While it can be complicated, you never see pictures of obese survivors from WWII German/Japanese death camps.
how much more clear do you want the reference?
A better reference to make his point would be the fact that obesity in Amish populations is much less than in the general population, and studies suggest that it is the additional walking done by the Amish on a daily basis that may be responsible.
Really? concentration camp victims are your example of people being able to lose weight?
Forced starvation and genocide, the latest diet craze!
Concentration camps are a bad example. A better example would be France, or Japan, or Greece, or India.
There are more ‘skinny’ countries than ‘fat’ countries. The idea that obesity is genetic or otherwise ‘uncontrollable’ is contradicted by the fact that there are large differences in obesity rates between different nations.
So are there studies that show that the populations of your example countries don’t have a genetic disposition to being thin? There are countries that have genetic tendencies toward things. Ireland and Scotland may have as much as 6 times the number of redheaded people as the US.
By the way France is quickly catching the Americans when it comes to obesity. Some studies estimate that by 2020 they will have caught us.
France 42% Obese
US 66% obese
France is increasing at 6% annually.
If the research is correct in its conclusions, why would you get upset and indignant because it happens to challenge your world view that fat people just need to HTFU?
It has nothing to do with that perspective and you know it. This is giving fat people an excuse to continue their lifestyles and not attempt to make a change. Lets face it, it’s an epidemic and all of us are and will continue to pay for it in rising healthcare and insurance costs. It’s spreads to everyone to share the burden. That’s the only virus that’s spreading here. Where was this virus 20-30,40,50 etc… years ago when people worked hard because everything wasn’t automated and handed to us on a silver platter? The one fat kid in class 25 years ago must have spread his virus to at least 50% of the kids in class currently. It’s a problem that needs changing by human beings accepting that they need to take resposibility for their own actions and make a lifestyle change. They don’t need scientists trying to find a virus to excuse their poor and irresponsible decision making. It has nothing to do with HTFU. This virus was found in 30% of the obese population and 11% of the not obese population. Why then is that % in the not obese population affected? Maybe because they eat responsible quantities of food and exercise. It simply boils down to that.
I work in healthcare and my job is greatly affected every day by this population. I am more understanding because of this and realize there is a great deal of factors involved into someone being obese usually such as depression, chronic injury that causes decreased mobility etc… Exercise has cured a great number of depressed people on this earth and could cure a great deal more if people found some simple motivation to get off there asses. plain and simple end of story. They don’t need fuel for their fires. These scientists would be better put to work doing research on something worthwhile like ALS or cancer.
Obesity is caused by laziness, eating too much, depression, sometimes genetic disposition but can be reversed with a little work. It’s also a by product of this new human theory on entitlement. We think we are entitiled to everything. It’s the de evolution of man and it’s sickening. Our forefathers are rolling over in their graves.
So are there studies that show that the populations of your example countries don’t have a genetic disposition to being thin? There are countries that have genetic tendencies toward things. Ireland and Scotland may have as much as 6 times the number of redheaded people as the US.
By the way France is quickly catching the Americans when it comes to obesity. Some studies estimate that by 2020 they will have caught us.
France 42% Obese
US 66% obese
France is increasing at 6% annually.
That proves my point.
If we accept that obesity is largely genetic, why would obesity rates change over time? Even if the human species were somehow evolving to be fatter, evolution doesn’t move that fast.
You talk about what a huge problem it is that people are obese but then say this:
These scientists would be better put to work doing research on something worthwhile like ALS or cancer.
If obesity is the huge problem you say it is (and it is) then wouldn’t it be a good thing that these scientists are studing the causes and trying to find solutions?
Obesity Deaths Annually 365,000
Cancer Deaths Annually 553,400
ALS Deaths Annually 10,000? 1.8 per 100,000 (300,000,000/100,000)*1.8=5400
Admittedly I’m just pulling the first annual death totals off of google, but it looks like obesity is well worth studying.
Nobody is saying that genetics is the only factor of obesity, just one of many. just as diet, exercise, viruses, stomach bacteria, and probably many other things are. The whole point is that it is a complicated mix of factors and pointing to one and saying you just need to address this one factor is simple minded. But that is what we like to do in our society. We don’t want complicated, we want 5 minute abs.
The thin want to see the fat as just lazy and the fat want there to be a medical reason for their fatness and have nothing to do with their actions. neither is right.
Gaining knowledge of the causes of obese will help to prevent people from becoming obese in the future. why would you want to ignore one of the causes?
Good Calories Bad Calories
.
We already know what the cause and cure is for obesity. End of story. That was my point. Finding an excuse to be sedentary is not productive work for “intelligent” scientists. Moving more, eating less will prevent and cure obesity in most if not all cases. It’s not quite so cut and dry for some of these other real diseases. There is no question the rise of obesity in the last 10-15 years is directly proportional to the lifestyle changes that have occured. ESPECIALLY in children, and that’s where it starts. Not from some fucking virus. Parent shaped objects have been on the rise. Mothers and fathers are becoming extinct. We’re all scared to go outside and play/explore because the boogie man might get us, the real boogie man is lying under the couch cushion.
The biking thing is a weird one, since there have been lots of studies that show that there is less incentive for bikers to be low weight than runners. something that is born out by the relatively large number of fatties at my bike club and low number of fatties at my running club.
That is my experience also but there aren’t any cities where a majority run for transportation but there are many cities where a majority bike for transportation.* * I’d guess a running city would be even thinner than a biking city.
This must be the only virus that, in the day of international travel, stays confined mostly to the US and UK.
If only SARS and bird flu were so reluctant to spread.
That’s just it, we don’t really know what the causes are for obesity. otherwise they wouldn’t be finding out that things like viruses can change our weight. We don’t even know what food we should eat. Some people think that eating fat makes you fat, but the evidence is not quite so clear. Others think that your body takes cholesterol and puts it into your body without digesting it. We have had a huge push towards eating lots of grain and very little meat and the result has been increased obesity, maybe we should find out why. Would it be wrong to see this study and just give up saying that you just caught the fat bug? yes. would it be beneficial to know that you have this and know that if you just work a little harder you would be able to overcome it?
If you think you know all the causes for something you are probably mistaken. the world is way more complex than that.
http://www.thenakedscientists.com/HTML/content/interviews/interview/638/
McDonald’s+TV+Internet=Obesity
Honestly, do you think it is some coincidence that obesity rates have exploded since things like television and computers have become more accessible? Since it has become popular to eat fast food for 2/3 of your meals.
Our society advocates a sedentary lifestyle.
Starbucks for breakfast, drive to work, eat lunch at the cafeteria, sit in a cubicle for 8 hours, drive home, pick up Burger King on the way home, go buy some Dairy Queen for dessert, watch TV with the kids, sleep, repeat.
The cause of our problems is staring us in the face every day, but we want to deny it. We want to keep on living our lives the way they are, because it’s easy. Why change to a more active, healthier lifestyle, when it’s so much more difficult.
So instead, we will research things like an obesity virus, because it makes us feel like it’s out of our hands. We tell ourselves we’re fat because of our genetics. We can’t work out because we have health problems. We can’t bicycle commute to work because it’s too far.
And for the record, if obesity is determined by genetics, why are most countries fairly “healthy” (ie have low obesity rates), while the US has the highest obesity rate? The US is a conglomerate of people of all ethnicities. Do you really expect us to believe that only the people genetically inclined to be fat moved to America, while their healthy genetic counterparts decided to stay in their home countries? I believe it is because the American culture promotes a lifestyle that contributes to obesity.
And don’t get me wrong, I am absolutely certain there are diseases and such that contribute to obesity, but this makes up a minority of cases by far.
Thats why I am trying to stay away from fatties.
People work desk jobs now and work too much, or at least have too much time tied up in a work day with commute etc…(More sitting) Work has become very automated with a machine to do everything. As a result people simply move less than they used to. Combine this with .99 cent super special, supersized portions of crap food and whalla…There is your cause for obesity. Even those that don’t fall for the .99 cent super special and eat a little more wholesome still aren’t moving enough during the day. THERE IS NO QUESTION OF THE CAUSE OF OBESITY. NO question at all. We do know what causes it by large. There may be a very small % of the obese population that fall under this mystery virus but 90+ % fall under the real cause. Moving too little eating too much for what there daily activity actually requires. Too much caloric surplus because of lack of demand is the cause of obesity. It’s quite simple. Look around, people don’t exercise. Not everyone goes home and lives in Slowtwitch world like us. There aren’t many fat endurance athletes out there let’s face. The more you exercise the less fat you are. The ones that are fat just started endurance sports…If they are consistent for a couple years they won’t be fat for long. It’s pretty black and white in this case. Move more=weigh less.
Exactly. I have no doubt that genetics CAN play a part in one’s predisposition to obesity. But given that we can see a very direct correlation between a society’s move to a sedentary lifestyle and a rise in obesity rates, as well as an equally direct correlation between a society’s penchant for ‘crap’ food (in all its forms), it’s fairly obvious that genetics plays a VERY MINOR role when it comes to obesity.
Otherwise, you wouldn’t see the same rise in white people vs. black people, or tall people vs. short people… or men vs. women. When obesity rates rise across the board in a ‘melting pot’ society such as America’s, you know it’s not the genetics.