’t make that much difference, either in fit or aerodynamics.
I think the point is that multiple size bikes can fit with some adjustments. Rarely is a bike not going to require some adjustment. For me I am seriously considering purchasing a 58 P3/P4 instead of a 56 and adjusting the reach. I think it is a better option. Or I could get a 56, no real adjustment on reach and have more spacers for stack. Either would work but what is the best choice? Someone might argue either bike “fits” or I guess argue neither bike “fits”.
Yaqui Mariola. Sc/Aluminum frame with 34mm headtube, 26x58mm downtube and a non-aero seattube (odd shape, probably 34mm widex44 long), plus a regular, not aero, Reynolds Ouza Pro fork. No seat cutout. Round seatpost. It is actually a fairly aero bike for 5 years ago and I would guess it falls somewhere near the Lucero in terms of speed, i.e. not as fast as the newer bikes, but still a lot better than poorly designed carbon bikes with large tubes (Kalibur and Plasma come to mind).
