Help me analyze my first subpar race

Triathlon Forum
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How much do you personally expect to improve every time out?
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I’m learning, as I get older, to be more philosophical about things.

Apologies if this comes across as sort of a gauche, newbieish-type of post for this forum, but I can be a somewhat gauche, newbieish kind of guy with a bit of an analytical streak, and I’m trying to put together just what happened (or didn’t) for me the other day. Keep in mind, I’m looking for things that can be worked on, not for excuses to fall back on. Figuring (hoping) the collective wisdom of ST could help me out a bit.

I did my second Olympic distance tri on Sunday. My first, down in Tuscaloosa at the start of the season, was no tour de force - 2:34 something - but I could live with it. My first attempt, after all. I have no background in competitive swimming or running (a lifelong soccer/hockey player), so I’m playing a lot of catch up - and I recognize I’ll never really catch up with folks who’ve competed in those sports and can knock out 6:30 miles or lightning fast swim times for fun. (I make up a little bit on the bike).
That’s ok. I’m giving up ~ten years to much of the collegiate division to begin with (as if that really meant anything), and while I’m a diligent (4-5 days a week) trainer, I’m not obsessive. Training consistently, if not maniacally, with our tightknit little club here, I figured I could nip away at that time in races throughout the year. A couple minutes here, a couple minutes there. Slow and steady improvement is my kind of thing.

Which brings me to the Scarlet and Gray on Sunday. Not going to get into a full race report, but the essential details are:
My swim sucked. I felt it right away in the water, and sure enough, I was around 4 minutes slower (!) this time than I was in Alabama. It was a slog, plain and simple.
I never felt really strong on the bike, where I typically feel strong and reel some swimmers in. As it turns out, I came in a couple minutes faster, but never felt like I got up to speed.
I actually felt a bit better/faster on the run this time, particularly the second 3 mile loop. Of course, that means my run time was slower than the 'Bama run, which I had really suffered through. That was a little strange.

To put it all a different way, I knocked over 11 minutes off my time the second time I did a nearby sprint two weeks ago. But after the better part of 2 months good training (though admittedly, it hasn’t been very meticulously scripted/planned week-by-week, and my “taper,” with a big boozy wedding and cross-country drives thrown in, was haphazard), I snipped about 20 seconds off my Oly time - still right around 2:34:xx. I could probably chalk that improvement up to not screwing up in transition, as I did in 'Bama. Not nearly so impressive. I expected better.

No one wants to run in place, much less slide backwards. I didn’t do that, but I felt right from the start I was having a blah day, and had one. I’m sure it happens to everyone. What do you do when this happens for the first time? I mean, besides go right back out and train more. That’s obvious - I’m looking for something a little more technical, maybe a little more causal. Stuff I can act upon.

As in; the swim. How the hell did I lose 4 minutes? Now, I hadn’t been in water for two weeks (travelled home for a wedding, not much training besides a couple runs); did I lose whatever I had that quick? (and that ain’t much. Again, I can swim, but I’m not a lifelong competitive swimmer). Is that a legit factor?
Two weeks ago I actually beat my (much faster swimming) teammates in the sprint swim; this time, they beat me by miles. It wasn’t even close. I did have some sighting problems (foggy goggles), but really, 4 minutes? Seeing “30:XX” after my name in the swim sank my heart. Does a bad swim just happen sometimes?
For that matter, did the fact this was a lake swim, vs. a river swim the first time, make a difference? I would have thought any effect from the current would cancel itself out, going with then against it.

The run; why am I stuck at running 8 min+ miles? I’ve gotten down to 7:20-30 in training, if not for 6 miles at a stretch. But it sure as hell didn’t show up on Sunday. If I’m not a marathoner-shaped whippet, I’m not really bulky or anything like that.

I guess I am trying to put this all together with my goals, my expectations, and the mental aspect of it. I know from lurking around here that there are quite a few elites and/or hardcore elite aspirants. I’m not complacent - I’d like to be good, and have definitely made some strides - but I’m not expecting to be banging out 1:55s anytime soon - or ever. That’s my philosophical side; I know I’ve got limits, for the time and attention I can give. I figure (and maybe some of the more eternally-determined people out there will chide me for this) there’s a wall I’m going to run up against at some point, where I’m simply not going to get any faster. I just don’t think 2:34 is anywhere near that wall.

Was I being unrealistic to expect improvements to come so steadily?

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Deal with and get back out there. You had a bad race so what. It happens and it could be a number of reasons. It will take some races to see any improvement. Last year this time i did a 2:55 olympic. Now im down to sub 2:20 and closer to 2:10 when i am feeling all there.

Remember when you are just running you don’t bike before so losing 20-30 seconds is possible till you are used to it…

And don’t give up quite yet on those college athletes. I was swimming a good 40min 1500 last year and im down to a 23. Just keep training and eating away at there times cause remember they have been doing it for awhile they are starting to have a harder time improving you’re just starting.

Grant

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A couple of comments.

  1. Endurance racing has a lot of variables and sometimes you just have a bad day. And yes an olympic distance race is endurance racing to some degree-not IM or marathon, but 2.5 hrs+ of exercise is not just like a 10K. Alot of things need to come together to have a great race. I would say that if you felt like you slogged and ended up about the same time, then you did OK.

  2. You cannot compare swim courses between races as they are too many variables–current, wind, course accuracy, etc. Even from year to the next on the same course, there can be a lot of variables. Plus how straight you swim can be a big factor.

  3. It is unreasonable to expect big drops with every race. You are probably not at the “wall” of your performance limit, but you may be at a current plateau.

  4. As far as getting faster on your tri run–get stronger on the bike, so you have more left for the run and do more brick workouts, so you can practice getting into that race pace groove right off of the bike. Also do a couple of 5ks or 10Ks through the summer as training races to get the feel of running faster as well.

  5. Slow and steady nipping away at the clock is not really how people get fast. Usually it is by building a strong training base, improving speed and strength over the course of the season (in training–benefits may not been in every race as you may be “racing tired”) and then tapering towards a big race with a big time drop all at once.

Good luck with the rest of your season and be patient with the progress.

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Thanks to both of you for that feedback. Now that I’ve gotten past the stage of just doing the events, and beginning to look for reasonable goals, I’m interested in the trajectory
of improvement that most people experience. That’s what makes those goals “reasonable,” isn’t it? :slight_smile: I’ve looked at the previous times of teammates (a couple of whom are much faster than me now) and see that even a year ago they were around (or slower than) what I’m at now, so the curve is clearly there. It’s just a thing of learning what it looks like and how to keep moving up it.

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was great to see you guys out there again this weekend.

A few things, as was just said, you need to get in the training, this stuff takes time, and keep building it up. about half of my training i feel slow/tired, and some races are like that, but then once i take the rest/taper, i feel amazing. you need to overlaod your body, then let is rest and rebuild.

that being said, i had a shitty swim this weekend as well, i was about 3 min slower than at nats.

keep at it and it will come.

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Michael - Here’s my $.02

  1. You’re compaing a sprint this year to your first sprint **last year. **Typically you’re going to see some pretty sizeable gains from your first year to the next. Comparing 2 olympics within the same season…typically you’re not going to see tremendous improvement - the time window is just too short. Now you’re probably getting into factors such as how well rested you were, how you felt on a particular day etc. Not to say you couldn’t have a “breakthrough run” but typically you won’t see the type of improvements from your first to second season.

  2. In terms of comparing your swim position to the same people in different races. That becomes real tricky…just too many variable at this point to make any sense of out it.

  3. IMO - if you want to continue to see gains in your performance, plan on sticking with the sport for awhile. Based on your background and lack of experience, I would spend a lot of time in the off-season focusing on one to 2 areas. If you think your run is where you’re not fulfilling your potential. Spend all winter and fall running. I’m sure you know there’s a gazzillion things you can do to improve (e.g., hills, miles, tempo work, bounding, etc.). Get a focused program and work at it. Develop your engine and body into an aerobic machine.

After that initial spike in performance gains, it’s all about baby steps and making small but continual improvements.

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my “taper,” with a big boozy wedding and cross-country drives thrown in, was haphazard . . . .

Generally speaking, big boozy weddings and cross country drives can have a significant affect on performance, particularly if the booze made you dance late into the night ;-). It does take a few days to rest up from such events and if you wrapped some hard training around the wedding and drives, you were probably more tired than you realized on race day. It sounds like you did not feel all fresh and springy during the race which is a sign of some fatigue. It doesn’t take much to take the edge off and if you are just 1/2 of percent off for 2.5 hours, the time can slip away in pretty big chuncks.

I’d chaulk it up to the events of the days before the race and forget about it. If you matched your previous time under these conditions, that is actually a pretty decent performance.

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I haven’t had a chance to talk to Craig yet, but looking at the times, the swim course seemed a little long.

Hope to see everyone at Columbus International.

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yeah that seemed a little long, i know i have not been swimming as much over the past few days but over 3 min slower seemed like a lot, and there were not waves really.

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Agree with what others have said. A few additional recommendations:

  1. Keep a log of your pre-race workouts. This way you will find out what works for you, e.g. whether a rest day or easy bike ride the day before the race helps.

  2. Pay attention to the technical side of racing. What’s your cadence like on the bike? Your turnover on the run and swim? Vary these factors and see what works.

  3. Pay attention to the mental side of racing. Think positive thoughts before and during the race. Rehearse these thoughts in training and use in racing.

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First off NEVER compare swim times from race to race. Not even from the same race from year to year. Compare them to your fellow racers’ times. For example, a VERY well run, well-established, and well-respected sprint I’ve done for five or six years has a “half mile swim.” In those 5-6 years, the swim has been approximately 400 m., 800 m, 900 m., and 1200. m. Oops. If I were just looking from year to year, I’d have wondered how I coud be 5 minutes slower, too.

Second: Some days, you can do EVERYTHING right and still have everything go WRONG come race day. Sux when it’s your A race, or whatever, but that’s just the nature of the beast. All you can do is accept thats ometimes the wheels fall off the bus for no reason whatsoever, suck it up, and go on.

Third: You’re not going to see leaps and bounds improvements EVERY race. And not everyone improves at the same rate or has the same level of fitness or excels in the same sports. You and a teammate may train at exactly the same levels, and you may get down to 7 min. miles, and he may not drop below 8. People are different. I have a friend who picked up tris about the same time I did. She trains on the bike dilligently, puts in a lot of miles, and still struggles to maintain an 18 mph average on races. I raced this weekend and held 21 mph on pretty much no training at all. But she can crush me in the swim without ever setting foot in the pool.

You’ve done TWO races. I hardly think you need to be afraid you’ve hit the wall of improvement threshold. Give it some time. My best races didn’t come until 2-3 years into the sport–and that was with racing 7,8,9,10 times a season and a lifetime of running races behind me. (Not that I’m elite, or even all that good…just relatively speaking).

Patience, grasshopper :wink:

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Thanks again for the feedback, guys. I really appreciate all you’ve had to say - it’s been gold.

I certainly didn’t expect to make leaps-and-bounds improvements every race and I don’t want to come across so incredibly naive or brazen. For me, it’s just really helpful to get a idea of what to expect, through a year and then some, through the various races I’ve done so far and will be doing in the future. I know it can’t and won’t happen instantaneously; just as I don’t want to be needlessly brutal on myself, I want to know whatever I’m doing for training is somewhat effective. Of course everyone’s different, but based on the fact that I’m developing just the same as most other people, at least I can make a decent guesstimate. Time will tell, and I’m cool with that.

Don’t get me wrong, I had a lot of fun at the race Sunday, anyway. The time is the time - like someone else said in another thread today, the training itself might be the real measure of “success.” I like that, actually; I’m happy when I finish a race because I think about the work I dedicated myself to doing beforehand. I’ve tended to be quite hard on myself in the other sports I play, especially when young - I expected a ton for no real good reason, and when I didn’t perform, got way down on myself. One of the things I realized the other day about tris is that I don’t get that way, because it takes so much hard work, even for the very talented, and I don’t think of myself as “very talented” at all in this. Decent for where I’m at, and will get better over the long haul, but not a natural who “should” be just effortlessly astounding at this. Then again, I suppose the nature of the sport is that no one is really like that. And that’s good.

I definitely think you’re right about focusing on the running, Andy. That’s where I have a lot of room for improvement. Part of it is just getting into the mindset of being a runner and enjoying running. I like it better than I ever did before, not seeing it quite so much as punishment to be endured anymore, and sure enough, I’ve been slowly building up the miles and getting into it. And the point you made about comparing two sprints a year apart with two Olympics a few months apart is something I thought about while writing that, too.

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who cares about the swim time, all the swims are different even the same race with the same course. I find that they just throw those damned buoys out there and say yeah that is about 1500m or 800m or what ever distance it is supposed to be. But i think i am in agreement that a strong bike leg will allow you to run better. but there is no substitute for running or for swimming or biking. i always run after a hard bike ride. that way i always run on tired legs. your legs are going to be tired when you come off the bike.

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We all have bad races, maybe you were overtrained, maybe you needed to eat more, sleep more…maybe, maybe,maybe. Trust me, I know, I was very dissapointed after IMAZ this year, but im over it and signed up again, not every race is going to bring you a sweet new PR. thats part of the fun, there is always something to work towards.