Hi,
How do you guys pace your Ironman run?
I followed Don Fink’s training program on my first Ironman but it felt like I had no speed. Also, I was Hyponatremia during run so I couldnt really run during the marathon part.
I did a practice half ironman and strictly followed his heart rate monitor approach and at 17k it felt like I had so much in the tank and was able to pick up pace from 10:30m/m to 8m/m.
Now training for my second Ironman I can comfortably run a 8:30m/m but I dont know how long Ill last and my HR is beyond the prescribe HR. Everytime I slowed down to the prescribed HR my pace drops to 10:00-10:30m/m.
Read the last set of posts including the chart in that thread.
You should have a very good idea of your target pace from the chart. You should be able to confirm that assumption in your big simulation days prior to your race.
Without the above it’s pretty much pulling shit out of your ass and hoping it works (it probably won’t).
Try to find optimal cadence (many coaches recommend between 90-95 spm)
Do more quality runs - VO2 max intervals (for improving your max VO2 consumption), Threshold intervals or runs (for improving your Lactate Threshold), Sprint Intervals (400-600m) to improve your running economy.
Increase mileage
You’ll see your running ignite
EDIT:
Also, don’t rely so heavily on HR. HR is the response of your body to your body conditions but also to environmental conditions: such as heat, humidity, wind, altitude, sun etc.
Try to find your optimal paces during your brick workouts. These workouts simulate the stress you’ll experience during a tri race. Also adjust them accordingly to your race location and conditions. For example, if you train your bricks in a cool climate, high humidity and at sea level and you will race at a warm climate, low humidity and high altitude your pace will have to be adjusted.
I cheat a little. I look at my run times in my 70.3. I look at similar run times to my direct competition in their 70.3’s and IM runs. I use that as a ballpark for how fast I should be. I plan on doing regular long bricks (4-1/2 - 5-1/2 hour bike, 30-60’ run) to confirm that it’s a reasonable pace. I also compare how much RPE climbs at the end of weekly long runs.
But I’m going into my first IM. The run pace has me equally concerned.
I have a question for the faster runners… what Friel Running HR and pace zone are you in? Are you at the top of zone 1, or well into zone 2? On the bike leg, you’re somewhere at the bottom to middle of zone 2 it seems. In a 70.3, both bike and run are zone 3 efforts, but it seems like due to the length of the event, it may not be reasonable to hold that higher pace. It seems even the pros are at best crusing at a very low zone 2 effort on the run as the threshold run pace of a top pro male is about a 4:45-5:10 (~Olympic distance run), but their IM run is around 6:25-6:50 effort.
This chart, copied directly from the linked thread (I don’t know the original source) is pretty spot on. Do a 10K or open half marathon and then read across to get your IM pace.
You should read the other thread because it has some great information about early pacing. In 2012 at IMAZ I ran my first mile in 6:50 and felt great. My endorphin-drugged mind tried to trick me in to maintaining that unrealistic pace (“you can do this and have your best IM ever…”) Fortunately my rational brain over ruled and I slowed down to 8:00 pace, which felt easy for the first 8.5 or so, harder for the next 8.5, and all that I could manage for the last 8.5. By pacing that way I was able to actually speed up for the last 10K. If I had charged on at 6:50 pace I am sure I would have had a nice first 1/3 split and then walked much of the rest. It should feel too easy leaving T2.
I have seen some FOP AG and pros’ go faster in their IM run than this would predict based on their HIM run times. But maybe there’s a tendency to push the 70.3 bike harder.
FWIW I beat my 80%, best case scenario, pace by two minutes. One of them came in that first mile :-). The other came from reasonable pacing over the whole course. The run is going to get very, very hard at some point in time. You want to save some energy for that point.
I also include in my Ironman build a “Metric Ironman” (forget where I read it, but basically a 70 mi ride followed by a 16 mi run, I skip the swim), just a long brick, about 6 weeks out. It usually gives me a good indicator of my run pace for the first ~18 miles of the Ironman run.
My pace inevitably slows at that point and I just have to gut out the last 8 miles. But, I still fall right in the middle of the range for a 1:24 open half from the table above (I’ve split 3:34 twice, right in between the 75% and 80% estimates of 3:28 and 3:42.) That table really is on the money for me.
Thanks guys for the chart! Illl get on the 10k trial after this artic vortex were having up north!
Fleck
This is my 3rd year in triathlon and 2nd ironman. I did dragon boat for 11yrs and represented canada in national level. Ive only been doing all three sports since i started 3yrs ago so im fairly new.
I love the training, the distance, how it keeps me active…it just totally kept me active everyday for the last 2yrs. Also love discovering a the new level of fitness!
The chart only goes up to 50mins 10k. I dont run that fast but my best 10k was 51mins. The site that sciguy gave is in another language. Do u guys know what it is and ill just translate it online?
Easy fix then… just improve yoru fitness so you can go 50’, then your good.
You can probaby also just extrapolate the chart proportionally to 51’.
What’s you HIM time? I think a lot of guys that aren’t as fast in shorter distances sometimes don’t lose as much speed in longer ones. Plus above about at 4h IM run, you’re probably looking at some walking mixed in there, which may skew things a little.
Didn’t catch your reply before deleted but reading the other posts in the thread here is some more n=1 info from my recent experience if it helps. I was at 2012 IMMT and using that chart (and advice from people on here - thanks sciguy) targeted ~10:30/mi in the run. Managed to hold it together for 24 miles and slowed slightly in the last 2 mi but didn’t have to walk finishing in ~4:30. Earlier that summer I ran ~8:30’s in the IMMT 70.3. My 10K time that spring was 44 mins. You’ve got 2 IMs under your belt, not sure how they went, but based on your current 10K time 10:30+/mi in the IM run is not an unrealistic target. It’s a wholly different animal than any other run.
