The talk on the IM Florida thread about IM races selling out has me thinking again about the fees. Clearly, IM North America is enjoying an incredible seller’s market, but how much room is there still to go? If all the North American races are selling out in a matter of days, you have to imagine they’re underpricing their product, as unpleasant as that thought may be. At what point do people get over “M-Dot Fever” and start voting with their feet, flocking in greater numbers to races like Vineman, Great Floridian, and Ultramax? Not all these people signing up for WTC races can really consider themselves in the running for Hawaii slots, so what’s the breaking point?
Having plopped down $450 for IM-Moo this year, I’m at that point. My Iron-distance race next year will most likely not be a WTC event. That’s not to say in 2006 I won’t be signing up for an M-Dot race, but I see little chance of a Kona slot next year and would rather delay that attempt till I think I have a better shot. Besides, people seem to have tons of positive comments and impressions about these other iron-distance races.
What do y’all think? You have to imagine that there’s room for fees to go up quite a bit, if the WTC wants to raise its prices. On the other hand, do they risk turning off some triathletes if they get “too rich”? At what price differential does it not matter to you if it’s Duke Blue Devil or IM Canada? How much is that M-Dot logo really worth, when it comes to entry fees?
My first iron distance will probably be ultramax because of the cost. Entering the local half irons require finacial planning on my part. i won’t be hitting an mdot race until I feel I can do something better than just finish.
Are you kidding me? Not being a triathlete but a duathlete I just registered for 4 dannon duathlons for half that amount. The other half will cover the rest of my entries for the season. Holy crap, I was thinking of getting back into the water to do some long tri’s but I think I’ll just run and bike instead.
Have a great race.
I’m planning on doing IM Lake Placid in 2005 as my first IM but since reading Allison’s article I’ve really done a lot of thinking about the cost. I just feel like I’m getting ripped off by giving them almost $400 for a full year. I think they’re approaching a limit where people people simply won’t be able to justify the cost for a 1-day race.
Realistically I be the market would bear $600 but $1000 is not out of the question. There is a strong argument to be made for raising the prices of the events since demand is so high.
That’s exactly what I fear. I can’t blame the WTC, since they’re obviously providing a product for which there’s sufficient demand. If it was my company, I’d look at the fact that IM Florida sold out so quickly as a lost opportunity for higher revenue. I think the onus has to fall on us, the paying athletes. If we’re silly enough to pay $1,000 to do a race, WTC is silly to not charge that amount.
I’m just wondering where it ends. At what price do you folks say “enough is enough”? Like I said, $450 was borderline too high for me, but if I feel like some day I have a shot at a Kona slot, I’ll pay up to go for it. Other than that, I’m all in favor of trying out the smaller races.
Another thing to think about is this “Half-Iron Championship,” held in Kansas City, which appears to be gaining steam. The demand for these longer distance races is high enough to support another “race series,” it seems. One thing I’d love to see are some races featuing the international long distance standard (4k/120k/30k). How much has WTC left the door open for a competitor? I realize how strong the Ironman trademark is in the U.S., but at some point there has to be room for someone to step in.
M-dot races have become all day training events for the wealthy. As the image of the Ironman continues to become less of a race, and more of an “accomplishment”, the fields will continue to pay more and still sell out.
I think I am bothered more by the proliferation of sprint tris, and even the new ones (some with poor organziation) are charging $60. That’s high for a one hour race. I thought I got great value from the $400 I plunked down for IMF. That race was exceptionally well-organized, safe and had great support. Incidentally, there are a handful of non-MDot IMs that are much cheaper, and the Duke Blue Devil is largely tax deductible. Support those IMs instead if you have a problem with the WTC. There is no doubt, though, that this ain’t no cheap sport!
Actually, if you read Babbitt’s book on the history of the IM, I think Collins saw where his dream was headed. The future fame of this event was foreshadowed as early as 1980 when the news media swarmed. When Collins handed over the reins to Ironman, he specifically required the successor to make slots available to the “common man” entrant: hence the lottery (and other avenues of entry). Most of the original Ironmen had never done a triathlon before. It was the adventuresome spirit the founders were originally after. As Collins has quoted before, it was the “common man” entrant that started and made Ironman. Decent read with great pics.
Desert Dude, it’s mostly just the Ironscam events that have gotten out of hand. My next triathlon is a small sprint with an entry fee of only $30 and no USAT license BS either. There are plenty of good cheap tri’s around, just not any with an M-dot logo.
For me, an M-dot race is like a vacation. It is something that I plan my summer around and look forward to from the time I sign up. I don’t think it is much different than going to Disney World, Universal Studio’s or some other Park. What kind of money are you putting down for those?
I don’t look at it as a 1 day event. You can usually get in some open water swims starting midweek, listen to a few of the pro’s give clinics…all the way through the awards banquet. Simply a vacation from the everyday crap of the real world. Throw in travel and lodging and I am probably pretty close to the same cost as that trip to Disney World but a little bit healthier in the end.
Just my thoughts, but in the end it is still the #1 force of business…The law of Supply and Demand. We are all to blame for what we are willing to pay.
I can’t afford to pay $400 for an IM race. But then again, I don’t plan on doing an IM any time soon. However, I did a little math and this is what I came up with. I figure if I did an IM (based on my half IM times), I’d complete the race in 13-14 hours. At $400 per entry fee, I’m looking at somewhere in the neighborhood of $30 per hour to do the race. That’s not too bad, all things considered. And it’s less money in relation to time spent on the course when compared to a sprint race. Even the 9:00 guys and gals are looking at about $45 per hour for an IM – still less than a sprint.
Given that, $400 isn’t too bad a price tag for these events. But I get the best bang for my buck by doing local half IM’s. I have two in my state that are pretty reasonable – $150 for one and $100 for the other. I figure those cost me about $23 to $15 per hour to complete (not counting travel, which I didn’t take into account on the IM figures, either). So for me, the best use of my funds is to do these half IM races.
We also have an Olympic distance race here in Georgia that goes for $50, which is also a good value.
Broken down like that, and assuming my math is not flawed, the prices for Mdot races aren’t too unreasonable.
But in terms of overall cost, you will pay more an hour for sprint races, but it will cost less to finish the race, especially if the sprint is local (no special nutrition, air fare, etc.).
Last year I asked the question."how much would you pay to do and IM race.’ Only about 4 people actually said that they were at the max or would go up to $500 or $600. Most of the others were the non-answer answers or the usual change of subject in the middle of a thread thing. I believe the masses will pay whatever Graham Fraser wants and he knows it. Extremely smart marketer, Fraser is.
The only folks that have gotten their act truly together to pose any challenge to WTC are the UltraMax folks. By starting their half-iron distance championship, I think they have gotten folks interested in their races. If they can continue to provide a quality product, I think they will be a huge success. A full IM is a heckuva commitment to make – half IM is much more in the realm of something you can do while holding a job and family.
One large problem the start-up IMs have is location. They cannot afford to hold races where WTC does, because they cannot afford to bribe the town councils into accepting the snarled roads, etc. WTC can, and does, afford this. I guess that’s part of what your $400 goes toward.
FWIW – I’m doing IMFL, but imagine next year I’ll be focusing on the Ultramax half series or a non-MDOT race. I can only afford to pay the $$ and commit a year in advance every 2-3 years. But I agree with the guy that talked about vacations and IM. By the time you pay to train and get yourself to the race, the $400 entry fee is one of your minor expenses (unless you live close to the race site)
I can’t blame the WTC, since they’re obviously providing a product for which there’s sufficient demand.
What about Ironman Utah? They send the athletes out in a clusterf%^k - bad conditions, completely screwed up race and did these athletes get refunds? No. I felt so bad for all the people who trained for IMUT as their first IM and then got hosed, only to be told they would get $50 off their NEXT IM. That’s $750 for their first IM, plus travel expenses and vacation time for two events.
I’ve got no problem with supply and demand and have paid some of the crazy fees for IMNA, but I do think as consumers we need to hold them accountable as well when things go wrong too.
On the other hand, the races are typically extremely well organized and well stocked with water and food, etc. Smaller (cheaper) events don’t always do that part as well.
I absolutely agree with you, irongeek. If the WTC screws up, as in Utah, they should, without question, be held responsible. A $50 discount of their next IM race is insulting. On the other hand, what leverage do we have against them? All IMNA races are still going to sell out in a matter of days. I haven’t checked, but I’m sure the entry forms and agreements you sign account for bad weather and the possibility of the swim being eliminated, so that’s a chance we take as participants. But absolutely we should let our disgust be known in situations like that. I’m all for any movement that would encourage the proliferation of rival organizations. It would only benefit us as consumers. When it comes down to it, though, it seems we have given the WTC too much power.
But all of this is tangential to my original question: at what price is the breaking point for most of us here on slowtwitch? How much more till the WTC finally pushes us away from its races?
You also need to remember that Mdot also has hundreds of thousands of dollars of sponsorship dollars coming in for each event, plus they are given financial considerations for bringing their events to town i.e. free permits, police, hotels, and the list goes on.
Those local sprint triathlons are lucky to get free bagels and oranges for sponsorship and have to pay all of those permitting costs.
I didn’t really make my point - I hit my breaking point with WTC after IMUT because I felt they showed extremely poor judgment - not because the weather was bad - I wouldn’t have blamed them for unusual weather conditions - that’s the risk we all take. My understanding is they knew well in advance that the swim site was bad (chemicals in the water) and typically very windy and they moved forward up to the point of sending athletes in the water. I believe they did that part simply to avoid refunds.
So for me, it’s not a dollar amount, but a question of spending my money on organizations who take care of the athletes and put their safety above $$$. At that point - not $400 or $1000, but when I realized it’s more about the money than the people for IMNA, I started looking for more out of the way races.
(That said, I’m a big hypocrite now because I’m doing IMCDA. I told a buddy I would do his first IM with him and that’s the one he chose. So…in this case I’m definitely not walking the talk.)
Posts like this make me realize how good we’ve got it in Southern Ontario. There’s one series run by Mitch Fraser - Trisport (Graham’s relative?) where you can plop down $320 Cdn for all 10 races in the series (that’s about $225 US). The other major series (run by Multisport) here also offers a pass for 10 races for $335 ($235 US). So for the price of one IMNA event, you can race 20 sprint/olympic/long course events in Southern Ontario.