Is this golf wrx or slowtwitch?
You guys want less pros, I want more professional racing, that requires pros to get off their bum and race.
So you restrict the validation period and the number of races someone can do between earning a pro card and when they are are required to formally forgo the pro card. This will eliminate a couple hundred I’m sure.
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That will never work. It is hard enough to get cities and towns to give race organizers road permits for like 8 hours for 70.3, getting IM permits is next to impossible and becoming harder and harder. Doing a waved race with multiple starts at different times could take days of road closures. Not going to happen.
Almost all races are done by waves. Dont think any mass start races exist anymore. CAT start would have only 3 to 5 waves,vs a wave for every 5 year AG 20 to 80
BOP Pro. I’ve been saying that there needs to be a third category. The difference between AG, TopAG/Bottom Pro, and Top Pro is just too big. Top pro’s are winning IM’s >60min faster than top AG’s. There’s not a ton of incentive to move from AG to Pro just to get whipped every time you race, that’s the other half of the problem. AG’s meeting pro criteria every time they race but not taking the license.
Third category in between gives this group somewhere to go.
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I got a Pro spot at Ironman Canada twice in the 90’s and even got a Kona Pro spot one year. They handed them out to drinking buddies back in then.
In Swansea the start schedule was: 7am MPRO, 7:05 WPRO, 7:10 Amateurs.
But the complication was that the water temperature was 22.5C and rising so non-wetsuit for the Pros but still wetsuit allowed for AG: with the effect that the lead AG swimmers would surely interfere with the women. Anderbury, who ended up #2, would’ve been caught in T1 (the amateur men lead swimmers went under 25).
After representations (and chat during PTN ‘live’ pod (with a fair few IM Team members in the bar)) they moved the WPros two minutes forward to 7:03. Which ensured that interference with WPros who were competitive was minimal.
Kleiser in the water is a lost cause (DFL she was overtaken in the water (7 minutes lost) but then ran straight past these male ‘swimmers’ on the long run over the bridge to T1). And her bike is strong: she was caught by only one man before T2. In fact she overtook three ‘MPros’: Huisman NZL, McManners ‘FIN’ and Graf DEU.
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Nobody is addressing the elephant in the room: DRAFTING
I only enter small races or larger ones in the Elite category (that is with a different start than AG) because I really hate drafting
And I know I’m not alone (respecting the 12m, if course 
)
And then there those Tour-sized pelotons of people who would rather draft …
Furthermore, I know several people who could (should?) get a pro card but prefer to win their age group and then post about going to Kona in Instagram
So, do you feel the need to criticise BOP pros? Well, get your shit together and solve the drafting issue first!
One last thing. We cannot compare LD Tri with any other sports. For example: I’m really proud that both women and men compete on the same course at the same time with equal prizes. So let’s embrace our heritage and singularities and let’s not try to become every other sport
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Jackie Herring with some strong words regarding slow male pro’s interfering with the womens pro race at IMLP. Starts around the 5min mark.
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David Pinsonneault wrote for ST at one time and was among the slower group finishing 32 out of 34 finisher in a time which would not have gotten him in the money in the women race and would have placed him 15th in that race…
Not meaning to shame him just stating facts. Maybe he could chime in or be asked hm how he feels about it. But yes, it feels that Pro Series Race should be limited to athletes who are in the top 150in the PTO / ex ITU-Olympians or ex top 50 coming back from injuries…
The arrogance and entitlement is gushing here. There are way more diplomatic ways to say it’s becoming an issue and there needs to be a solution. Pissing on people just makes you look sore and doesn’t endear you to their first-world problem.
Until IRONMAN indicates they would prefer professional men to DNS than cruise a local race post-illness, I will make the most of my unlimited race entries
The only genuine issue of slow/new pro men is if we fail to yield to women and cause bike drafting problems. I pulled over during swansea when I realised a handful of pro women were catching me before a technical section. I was also chicked by the women’s winner in another race this season, so I stopped pedalling to get her and the motos past me asap.
If there are guys facilitating women drafting or blocking them instead of yielding, then refs should be dealing with that in the moment. But if a late 40s oldschool pro is still hanging around, or a young lad is sick of paying thousands just to see how many times they can win their age group… revoking entry to the pro field just because they’re a crap swimmer and decided to tough out a bad day? It’s no less “pro” than blowing up and walking the run.
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Yea, which is what Jackie references in her video. She took it upon herself to tell the male pro to get lost.
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I don’t think it’s a bad thing that the “frustration” to sorta put a face / voice on the one’s who are actually dealing with this issue. Maybe they are sorta complaining at the wrong people, but I look at it from a different angle than the other gentleman does. Not arrogance, but frustration. Sometimes it’s good that that is actually voiced, maybe that can lead to change.
@emceemanners your actions/strategy is basically what I think everyone would want to happen (if they don’t improve the issue from a pro card standpoint/race timing setup- gap between men/women)
easy fix… if MPRO starts with 5 or more minute head start… getting passed by a group from behind should be lapped out. for a DQ
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easier fix, get better on the bike. No offense, but if you are a pro male getting chicked after starting with a lead, you should probably re-evaluate your training
So we trash the slow male pro a lot…but what about the slow female pros? Do we care to have opinions there?
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I had a mate in Oz years ago who was a top tier age grouper and he used to call the womens field “the novelty race” . Mind you,that was when going 9:45 put a female in with a chance at a podium.
The slowest female pro Kona qualifying time I have heard of was something like 13hrs in a rolldown.
Guys with a swim background get media kudos for being near the front. Free high-end bike, sponsored wind tunnel session… Rockstar pro even if they finish behind the budget-biker slow guys receiving the stick for “not being pro enough”
Want to cut pro status from anyone who DNFs while you’re at it?
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5 mins isn’t a lot vs the very top pros. LCB starts a race and even some of the favourites are getting gapped in the swim for an Ironman.
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