cnn has an interesting article (http://www.cnn.com/2008/TECH/04/11/lzr.record.breaking.ap/index.html) about the new Speedo swimsuits that debuted in February and have been used in 23 world records. At what point do the governing bodies take a look at the current state of affairs and declare enough is enough? There’s a predicted 2% speed improvement of these suits compared to others, which is a significant percentage. That could be the difference between a non-medal contender bringing home some hardware or not. Sucks to be a country that doesn’t have the suit.
The role of technology was addressed some years ago in cycling, where now all attempts on the hour record have to revert to a bike “standard.” I’m all for technological progress, but when it comes to certain sports, shouldn’t athletic performance be the determining factor rather than performance+technology? What’s next? Weightlifters who wear suits with prestressed fibers which recoil and help life more weight?
The same thing happened in the late 60s/early 70s with the switchover from nylon to lycra swimwear. There was an American national championships right after the ‘skinsuit’ cam out where every single national record on the books was broken.
I like to think about issues like this and see if I can draw lines for myself that divide what I consider to be the right side of the line from things that go too far. The best I’ve done so far is the idea that something that is entirely passive that does nothing but improve your efficiency is ‘ok’. The added layer is that the technology can’t alter the fundamental nature of the sport. Your weighlifting example would obviosuly contravene the first rule but the speedo suit does not.
Some analogies:
Speedo Suit = Cermaic Bearings in cycling (though apparently a bit more effective :)) = acceptable technological advancement although it’s annoying not being able to compare old swimmers with new guys.
Hand Paddles = Recumbent style HPV bikes (I could have said non-double diamond bikes but that’s too controversial!) = Both fundamentally alter the nature of the sport and are properly not allowed.
Cushioned running shoes = nice cycing shorts - hugely important but passive - they help you do what you’re already doing better
Sprung running shoes = Flywheels on bikes - ‘active’ and properly illegal.
I suspect that speedo has planted all these stories that have hit the new york times, cnn etc. Since 2005 FINA has approved every suit for competition. If you have a new suit, you can’t use it in competition until FINA approves it.
So FINA has examined the speedo suit, done who knows what to it, and officially approved it. So this is all much ado about nothing, there’s no story here. The fina technical committee reviewed the suit, it’s fine. Let’s all move along now. I think speedo or others associated with the olympic movement areplanting these stories to keep the olympics in the news.
How’s this gem from the article? Emphasis is mine.
“Shirts made entirely from one type of material with a fully closed back are especially difficult, and may require several helpers to place the shirt on the lifter.”
If they stopped developing things all the helmet, wheel and bike mfg would go broke. Come on bigger, better faster and more. And if it don’t go chrome it.
What is the origin, or purpose of a speed suit. I mean other than to go faster? Seems to me in swimming (at least mens) a total of about 1 sq ft of material is all that is needed for decency. why allow anything more?
In adition to those companies, don’t you think it will increase viewership with records being broken? If people were swimming the same times year in year out with no records being broken a non-swimming fan wouldn’t care. Watching people breaking records is exciting. Much like higher scores are more exciting in baseball/basketball and the leagues have allowed/furthered this for what evertything is about… money
There’s a predicted 2% speed improvement of these suits compared to others, \
Once again, just like with a lot of the aero studies of our bikes and components, they exaggrate the time savings, if there is in fact any savings. If you do the math, 2% is huge, and we would notice it everywhere. I said in in an earlier thead that the records are being broken because it is an olympicyear, all the countries are having their trials right now with shaved and tapered athletes, and the underwater dolphin is being perfected by just about everyone. 2% is 2 seconds for every 100 seconds, which is about a 200 free. I do not see the 200 free being dropped by 2 seconds, or the 100 free by 1 second. Most records are being broken by tenths, like they usually are.
If this suit is so dam fast, why is the 1500 record still standing?? THere should be about a 15 to 20 second advantage there, and that is the event where a 2% savings would really show up. IT is all hype to sell more suits. I’m not saying that there is no advantage, if the suit floats, it is something, and the hydrodynamics of the suit will help too, but not in the amounts that you read about. The suits they were using were pretty good before, and to claim 2% savings is crazy, more like .2% if anything. There is the placebo affect too, but that would be entirely legal, and all these rumors just feed into that aspect…
"Seems to me in swimming (at least mens) a total of about 1 sq ft of material is all that is needed for decency. why allow anything more? "
I agree 100%. I’d love to see these new suits banned permanately. I don’t have a problem with techno bike improvements, but swimming should be kept more “pure” IMHO.
so T&F athletes should be racing barefoot and in loin cloths then? and pole vaulting with wooden poles?
T&F wear shoes because of the pain it would cause to run on a track without them so I would put shoes in the need category. Vaulting is a sport that requires equipment to participate. You do not need anything to swim (I wouldn’t mind seeing some of those women naked while they were swimming:-0…)
To me, putting on speed suits is the same as fairings on a bike. Put them in regular swim trunks and let them go at it.
How’s this gem from the article? Emphasis is mine.
“Shirts made entirely from one type of material with a fully closed back are especially difficult, and may require several helpers to place the shirt on the lifter.”
Yeah, no thanks.
I used to moonlight as a powerlifter, before triathlon. They have two classes of lifting in competition, raw (no shirts/suits) and open. Well, three really, since the Natural category openly submits to drug testing without complaint, as they really don’t use steroids. But the truth is, a shirt won’t help you bench 900 lbs unless you can bench 650 to 700 raw. And as for a closed back? The best shirts are open backed, and made of denim. They’re so good that people wanted them banned from competition. Deadlift suits, squat suits, knee wraps, weight belts, they’re nearly ubiquitous in lifting. Kinda like speedo skinsuits and goggles. Technology will change, and sport will have to accept it and adapt, or ban it and stagnate.
I think you are generally right, especially about studies by people selling products. But, I not that two wearers of the suits (Erik Vendt and Peter Vanderkaay) have both dropped their 1500 meters times by between 10 and 20 seconds this year, which is roughly consistent with 2% drop. Both are very experienced swimmers so these are significant drops, and you have to wonder how much of that drop was suit and how much it was training harder or better this year. In swimming, of course, .2% can make a lot of difference – I won one 500 by .03 seconds and lost another one by .012 seconds. You would hope that differences in suits aren’t so much that they really affect the results, especially because they aren’t available to everyone, and everyone won’t get a customized version.
two wearers of the suits (Erik Vendt and Peter Vanderkaay) have both dropped their 1500 meters times by between 10 and 20 seconds this year, which is roughly consistent with 2% drop.\
I would imagine that if you asked them, they would attribute their drops to hard work, a good taper, and the olympic year incentive. Lots of guys and gals are going to make big improvements this year, for the few reasons I already cited. A lot of people(not you) have been attributing the recent world records to the suit. When they break the 1500 WR by 20 seconds, then perhaps I will have to rethink my position… It’s great that those guys are making good drops right now, I think the distance events are going to be more wide open than usual this games. The Aussie dominance of the past decade is coming to a close, and they are going to try and squeeze one more out of their champion, even though it appears that he is well past his prime…
There’s a predicted 2% speed improvement of these suits compared to others, \
Once again, just like with a lot of the aero studies of our bikes and components, they exaggrate the time savings, if there is in fact any savings. If you do the math, 2% is huge, and we would notice it everywhere. I said in in an earlier thead that the records are being broken because it is an olympicyear, all the countries are having their trials right now with shaved and tapered athletes, and the underwater dolphin is being perfected by just about everyone. 2% is 2 seconds for every 100 seconds, which is about a 200 free. I do not see the 200 free being dropped by 2 seconds, or the 100 free by 1 second. Most records are being broken by tenths, like they usually are.
If this suit is so dam fast, why is the 1500 record still standing?? THere should be about a 15 to 20 second advantage there, and that is the event where a 2% savings would really show up. IT is all hype to sell more suits. I’m not saying that there is no advantage, if the suit floats, it is something, and the hydrodynamics of the suit will help too, but not in the amounts that you read about. The suits they were using were pretty good before, and to claim 2% savings is crazy, more like .2% if anything. There is the placebo affect too, but that would be entirely legal, and all these rumors just feed into that aspect…
I think your math is a little off A 2% speed improvement would not drop times by 2% anymore than a 100% speed improvement would drop times by 100% (i.e. to no time at all).
Furthermore, is it really a 2% speed improvement? Could it be 2%*** less drag*** and someone just misinterpreted?
2% less drag would NOT necessarily mean 2% more speed or 2% faster times anymore than 2% more watts on the bike would mean 2% more speed. There is not necessarily a linear relationship.
SO what then does a 2% speed improvement translate to in time??? IF something takes me 100 minutes to do, and I make a 2% speed improvement, do I not improve 2 minutes???
Not having read through everything, is it 2% difference in overall time due to the suit, or does the new suit offer a 2% improvement in drag compared to conventional speedos?