I rode Big Sugar last weekend with the Pirelli Cinturato Gravel M which has more pronounced side knobs than Pirelli’s Gravel H tire and a minimal center tread. I felt confident on the M’s.
Did it seem like you saw a lot of other people with flats? I go back and forth between those Pirelli tires and Ramblers or even Ravagers if I’m riding a lot of single track. It seemed like a lot of people were in town with some questionable tire choices, but I didn’t do the race to see for myself.
The weekend before for Little Sugar, which I did do, was flat city with a lot of people with poor tire choices for the area.
Yes, there were a lot of riders that flatted on the course. I stopped and gave up 2 CO2 cartridges to one guy and he was on Vittoria Terreno Dry’s as I recall. But that gravel in northwestern Arkansas was pretty brutal!
I put the Cinturato’s on the Monday before the race (700x45 up front and 700x40 in the back) and had three pre-rides with them before Saturday. If it’s a race I care about finishing, I always change to new tires the week of the event.
Oh yeah and one other n=1 experience. My son also rode Big Sugar and he was on Schwalbe G-One R tires in 700x40. He changed his tires out on the Thursday before the race as well and didn’t flat.
I used the Kenda Aluvvium Pro (seems to basically be the new, improved version of the Happy Medium) at Unbound this summer. It seemed to handle well enough, plenty of traction, all that, but… (and there’s always a but) the sidewalls weren’t robust enough, IMO. It wasn’t the rocks, though it might have been had I not been pretty cautious with line choice. Nope, I took a pretty hard square-edged hit in a creek crossing that pinch flatted my front tire. The impact should’ve been a pretty bad burp, but the rim cut the casing in two spots (right at the bead and a little further up the sidewall, same side of the tire).
For fast rolling courses with relatively mild gravel, might be a good choice. For chunky stuff, can’t recommend it.
Sorry for going a bit off the OP’s topic - any thoughts on the Panaracer Gravel King Slick’s. Looking to get a set of these 700 x 35 for my All Rounder bike on dedicated For Gravel Wheels - swapping these in for Gravel Rides and setting the Road Wheelset aside.
For you… I’ll allow it
What’s your ride these days? Last i recall you are mostly road and brown pavement? You don’t really drop into gnar gravel much?
I’m still in the learning process of what certain treads are for certain conditions. Am i wrong to assume that large side knob is for loose over hard but rather is for mud? Just going off of “this is what i’ve experienced” at this point.
Can attest to big side knobs and sand from OTGG… would get wrenched in odd directions at complete random there.
Glad you raised the point on Challenge’s rubber offerings. I’ve been very confused by that.
In clinchers I’m seeing…
Vulcanized Clinchers
Handmade Tubeless Ready
Handmade Clinchers
Vulcanized Tubeless Ready
What are the differences between handmade and vulcanized with regard to durability, ride quality, or tubeless set up?
One point of irritation I had on this a year ago (when i learned about the GG being crap compared to previous iterations) was that most retailers do not distinguish which of the 4 types they are sending you. I ordered what was labeled a TLR only to check the SKU upon receipt and it was a non-TLR version.
Thanks for the Cinturato rec… would prefer a little less on the center line tho
The Terreno Dry would be the closest in our Gravel range although as mentioned, the Mezcal still works well if you want more grip / ride more varied terrains. You can check out our new website which has more infos and comparisons across the range: https://vittoria.com/collections/gravel-bike-tires
Depending on the width you’re looking for, you may also want to check A. Dugast; historically, tubular only cyclocross tires but we have now started making them as clinchers.
Yes, there were a lot of riders that flatted on the course. I stopped and gave up 2 CO2 cartridges to one guy and he was on Vittoria Terreno Dry’s as I recall. But that gravel in northwestern Arkansas was pretty brutal!
I put the Cinturato’s on the Monday before the race (700x45 up front and 700x40 in the back) and had three pre-rides with them before Saturday. If it’s a race I care about finishing, I always change to new tires the week of the event.
Oh yeah and one other n=1 experience. My son also rode Big Sugar and he was on Schwalbe G-One R tires in 700x40. He changed his tires out on the Thursday before the race as well and didn’t flat.
40s? Bold choice haha but glad it worked out. 45 is as narrow as I’ll go out here personally, with a preference for 47 or 50 even.
Sorry for going a bit off the OP’s topic - any thoughts on the Panaracer Gravel King Slick’s. Looking to get a set of these 700 x 35 for my All Rounder bike on dedicated For Gravel Wheels - swapping these in for Gravel Rides and setting the Road Wheelset aside.
Those roll very well and are cheap. Complaints are that can be very loose on some rims (more rim tape needed) and puncture a lot. According to bicycle rolling resistance, they are only 1.8 mm thick in the center, which is thinner than a GP 5000. I got many good miles out a a set, but moved on after a few flats that wouldn’t seal. Last one was from a pothole that I didn’t see. Couldn’t repair it.
For slicks, I’m on Schwalbe Pro One Addix 34. Much more durable so far (confirming reviews) and roll as well or better (per BRR, but they don’t feel as supple as the GKs). But they cost about 2x as much and run a little narrower than labeled.
What’s your ride these days? Last i recall you are mostly road and brown pavement? You don’t really drop into gnar gravel much?
A year ago I bought a Argon-18 Krypton Pro.
It’s not a pure Gravel Bike - more of an All Rounder. Gravel for me is Rail Trails with a finer aggregate and gravel and dirt roads that are reasonably smooth and in good shape. Nothing to aggressive. Was riding on these on 700 x 25 Conti GP 5000’s for years, albeit with a bit of caution. Rolling 700 X 28’s now, but contemplating other options.
It’s not uncommon for me to head out for a ride where 1/3 of it is gravel and 2/3s is pavement!
I’m still in the learning process of what certain treads are for certain conditions. Am i wrong to assume that large side knob is for loose over hard but rather is for mud? Just going off of “this is what i’ve experienced” at this point.
Can attest to big side knobs and sand from OTGG… would get wrenched in odd directions at complete random there.
The GG would be just about my last tire choice for that long sand day at OTGG, yuck! I bet that was… interesting.
The mud tire side knob/file tread center section is kind of a weird combo, and as posted up above, it hasn’t been around for all that long. The thing with this style of tire is that those big side knobs grip really hard when they grip, but you have to get up on edge to make them work. With loose over hard IME, I want more straight line grip than they provide -especially when it comes to braking traction - and I’m probably already sliding sideways a bit before the side knobs bite, and when they bite they bite hard. You can really feel that in the sand, as you noted.
I think they’re really good on grass, and surprisingly good on some kinds of wet courses, where the ground is basically firm but it’s not dry. Fudge like consistency. Fudge mud also tends to be really sticky, and the Chicane style tread doesn’t have anything for mud to stick to, which can be really useful when other tires basically get packed full and turn into (essentially) slicks. I don’t like this style of tire on hardpack, the side knobs can just sorta jump up and bite you as you start to lean into a turn.
Honestly, I think there are generally better gravel tire designs out there, and some fairly aggressive tires roll surprisingly well, without the quirks of the the Chicane/GG. But I’m definitely not one to try and talk people out of what they like, tire-wise! Everybody drives the bike a little bit differently, and off-road, different styles work better with different types of tires.
I’m still in the learning process of what certain treads are for certain conditions. Am i wrong to assume that large side knob is for loose over hard but rather is for mud? Just going off of “this is what i’ve experienced” at this point.
Can attest to big side knobs and sand from OTGG… would get wrenched in odd directions at complete random there.
The GG would be just about my last tire choice for that long sand day at OTGG, yuck! I bet that was… interesting.
The mud tire side knob/file tread center section is kind of a weird combo, and as posted up above, it hasn’t been around for all that long. The thing with this style of tire is that those big side knobs grip really hard when they grip, but you have to get up on edge to make them work. With loose over hard IME, I want more straight line grip than they provide -especially when it comes to braking traction - and I’m probably already sliding sideways a bit before the side knobs bite, and when they bite they bite hard. You can really feel that in the sand, as you noted.
I think they’re really good on grass, and surprisingly good on some kinds of wet courses, where the ground is basically firm but it’s not dry. Fudge like consistency. Fudge mud also tends to be really sticky, and the Chicane style tread doesn’t have anything for mud to stick to, which can be really useful when other tires basically get packed full and turn into (essentially) slicks. I don’t like this style of tire on hardpack, the side knobs can just sorta jump up and bite you as you start to lean into a turn.
Honestly, I think there are generally better gravel tire designs out there, and some fairly aggressive tires roll surprisingly well, without the quirks of the the Chicane/GG. But I’m definitely not one to try and talk people out of what they like, tire-wise! Everybody drives the bike a little bit differently, and off-road, different styles work better with different types of tires.
Thank you for describing exactly what I couldn’t about this type of tire.
It’s why I suggested the Tufo’s above, as they have a consistent knob which means consistent traction as you lean, and they’re fast too.
Thank you for describing exactly what I couldn’t about this type of tire.
It’s why I suggested the Tufo’s above, as they have a consistent knob which means consistent traction as you lean, and they’re fast too.
De nada! This time of year, I spend a lot of my time talking about CX tires with training clients, so lots of practice describing these things!
Tufo really seems to be doing some solid work with their gravel range. I’ve been running the Thundero on my CX bike, and I think it’s just about the best thing out there for people trying to hit the 38 tire section that USAC is allowing for non-elite fields now.
'19/'21 Day 1 wagon road, and '19 Day 3 finish were awful. Slow speed and sand and i was getting throttled all over the place.
Oddly though, '19 Day 4 was a pixie dust sand day but we were going much faster and i didn’t have trouble there. ¯_(ツ)_/¯
Looked like there was a lot of fudge last weekend in euro cross. Koppenberg looked more proper mud but haven’t watched yet.
Is there a resource that you can point me toward that discusses the nuances of what different tread patterns are designed for and who or what ride style they are best suited for? Thanks!
Is there a resource that you can point me toward that discusses the nuances of what different tread patterns are designed for and who or what ride style they are best suited for? Thanks!
The cyclocross people are good for this. Tire talk is like religion to them. Here is one “beginner” example.
The cyclocross people are good for this. Tire talk is like religion to them. Here is one “beginner” example.
Honestly, that writeup… isn’t great.
Saying the PDX - which is essentially a copy of the Dugast Rhino - “shares a pattern with the Baby Limus” is (kinda hilariously) off base. The Baby Limus is well known to suffer in straight traction, which is where the PDX/Rhino pattern excels. Just… no.
They knock the Grifo pattern, while recommending as “modern” two brands that both offer Grifo copies as their mid-conditions options?
Yikes.
There’s some decent stuff in there, but consume with a large grain of salt.
