LBS gripe - Tom D - help!

Triathlon Forum
1

So I’m in a new city and scoping LBSs. I am also in need of a new bike. I have really only ridden Softrides and would like to try something new. Coming from a running background, I am not great at bike fit, so I’m looking for some help in fit, brands, everything. Tom D always says the best bike is the one that fits you, so I go in, ready with my shoes and shorts, plenty of time to talk, test and fit.

LBS #1. Guy rough fits me as a 52 (I always thought I was 54). Asks me my price range. Honestly, I’m looking for the right bike at this point, and although money is an object, I want to start first with what the best fit is, then get into pricing. But I throw out $2500. He finds the closest bike they have in that range (Felt S22) and they only have it in a 54 in stock. Guess what? Suddenly, he thinks a 54 will fit me just fine.

LBS #2. Tell the nice lady a little bit about my background, needs. She says since I do long distance stuff, I need to talk to the guru in the back, and he’ll be able to tell me anything I need. After mocking me for riding Softrides (hey, I’m used to this, but I’m trying to give you some business buddy, and Softrides have been good to me), he basically tells me nothing other than that there’s ~maybe~ one or two bikes that are in my price range (of course, that was the first question out of his mouth). All this while he’s eating his pizza and generally not caring about what I need. Never asked what kind of riding I do, what races I have lined up, anything.

So…is my approach wrong? How do I get help finding the right bike for me? I finally decide to pony up and get a new bike instead of crawling eBay and miscellaenous classifieds, but I left these two LBSs feeling like I’d rather head back to do my own, not-so-great fitting.

~geek

2

well, what city did you move to?
I’m sure someone here can recommend a shop!

3

Good luck on your search for a new tri bike…

Coming from someone who runs a shop (myself). I feel it is correct to ask what a customers budget may be along with other things when discussing a new bike purchase.

It is pointless and a waste of the customers time for me to ramble on in detail about the bikes in the $2000-$5000 range if the customers budget is say $1000. And vice versa.

If you feel that a shop is selling you the wrong size just so they can move product or clear out last years model get a second opinion.

Try to support your local shops but, if they are not capable of putting you on the right bike you may have to make a road trip to find a good shop.

4

I understand on the price range and I don’t want to waste anyone’s time. My point was that if a bike fits me well and I’ll ride it well, I would love it if it were $1000, but would be willing to pay $3000…does that make sense? I am trying to get the expertise of a good fit and I just felt very let down after these two.

I’m in Atlanta, Georgia…any suggestions of shops, or of local coaches or bike fitters who can help me if I buy elsewhere are appreciated.

And thanks for listening to the vent.

5

I feel it is correct to ask price range as a place to start.

I don’t.

Your job is to CREATE demand as much as it is to SUPPLY demand to consumers. Asking price question only puts you into a comodity business…which, depending upon your customer, you already may be. But don’t start there.

6

You won’t be wasting anyones time. The shop should cover in detail any information you may want on at any price point. What I meant was, I feel that I’m wasting the customers time talking about bikes they are not interested in to begin with. If the customers budget is $500 but they want details on every bike in my store over $3000 I will gladly cover all they wish to hear.

I don’t know any shops in that area. I’m sure someone on this fourm is from Atlanta.

7

Although I never bought a bike at All3Sports in Atlanta, I’ve bought may other things there and have been satisfied with their service. As an alternative, it may be a drive, but you can always make the trip to Raleigh, NC to Inside-Out Sports. They always seemed quite knowledgeable to me (I lived there for 5 years). Both places are FIST certifed.

8

Whatever. I guess we have been a very sucsessfull shop for 30+ years from doing things the wrong way.

According to you.

9

Hey irongeek,

Nope, your approach is right. Your LBS’s are wrong.

Customers have evolved faster than bicycle retail.

Some retailers have have evolved.

The industry has not evolved or grown much at all in the last few years with very few exceptions.

You fell victim to the great industry paradigm of “Buy a bunch of bikes, put them on your sales floor and sell them when the customer comes in. Sell from what you have on the floor because you own money on that. Don’t order anything new becasue it creates new debt- sell from what is on the floor.”

That is both the industry’s and the retailer’s fault. That is also the reason why Dan Empfield’s article on JSG’s (Just Some Guy selling bikes out of his garage) is spot on.

Sorry to use your thread as a pulpit, and I’ll get the answer to your conern in a second here… But the industry needs to get with the year 2005. They need to adopt real time inventory management. Trek has done this with Dexter, and it is awesome. They are the only ones.

Every bike comapny needs at least a system like Dexter- an integrated, automated, interactive real time on-line inventory management system that let’s us sell from the bike copany’s inventory, not ours. That takes the pressure of holding inventory off our shoulders and puts it back where it belongs: On the manufacturer and distributor.

Now, for your problem: Heck, I think you just picked two duds. check Dan;s list of Local bicycle Retailers and find the closest one, give that one a try. Also, in fairness, maybe you just caught them on a bad day. That is entirely possible. It sounds to me like you were well equipped to shop and asked good questions.

I think you were an excellent customer. I also think none of these bike shops read “The Sixth Sigma” by the former General Electric CEO about quality control and customer perception.

-Sorry you had a bad experience- keep on trying…

10

well, that does suck. is there a cycling club venue you could check on the internet, and then perhaps identify their list of bike shops?

i found similar things when i was shopping. ended up going with the guys that I liked best…somtimes I feel as thought it’s shopping for a store, as opposed to a bike.

maybe to answer the budget question you could say: my budget is a little flexible…I’m interested in XYZ characteristics, so I’d like to find the bike that allows me to achieve that.

Then ask them what they have in the 1000.00 range. Let them talk, then ask about higher priced bikes as you go. I do think that throwing out a number, “I want to spend 2,500.00” makes the sale based around price only, when your motive isn’t price, but product. In the end, if your super duper bike was just 500 more than your original budget, you might just go for it. Again, your decision isn’t soley motivated by price, so you need to be delt with in terms of the features of products–not just price points. And you’re right–you could fine the features you want in a less expensive bike, or for arguement’s sake, one that is slightly higher. A good salesperson will help you see the differences.

Another good way to start the conversation is: I have alot of (whatever events) lined up for this upcoming season. I’m interested in a bike to deliver XYZ for me. I’m not fully set on budget yet and I’ve got some flexiblity on it. Can you talk with me about some of the bikes you think would do the job for me? I’m more interested in talking about the features of the bikes, as opposed to talking directly about price points.

The deal is that the best salespeople are excellent at asking questions…you might not encounter the best salesperson, so you have to help them out in the process by sharing information.

Good luck in your search…I’m sure you’ll find a knock out bike!

Kittycat

11

That’s a good insight. We never ask what a customer wants to spend, we tell them we make the assumption that they are willing to spend what it will take to get the job done, but no more.

We let people know that pretty much up front in all cases and it takes price off the table as an issue.

If someone wants to spend $6000 but a $2000 bike does the job, then we can either adjust the choices upward in price for something else that may work in that higher price range or we give them a pleasant surprise and save them some serious cash.

In either event, the key is getting them on the right bike.

12

I’ve got a question for the bike shop owners…does it make sense to call the store before going to make an ‘appointment’? It seems like it would help. Also, it would be a good way to quickly size-up the shop.

13

IG - In atlanta, somewhat surpirsingly for a city this size, there are not all that many choices for a true fit. I don’t know who the 2 shops are that you visited, but would be interested, as I have had some bad experiences here as well. Generally, i think your options are calling Michel (male, but pronounced like the female Michelle) at Free Flite in Marietta (expert at road fits, I think less experience at tri - fitting on serotta size cycle), Roswell Bikes (have heard good things, but have never been in the shop), Bicycle Link in Buckhead (ive only bought 1 pouch of accelerade from them but, from looking around, i think it’s a roadie shop, but they use the serotta as well), Peachtree Bikes (I think they’ve had a lot of employee turnover in the last year - good or bad), or all three sports (which some people like).

good luck

14

Yes, it does help. We overbook our appointments out of necessity thought since 30% of people make the appointment and blow it off. Not cool when I am here at 7:00 PM or 7:00 AM for a fitting and the person not only doesn’t show- they don’t even call.

Appointments are a good idea though.

15

Thanks everyone for all the tips. I took my stuff with me, ready to fit if they had time, or ready to schedule an appointment - I knew I wasn’t going home with a bike that day, but wanted to start the process/relationship with hopefully a good shop who would help me with my bike in the future.

Thanks for the tips on Atlanta shops - some of these I have tried already, others I haven’t…I’ll keep at it. Or I’ll find an excuse to get a fit in Michigan. :slight_smile:

~geek

16

"Asking price question only puts you into a comodity business…which, depending upon your customer, you already may be. But don’t start there. "

Speaking from the retail perspective (not bikes), the “price question” is valid depending on how your customer has approached you. For example, if they come in saying that they want to look at a specific brand of bike…well, for the most part, the price issue need not be asked at that point as the assumption could be made that the consumer is savvy enough to know the price range of the bike they are looking at.

However, if a certain set of wants and needs are offered without reference to any specific brand, price and or budgetary concern/constraints is indeed a proper investigative tool, as it holds true that a number of different price points will satisfy a number of specific wants and needs for most bike buyers.

Should price be the first question? Absolutely not. But let’s face it, for the vast majority of us dollars will come into play sooner or later. Doing a fabulous presentation on a $5k bike for someone wanting to spend half that is a waste of both parties’ time.

17

What most retailers are too stupid to understand is that they can be in both the full service business at higher margins *and *be in the high volume market with lower margins and zero service. To survive and profit today I think every retailer needs to do both.

Customers have spoken: Some want full service and are willing to pay. Some want internet buying capability and don’t want the service. A good retailer does it all, employing the full arsenal of retailing tools across a broad spectrum of markets.

The stupid retailer bitches ad nauseum about other dealers who are innoovative, move light and fast, fight on all fronts and kow every retail weapons system has a place in their arsenal.

On the modern retail battlefield, theone who does it all will prevail, and the customer always wins.

18

yes, see, this is the rationale of a good bike shop. in the end it’s long term thinking and you’re putting people on a bike based on product, not on price. that’s exactly the right way to shop (provided the budget is there for most cases–and somtimes you come in on a purchase way below budget) and the right way to sell.

19

Friend of mine was interested in buying a Giant TCR - got fitted on the same day in two stores for different sized bikes each time!

I think there are a few good bike stores, and also a fair amount of shops staffed by people who think that because they have an in depth knowledge of groupsets and alike they are far superior to their customers. The thing is, there is no point in paying your LBS more for the ‘service’ they can provide if there is no service! Might as well use the internet.

20

thats pretty bad b/c at least in the us theyre s,m,l
.