I will admit to not knowing the stats of President Clinton’s welfare reforms, and will stipulate that he took a beating when he did so from many liberal pundits. What I was trying to point out was that the other extreme in terms of policies didn’t work out all that well either. There needs to be a happy medium between giving people a hand up and creating a permanent underclass with handouts.
Spot
**“There needs to be a happy medium between giving people a hand up and creating a permanent underclass with handouts.” **
Well said.
President Clinton did a pretty good job don’t you think of weeding out the vast majority of welfare bums? he duid it the right way too by building a strong economy with jobs aplenty and then telling people who viewed permanent welfare as a career that the gig was up. He took more people off welfare than any Republican before or since.
Uh yeah…Clinton was dragged kicking and screaming into wlfare reform by a popular pub congress. It was a wierd time when the public response to Clinton’s initial acts rolled in a pub congress for the first time in 44 years, and congress had the mandate, not the POTUS. But hey, whatever makes you feel good about yourself.
huh? you ran an experienced center right war hero lost to a liberal black guy called Hussein with half a term in the Senate on his resume and you think it went well?
I’d hate to see a bad loss.
That’s funny right there…
Spot
“Worse, socialism seems to be the element of our new young president”
That’s just fucking great!!
When Mojozenmaster (a conservative white male) suggests that Obama is a socialist and is driving the country towards socialism, I get hammered.
When a black female articulates the same thoughts……everything is okay…
Fucking racism……
How well did that “government programs = socialism” argument work for you guys in the last election, hmm?
You’re kidding, right?
The election had zero to do with that, and you know it. People did not vote for change in ideology. They voted for a different face, a different guy. Most voters don’t even know the difference between McCain’s and Obama’s real stances.
Similarly, just since I’m on a roll, people didn’t vote for change when WJC was elected either. Perot f*cked it up by splitting the vote. WJC would’ve been blown out in a 2-man race. Same as W would’ve been had that chump Nader not bombed it for what’s-his-name. This ain’t opinion. It’s fact.
President Clinton did a pretty good job don’t you think of weeding out the vast majority of welfare bums? he duid it the right way too by building a strong economy with jobs aplenty and then telling people who viewed permanent welfare as a career that the gig was up. He took more people off welfare than any Republican before or since.
Again, you’re kidding, right? I dig (and dug) Clinton, and I still know you’re way off base. WJC lucked his way into office, then lucked into an economy that had already recovered and was well on its way to the boom before he was elected. Look it up. The boom was further driven by the dotcom days and ensuing market bubble (that has its roots dating back to the Reagan administration’s policies). Clinton (and Gore) had nearly nothing to do with it. If anything, the economy boomed DESPITE his huge tax increase. And I give Bubba huge kudos for not blowing those budget surpluses.
We won’t know how Obama really does until 10 years or more from now. So all the O-haters can hold onto their blame for awhile; we’re going to be seeing the aftermatch of the last 3 presidents (and congress, and consumer behavior) for a long time yet.
certainly i’m not alone by fearing that the big O will increase government to a crippling standard. fundamentally, once government has something in place, there it sits forever, regardless of cost or effectiveness. this my main problem with large government, it’s just so ineffective and not to mention corrupt. (case in point regarding the democrats who support higher taxes yet fail to pay taxes themselves. by the way, is there a cabinet in place yet? i digress…)
moreover, large expensive government impedes capitalism and detracts incentive (with high taxation). the negative effects of this could be immediate, no decade required.
for example one could think, “why should i kill myself to earn a higher wage in my business when all i do is pay uncle sam?” i have thought this many times and decided long ago to not earn beyond a certain point because the penalities were too high. and this was well before Obama’s “new plans”.
Another immediate impact could be that small businesses would not hire people because it is too expensive from a tax standpoint, or people might not take the leap to start businesses because it is too costly and the risk is not worth it.
These things matter, especially in light of small businesses being the backbone of our country.
so while i agree with you that it could take a decade to determine SOME of the long term effects in big O’s decision making, considering a loose cannon democrat congress in hand, he can definitely do alot of damage in the short term (the stimulus bill that congress member’s couldn’t understand, being one of them).
as a side note, doesn’t anyone notice how Obama is lying the groundwork so if this stimulus bill doesn’t “pan out”, he can easily blame the states, the American people, and basically everyone buy himself. he is setting it up so everybody is the scape goat. i don’t like that, i wish more people would see through it now. but, i think within 12 months they will.
Oh, I definitely see it, and many others around me – even in crazy-liberal SF – have mentioned that. Some have made the case that all of the “catastrophe” talk, and how we must do this his way now or else, etc., has scared the markets and the consumer into freezing up even worse. I tend to agree with this. And it’s all so he can reduce expectations and take credit later if it all works. Pretty cheap tactics. And costing America (the world) countless fortunes. Wow. That’s something I’d expect more of a W, not the O that was marketed to us all.
Pres. Clinton did it the right way by signing welfare reform. Kuddos to him for that although he was forced into it. The current guy just unraveled all of that.
“No its false because you guys had 8 long terrible years to do your thing with impunity and look where we are.”
You mean the LP has had control of the White House and the Congress over the last eight years and I missed out on it!!! Obviously, I’ve gotten much too wrapped up in my training!
“No its false because you guys had 8 long terrible years to do your thing with impunity and look where we are.”
You mean the LP has had control of the White House and the Congress over the last eight years and I missed out on it!!! Obviously, I’ve gotten much too wrapped up in my training!
When they asked the LR for input - You had your head in the water trying to increase your swim speed. I guess neither one worked out too well, huh? 