If you are 70 kg and can push 300 W for 20 minutes (is this like a standard these days ;-)?) in a reasonable bike position, you shouldn’t be getting dropped in these rides. Some something doesn’t add up, is your power meter calibrated? Do you have a range of cadences you are comfortable with? It is a lot easier to handle accelerations if you can get up to 120 rpm comfortably. Watch the guys that do the points race for example. How is you 1 minute effort compared to your FTP?
The front pack guys, some who are bigger (which is what got me thinking of this in the first place) riding 20-50w on average more than me. My 1 min is not that great, Last specific trainer try it was 420, but then on a out door segment I did similar watts for 2 min (yes I got the CR). Anyways, my sprint ability is not good imo. Add edit… 120rpm… no way. I ride at 60-80. maybe that is what I need to work on
I too think there is something there. I do masters TTs and the norm is for the top guys to have logs for legs. Except for ex pros who just turned masters.
And yes, for sprint efforts maximum power is typically reached between 110 to 120 rpm. Power makes you go, but your legs feel torque, so rev up to keep up when it counts.
If you are 70 kg and can push 300 W for 20 minutes (is this like a standard these days ;-)?) in a reasonable bike position, you shouldn’t be getting dropped in these rides. Some something doesn’t add up, is your power meter calibrated? Do you have a range of cadences you are comfortable with? It is a lot easier to handle accelerations if you can get up to 120 rpm comfortably. Watch the guys that do the points race for example. How is you 1 minute effort compared to your FTP?
The front pack guys, some who are bigger (which is what got me thinking of this in the first place) riding 20-50w on average more than me. My 1 min is not that great, Last specific trainer try it was 420, but then on a out door segment I did similar watts for 2 min (yes I got the CR). Anyways, my sprint ability is not good imo. Add edit… 120rpm… no way. I ride at 60-80. maybe that is what I need to work on
The issue with riding 60rpm on a race (your 27mph group ride is effectively a race) is anytime there’s a slight acceleration it’s going to completely overcome your legs ability to produce enough torque. Riding along at 90-100rpm you can stand up and cover any attack, let alone a slight acceleration. Couple that with a poor sprint ability (read: low torque) and you have a recipe for getting dropped on all but the easiest of rides.
FTP isn’t even that important for criterium racing (again, effectively what this ride sounds like). A 300w 20 min power is cool, but if you have a low 1/3/5 min power you’re just going to get dropped when attacks go. These aren’t easy answers, but working on VO2 stuff will help, and pack skills will help more than anything. I’ve been racing bikes since I was a little kid. My NP in races is regularly 30 watts below the norm for the race just by surfing wheels and not being an idiot in the group.
Based on your last post, which is somewhat incongruent to your previous posts, VO2 work on 1/3/5 min power would keep you in the group a lot longer than any weight gain might
you see the power outputs they have its just they cannot sustain them due to lack of specific training (although greg seems better trained). I need those kind of power spikes
If you are 70 kg and can push 300 W for 20 minutes (is this like a standard these days ;-)?) in a reasonable bike position, you shouldn’t be getting dropped in these rides. Some something doesn’t add up, is your power meter calibrated? Do you have a range of cadences you are comfortable with? It is a lot easier to handle accelerations if you can get up to 120 rpm comfortably. Watch the guys that do the points race for example. How is you 1 minute effort compared to your FTP?
The front pack guys, some who are bigger (which is what got me thinking of this in the first place) riding 20-50w on average more than me. My 1 min is not that great, Last specific trainer try it was 420, but then on a out door segment I did similar watts for 2 min (yes I got the CR). Anyways, my sprint ability is not good imo. Add edit… 120rpm… no way. I ride at 60-80. maybe that is what I need to work on
Based on your last post, which is somewhat incongruent to your previous posts, VO2 work on 1/3/5 min power would keep you in the group a lot longer than any weight gain might
Not an expert, but yeah. That sounds right.
It also isn’t just the vo2 work but the ability to recover quickly to repeat those efforts. And yeah, you need RPM’s for vo2 and 30sec thru 1min power.
Richmond is a good Zwift workout for this. Ride it at Z2 then give it the “Sagan attack” on the closing two hills each lap. It’s a solid vo2 effort into a very small recovery right into a harder shorter 45sec or so attack. From there you can choose to try to spin it out to the line for the lap uphill OR recover the whole rest of the lap.
I dug up this post and would like to report my ftp is up from 285 to 304 without gaining weight. Example ride in picture attached. Workouts focuses on vo2 max rather than ftp helped. (plus 1 legged leg presses). I still think I look underweight. anyways, my 1 minute and less power is still my weakness.
Interesting that the old forum posts did not inherit the quotes by other users.
