Gwen back to tri

Triathlon Forum
81

She could close her athletic chapter, go back to being a CPA, and probably work to being a partner at a top accounting firm making more coin the current pursuit.

As a CPA who was at the same firm she was at the time she worked there, I can’t imagine thinking the 15 plus year path to partner she’d have to work through would be better than what she’s doing right now or other lucrative options that will present when she does hang it up. She discusses mom guilt and not wanting to travel excessively, both are things that would be infinitely worse should she come back to the enjoyable world of corporate finance/accounting :wink:

Wouldn’t her CPA have lapsed long ago? I doubt she has been taking annual CEU requirements or whatever is necessary to keep it active. So that would mean retesting on material she hasn’t looked at in over a decade.

I doubt she has any intention of ever going back to accounting. Coaching is probably her next step.

82

I’ll give you a mind blowing scenario for you that is able to happen that leaves you WTF.

Knibb and Spivey make the team w/ GJ 3rd discretion pick. GJ “skips” (DNS) the individual race to save it for the MTR and then she isn’t picked for the MTR. She could be an actual Olympian that doesn’t participate in the actual Olympics.

There is no rule that requires athletes to actually race the individual event, only they are required to take up said roster race spot (you can’t use a substitute unless actually injured).

Add into the equation that they can have travelling reserves as well.

I never did get my head around the rules for Tokyo but Coldwell was in the holding camp as a travelling reserve right up until the last minute. I think she left the day after the womens race.

83

She could close her athletic chapter, go back to being a CPA, and probably work to being a partner at a top accounting firm making more coin the current pursuit.

As a CPA who was at the same firm she was at the time she worked there, I can’t imagine thinking the 15 plus year path to partner she’d have to work through would be better than what she’s doing right now or other lucrative options that will present when she does hang it up. She discusses mom guilt and not wanting to travel excessively, both are things that would be infinitely worse should she come back to the enjoyable world of corporate finance/accounting :wink:

Wouldn’t her CPA have lapsed long ago? I doubt she has been taking annual CEU requirements or whatever is necessary to keep it active. So that would mean retesting on material she hasn’t looked at in over a decade.

I doubt she has any intention of ever going back to accounting. Coaching is probably her next step.

Agree on not going back to accounting - i guess I don’t mind my career, but no way would I go back to the beginning and start it in my late 30s given what her other options surely will be. Also, unless she kept renewing her license her CPA definitely lapsed and she’s “inactive”. That said, she wouldn’t have to retake the exam - all the AICPA requires is you complete loads of CPE (or I assume that’s what CEU is also).

84

Pretty sure she said she hated swimming after announcing her move to running.

There was a time about 15 years ago, where top Coaches in Triathlon were scouring High School and Collegiate Swim and Track/XC results and trying to find those rare odd kids who were up there in the top-10, in the State or nationally in BOTH - Gwen was that. Full Swim Scholarship to Wisconsin, but gave up on swimming mid way through her time as a Badger and jumped over to the Track/XC Team.

It was thought that the cycling, particularly with the shorter ITU/WT draft legal format, while not being insignificant, was a bit further down on level-of-importance than swimming and running. To be a consistent winner at that level your HAVE to swim in the front pack, and be able to close REALLY strongly on the run!

85

In the interview she also mentions that folks in Boulder were catching on, along with other USAT people. No need to drag it out and have people wondering this and that, just announce and get to work.

86

I thought this same thing about Kanute a few years ago when he was eyeing the MTR. It seems to be quite the assumption for Gwen that even if she makes the team she would be selected for the relay. I think her approach isn’t the best. Her goal should be to make the team. Not get on the MTR.

87

Obviously being out of triathlon for so many years is going to leave a lot of unknowns for her return. This is exactly why it will be really interesting to watch. Of course she could totally bomb—look like Mola and be way out of contention from the beginning. But she also has potential to win. That’s a potential big advantage over most of the rest of the US women. Especially with the relay finishing with a woman, the need to have someone with that killer run is that much more important.

On a related note, I think GJ’s success or failure is going to be seen across distances. So if she is going to be useful to a relay team she ought to also be an individual medal contender. And if she has that kind of form, she should be able to qualify by right in one of the trial events. I don’t think discretion is her primary qualifying route.

88

It seems to be quite the assumption for Gwen that even if she makes the team she would be selected for the relay. I think her approach isn’t the best. Her goal should be to make the team. Not get on the MTR. //

Ya I thought the whole I want to race on the relay thing was kind of odd too. First of all you have to make the team of 3 in the individual, which is not going to be easy. She will have to take away a spot from 1 of 5 ladies who are ranked in the top 20 or so. And really, she has to take a spot from the top 3, all of which are potential podium athletes, with some very good relay chops on several of them, and this is not even counting Katie Z. Sounds like she is back in for another games, so it is going to be very competitive just to get that top 3 spot. And then to not race it becasue of the relay, I think not. Anyone on that eventual team is going to be a threat, and even if not, should be a domestic at the very least.

I think right now the only real spot I would give away is to Knibb, as she is likely to qualify first chance, or if she has technical issues, will likely get the 3 chosen slot if need be. Spivey should be on that team, but as we saw last year, you can be the best ranked in the world, a top pick for the relay, but still not make the team. Would be really shitty if that happened again, but of course now there are two new wrenches thrown into the mix with Katie and Gwen. She really needs to just out and out hit the qualifier this time around, but they can be crap shoots as we have seen in the past.

I guess we will have more information once Gwen get in that first Conti race, and the indoor super league one will be interesting too, a show of what real speed she has…Imagine Katie will be on a similar plan too, but maybe gets to start out a bit higher in the race selections…

89

Has Gwen stayed in the testing pool?

If not does that limit her ability to race pro until she has been back in the pool for 6 months.

Does she even meet the criteria for a pro licence?

Is her plan to do Sarasota? I think she will be very humbled in the SL supersprints.

90

Has Gwen stayed in the testing pool?

If not does that limit her ability to race pro until she has been back in the pool for 6 months.

Does she even meet the criteria for a pro licence?

Is her plan to do Sarasota? I think she will be very humbled in the SL supersprints.

Regarding testing, she was a professional runner. I am sure she never left the testing pool.

She holds a USAT&F elite license. That automatically makes here eligible for a USAT elite license.

I think she will do fine in Super League. And I am sure they want her. I really wonder if she is going to do the Montreal Arena games. Geez it is only 10 weeks away.

91

Likewise if you want to be a pro high performance in ANYTHING you have to relinquish seeing your family because their is a cost to be at the pointy end of anything. You can’t have it all. If someone wants to be a pointy end pro athlete, accountant, sales, exec etc etc…something has to give and the first thing to give is family time, because frankly the families know they trade off time with their member who is trying to be “high performance at X” to get the “upside of being high performance at X”.

No point having parental guilt. Or you opt to being moderate performance lifestyle, see your family and get lesser “professional upside”. All paths are OK, but you got to give time to get money or give money to get time.

Sometimes it may look like some people have it all from the outside, but generally we’re not seeing the full picture of decades.

I’d think though that there’s a reasonable path to being a parent in high end tri that doesn’t involve all the travel that ITU would bring. If she went the 70.3/PTO route, and mostly stayed in North America, then there are enough opportunities to stay at home and train without being gone for more than 6-8 weeks per year. Stay at home, train while the kids are at school/daycare (like any other parent) and race the NA circuit. Remember that Niels Van Der Poel shattered all the records by treating his speed skating more or less like a M/F 9-5 job, so its definitely doable to be an elite athlete with that kind of schedule.

Just looking at the PTO rankings, Paula Findley (who admittedly isn’t a mother) has managed to put together a 8th place without having to leave North America except for the Collins Cup, racing 7 times this year. Sarah True (who is a mother) is sitting in 10th, only having left NA for Kona and for Collins, and raced 5 times this year.

Now granted this path might not be a viable path to #1 or even a gold medal, but there’s a path to being Top 10 in the world or maybe top 20 which doesn’t involve crazy amounts of travel or ridiculous sacrifices from the family side.

92

Thanos knew

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iCMcSx1as3c
.

93

When she switched to running, pretty much every (frequently triathlon focused) podcast she went on she talked about how she didn’t chose triathlon, it chose her, how she hated swimming, etc., really always thought she was a runner, and was generally very negative about triathlon as a sport. I think she was likely just burnt out but with her aforementioned lack of self awareness it just came across as super negative and trashing the sport that had given her all her success and an audience in the first place. I know I found it kinda jarring and disappointing.

I remember this announcement and the interviews. Is there like an arrogant snob thing going on here? “Hrrrrmph - I’m better than you”?
Or does she live in a bubble - which a lot of athletes do? I mean - she won Olympic gold - for god sakes can’t take that away from her.

The whole “divine proclamation” thing is getting a bit tired. The whole “humblebrag” thing is getting a bit tired.
But at the same time I do prefer people just be honest. Don’t tell me a fake struggle p0rn story if the first 5k you ever ran in your like without any experience or training was 16 minutes. Just say hey “I ran the 5k and discovered I was a machine - who knew”

I’m not telling, I’m asking? Is she amazing or does she reek of privileged and seeking more fame?

94
  • She has very little MTR races to try and “showcase” her ability, and I would guess at the WTCS races she’s not going to be a top 10 talent.

i’m stuck on this line of thinking. so what’s her play? i imagine that macca might be interested in letting her race superleague. that could be the best training for MTR.

doesn’t do anything for her ranking, though. . .

Personally I think this gives her another 2 years with sponsors and is just that.

Her lack of self awareness will likely be her downfall. She is returning to a sport that she treated with contempt when she left. The sport has moved on and she will have to rise to that.

I don’t think she will be on the start line. Taylor and Taylor, Ackerman, Katie Z and possibly Summer R will all be in the queue in front of her. Plus whoever else pops up through the development rankings. Your women are outrageously strong.

If she works with Jamie Turner after the scandal at Tri Aus she is extremely foolish.

There are worse things once greats can do to remain relevant, like say, go on Piers Morgan and burn bridges and fake cry at the World Cup, so… Good luck to her but based on the response here this is a dud move. It may provide some content and fodder for a future book and speaking engagements but the sport has moved on.

I don’t think it’s a dud as much as she maintains this social media presence of she can do anything. Which I understand at that level that is the mental piece you have to have, but the verbalization of that mentality is off putting at this point after she completely blew up in the I’m going to win Gold in the Marathon messaging.

If I was any of the top 4 women right now who have been kicking ass since Gwen left, I’d be saying go F yourself if you think you’re taking my spot. Gwen used to also have a mental presence in the bike pack of shit if she’s still with us I’m screwed. That is gone too now. None of the women care what she did five years ago from a competition standpoint. She’s gonna have to reprove she deserves to be there. That’s a hard sell.

This is all coming from someone who has always been a big fan of hers. These announcements are just moronic.

Thank you - I’m getting a bit tired of divine proclamations:
IN 2024 I WILL WIN A GOLD MEDAL AGAIN!!!
Competition: “Haha - how bout a tall glass of NOPE!”

95

I’ll give you a mind blowing scenario for you that is able to happen that leaves you WTF.

Knibb and Spivey make the team w/ GJ 3rd discretion pick. GJ “skips” (DNS) the individual race to save it for the MTR and then she isn’t picked for the MTR. She could be an actual Olympian that doesn’t participate in the actual Olympics.

There is no rule that requires athletes to actually race the individual event, only they are required to take up said roster race spot (you can’t use a substitute unless actually injured).

Totally possible (it happened to Richard Murray in Tokyo, although in his case it wasn’t that he wasn’t selected, it was because they had to scratch their relay, so he was stuck racing a mini-tri around the olympic villiage and streaming it on YouTube), but will require some serious results from GJ to even get selected… Gwen announcing a comeback could go any other way than how it went down, it’s going to make a splash when a former olympic champ un-retires. That said, I wonder how clearly she understands the current state of qualification/selection, that there are no relay specific slots, and that a quota spot is a quota spot. With the depth that the US currently have on the ladies side, that likely means getting into the top 30 in the world to even enter the conversation. Her hitting the minimum ranking for selection will be relatively simple (although she’ll want a fast and furious first part of the season before qualification window 1 closes, because you can only count 6 results in any one window towards your OG ranking, but up to 11 total, not posting more scores in the first window is what screwed GB leading into Tokyo, and specifically screwed Ali Brownlee), it’s making any sort of convincing argument for a discretionary pick that will be tough. I would say her best route in was to get a result that auto qualifies, but not sure that she can find that type of form by the test event. Either way, this struck fear in the hearts of all of the other American women, because it increases the pressure to get an auto-slot, since it’s one more variable in the discretionary selection gong show…

We’ll see too if she sticks it out until then, or has a change of heart when she sees how racing has changed. The sport was starting to shift when Gwen got her gold, With Flora taking her first world title that year, but it was really the next year, that the women’s event changed with enough athletes who could seriously disrupt the race with their swim/bike (and the year after that when more of those swimmers upped their run…). GJ’s run is still there, but like Mario Mola, may be completely irrelevant if she’s getting lapped out/too far back after the bike… And not only has the swim gotten much faster, but there are also fewer horses in the chase to close on the breakaway, with Ash Gentle and Jodie Stimpson going long, Spirig & Holland retired, and Jo Brown back in school, there aren’t many people left that can drive a serious chase to close down the leaders. There’s maybe some ladies like Beth Potter who fit that archetype, but her swim is stronger than GJ was, so it would be a chase even to catch up to her… I hope she gives this comeback a solid try and is somewhat relevant in the OG conversation, just to add some intrigue, but also fear that she gets to like 99th in the world, and then gets selected with a discretionary pick, denying multiple women of a slot who are top 30 ranked, and legitimate threats. She also announced this too late for other women in the program to consider switching nationalities (Both Kasper (Candian born) and Spivey (mom is Canadian) could race for Canada, but it’s too late at this point to make the switch on time for Paris).

96

I’ll give you a mind blowing scenario for you that is able to happen that leaves you WTF.

Knibb and Spivey make the team w/ GJ 3rd discretion pick. GJ “skips” (DNS) the individual race to save it for the MTR and then she isn’t picked for the MTR. She could be an actual Olympian that doesn’t participate in the actual Olympics.

There is no rule that requires athletes to actually race the individual event, only they are required to take up said roster race spot (you can’t use a substitute unless actually injured).

I see this as totally plausible and quite a frustrating possibility. Besides what the other folks who have responded to you have said, my mind immediately went to the swimming world - same situation, where you have a limited roster. Team USA brought Natalie Coughlin in 2012 (many time medalist, 2x100m back gold medalist) after she missed qualifying individually. She swam in the prelim for the 4x100m Free Relay, but didn’t swim in the final - still winning a bronze medal as an alternate. Different situation as the swim team has many more roster spots, but a similar kind of discretionary pick for an athlete with a storied history going to another Games.

As much as I wanted Gwen to succeed, it just seems like such a publicity stunt and one that may pay off for her making an Olympic team while taking a spot from one of the women who would actually race the individual race.

Am I misremembering that there were talks around adjusting the rule that you can’t skip the individual event?

97

I havent read that rule, I think the only rule is that MTR roster is from the individual race roster (IE the federations qualified/picked “Olympians”)…that allowed the MTR to get added since no “additional” athletes are added to the numbers game.

98

Surprised by so much negativity. Yes, there’s again the big bold headline effect “going for gold” (again) but similar to her marathon pursuit she seems very realistic about the challenges ahead; I bet she has done her homework and knows what are the obstacle and potential path to make the team better than any of us. Her run is probably stronger than ever, she never completely stopped biking or swimming, especially through her last pregnancy so she’s already coming in with a strong base. She has a gold medal, if she had not been plagued with injuries, she did have the potential to go for a second one in running and I would at least give her the benefit of the doubt for her 3rd attempt. Nothing to loose. We can at least all respect that she’s trying, not afraid of challenges and putting it all out there and not just taking the easy way out. I get that most men will find her chanel “boring” but for most mothers she has been a key role model and a source of good advice.

99

I’ll give you a mind blowing scenario for you that is able to happen that leaves you WTF.

Knibb and Spivey make the team w/ GJ 3rd discretion pick. GJ “skips” (DNS) the individual race to save it for the MTR and then she isn’t picked for the MTR. She could be an actual Olympian that doesn’t participate in the actual Olympics.

There is no rule that requires athletes to actually race the individual event, only they are required to take up said roster race spot (you can’t use a substitute unless actually injured).

I see this as totally plausible and quite a frustrating possibility. Besides what the other folks who have responded to you have said, my mind immediately went to the swimming world - same situation, where you have a limited roster. Team USA brought Natalie Coughlin in 2012 (many time medalist, 2x100m back gold medalist) after she missed qualifying individually. She swam in the prelim for the 4x100m Free Relay, but didn’t swim in the final - still winning a bronze medal as an alternate. Different situation as the swim team has many more roster spots, but a similar kind of discretionary pick for an athlete with a storied history going to another Games.

As much as I wanted Gwen to succeed, it just seems like such a publicity stunt and one that may pay off for her making an Olympic team while taking a spot from one of the women who would actually race the individual race.

Am I misremembering that there were talks around adjusting the rule that you can’t skip the individual event?

As mentioned above, this happened in Tokyo with Richard Murray, who skipped the solo, but then South Africa had to scrap the relay because Schoeman was out (I would have said that it was the last straw for him to switch to racing for the Netherlands, but he had been training with their team and attending their camps for years leading up to that…).

As of yet, there has not been a change to any of the OG rules mandating that everyone start the individual race (even if they did, you would just have a bunch drop out in the swim). If memory serves, the athletes wanted to have the choice themselves to have the opportunity to race the individual, several athletes were not happy when their federations scratched them to focus on the relay. There may be some athletes happy to scratch the solo to focus on the relay as well, but most of the athletes want to compete and give it a go… The limits preventing distinct pools of relay athletes and individual athletes is not a World Triathlon limit (I suspect that they would be quite happy to have full fields in the individual race, as well as a competitive MTR), it is a limit on the number of athletes imposed by the IOC…

100

I think the issue is what happens to many endurance athletes, and I think when “social media” is such a big side of your identity it opens yourself up. But in endurance sports, athletes need social media to basically take advantage of their situation to make the most money. I mean they can make as much money from sponsors as they can from the sport, unlike say a QB in football who can make huge salary and can then be radio silent because their family is completely wealthy supported from the sport alone. So there is a give and take there that I think creates the “social media” side of an athlete and the “performance” side of it. Some athletes imo have much more genuineness than others.

I think her biggest limiter is going to be can she swim front pack and then hold wheels. Like if she can- she has legit shot to be picked. But if she’s coming from the chase pack that is too much of a liability in this sport. Hell she won a WTCS race coming from 90s down to win a race. That’s how good she was and imo how “weak” her competition was when she was on her roll. The sport is completely night and day, and yes she knows that. Go look at her prep for Rio, she spent a month riding on a motorcycle going 120mph down the curvy mountains of Cali w a pro rider getting over the “fear” of the fast steep downhills, which is what the course had at Rio. What happened? She was smiling the whole time on the bike look at Spirig saying “can’t drop me anymore”. So she is one of the most dedicated athletes to the actual details of the sport I’ve ever seen. Her story of even deciding to go “all in” after London was incredible.

Her biggest weapon imo is being able to recognize “demands of competition”. Hell her husband Pat is Knibb’s agent, so I know she sees what she is doing, the training etc. She recognizes the MTR you can’t have any limitations or you won’t get picked.

But there is also some reality she’s facing. She’s the 2014 Hunter Kemper trying to make his last Olympic team. So many similarities and he didn’t ever leave the sport. He suddenly just got “old” and “slow” and it was very apparent that was the case, but he had 4 Olympics to hold his hat on. Being too old isn’t a bad thing- Father Time is basically undefeated unless you are Tom Brady lol

There is a huge difference in using swimming as cross training and actual ITU swim demands of competition. While yes she has stayed in the water at times, swimming was her biggest weakness in terms of needing “partners” to show up every day and grind. Obviously she’ll get that living in Boulder but that to me is the make or break point. If she can’t swim front pack, it likely will be too much of a liability for her to be chosen.

I think her next issue is timing. When is she going to showcase her talent on WTCS level? Like small time conti cup races will do NOTHING for her other than race practice and getting back into the flow. She’ll do great at that level of racing in women’s field….they are soft compared to top level. Much softer than the men’s depth. And I get it, she needs that to get rid of racing cob webs, but they won’t be much to gather from because again the levels are so far apart. so she’s only going to have a few races to even “showcase” if that. Like why would usat put her in the mtr test event if she’s still in the “proving herself” stage of comeback. I think she could go as an alternate which is what happened to US at the Tokyo test event w McElroy pulling out w/ a niggle and putting in a male who didn’t race individual event. Knibb and Spivey have showcased where the bar is, we’ll see how close she can get to it.

I will say this. Imo Kasper and Rapp are no longer “medal winning” individual athletes even though they are top 15 world class athletes. They kinda remind me of Iden, world class but don’t have the next gear to actually make a podium. Rapp imo has struggled w the bike/psyche and that’s holding her back (she is changing coaches). Kasper imo just doesn’t have podium talent, even though again she’s top 15 world talent. That means that the door to the 3rd pick is there imo. I would put Kasper as a better Mtr pick over Rapp (in current 2022 form) but again far below both Spivey and Knibb.