I’ve been doing this for sometime now and just actually calc’d the miles I put on my “last” pair of Saucony Freestyles. Up to this point I just bought a new pair when I felt like I was starting to get some little nagging problems and the shoes were looking worn out, really flexible, etc…
So I ran 115miles and used them for my lifting/core sessions (2Xweek). Almost 2 months old (12/13/04), maybe 150+/-miles w/ walking?
I typically do alot of trail running, although this winter’s been pretty wet/sloppy so I’ve been on the roads more than I’d like.
What mileage is everyone else getting from their flats?
The lowest # I got out of a pair was about 400. Most, if they worked for me, I got in the neighborhood of 1000.
Running in flats is very tricky, especially Saucony flats. If after 150 miles you are getting nagging pains, those are NOT the shoes for you. Get a different brand. The point of running in flats is to get a shoe that does not interfere with your natural biomechanics. You should be able to run in them until they fall off your feet. I had a pair of Brooks T3’s that were too much when I first got them. I wore them around for about 6 months and then I was able to run in them because they were all crushed and more flexible…
If you really want good shoes that will last a LONG time, go try on some track spikes. Saucony has a few new one that are good if you are a Saucony fan. Get one that fits really well, take it to a shoe repair shop and have them grind off the spike plate and attach an outsole. Vibrum has some great outsoles that ill work amazingly well on trails. You’ll get a good 1000 miles out of those shoes at least.
I run in them until the hard black rubber wears through to the soft white rubber across the whole forefoot. That’s been about 400-450 miles (3 months or so). I found that once I’m into the softer white “blown” rubber, it will wear clean through in a matter of days. Lacking time to get to the store, I once ran in a pair with holes in the forefoot for a week. Frankly, they didn’t feel any worse than a new pair.
Since I’m not relying on the shoes for cushioning or stability or whatever, there really isn’t an issue with the shoe breaking down and messing up my stride. So, I just wear them until the sole wears out.
Saucony shoes are flawed in design. The grid cushioning system has become dated and they hove not kept up the rest of the shoes design around the grid. Grid was good in the old days when many of the shoes were harder EVA’s or Polyurethane. The new grid has just become an obsolete piece of plastic covering a huge hole in the eva. By having the EVA cut out below the grid, they have created a weak point that can really encourage improper movement of the foot. Its just a sink hole for the heel. They have tried to compensate for this (because they don’t realize what’s really happening) by beveling the angles of the heel. Take a look at the Hurricane from behind. Look at the angle of the heel strike area. Not good. ITB problems waiting to happen.
The flaw of the racing flats is that they are not racing flats. They are Lightweight trainers. They didn’t really drop the height of the shoe. Most flats are on a 20/10mm platform, too high for me but better than most shoes that stand around 24/12mm The Saucony flats are still the same height off the ground.
Look, cushioning on running shoes is way out of control. 1st, 50% of the cushioning “systems” are a joke to begin with. 2nd, who needs 24-26mm of squish under their foot? 10mm of the correct material would be more than enough. Good luck trying to find a shoe with a 10mm forefoot and a 10mm heel. The shoes I run in have between 0 and 5 mm of cushioning and a 4-6mm think rubber outsole. At max I have 11mm of height and most of that is solid rubber, not some squishy eva. I have not had a running related injury in 4 years and have healed many people of chronic problems by switching them to WAY less shoe. (Kitty, are you listening?) The Saucony flats are not less shoe. They are injuries waiting to happen, as are all Saucony shoes except the spikes and XC racers.
The good thing about the saucony flats is that they are easily modified to make great shoes. Again, take them to a shoe repair shop and have them grind off the outsole and midsole (can leave a few mm if you would like) and attach a good solid rubber outsole. There you go! perfect trainer that will last you many miles and keep you injury free. (provided you dont make training mistakes)
<Running in flats is very tricky, especially Saucony flats. If after 150 miles you are getting nagging pains, those are NOT the shoes for you. Get a different brand. The point of running in flats is to get a shoe that does not interfere with your natural biomechanics. You should be able to run in them until they fall off your feet. I had a pair of Brooks T3’s that were too much when I first got them. I wore them around for about 6 months and then I was able to run in them because they were all crushed and more flexible… >
I totally agree with Mr LaWoof .
I have a pair of Nike Talaria(racing flat),that I bought about 5 years ago,and I’ve put about 900 miles on them.
I thought I was getting a racing flat until I learned the came out with the Freestyle “Endruance”. What the hell is that, it’s a trainer marketed as a racer. Maybe a wussy racing flat for people who don’t want a full out flat.
I’ve got a pair of Asics DS Flats that I only raced in, so they’ve got a couple hundred miles in them. I’m going to take those for a spin and leave the Freestyle’s for long runs.
I once ran in Kayano’s then moved down to the 2080-90 series then moved into DS trainers and finally reebok premeire competitions and DS racers… now when i go back to a more cushioned shoe there is simply WAAAY too much padding beneath me.
I took these events and related them to my podiatrist and orthotic maker. She said that in general it is better (if your body can take it) to run in a less cushioned shoe. The padding only tends cause more problems then prevent.
So now i am in GEL-Flash, DS Trainer and DS racer and all used with the orthotic. Rotating between these for my runs.
I tend to agree with all of you. Give me a shoe that is low to the ground, with just a bit of padding that well let my foot roll the way it wants to. Less padding is good if I plan to run on trail or dirt roads. In winter, when I have to do lots of pavement running, I find that I need extra padding since I am running on pavement almost exclusively (due to ice and knee deep snow on the trails).
Are you all saying that I should go for less padding even on pavement. After 25 years of running, I really don’t think my joints can take that. The padding seems to help on pavement.
I did a search, and rather than start a new thread, I’m tagging on to the end of this most recent one.
I’m toying w/ getting some racing flats. For use in Sprint and Olys and perhaps the occasional stand-alone run races. Don’t think it’s a good idea to use for a half IM, at least not yet. Possibly even for training too, as I have moved to a higher-cadence mid-foot strike running style.
I currently wear Adidas Boston Classics for all my training and racing, and they work for me - in fact I just ordered a new pair yesterday, this will be my 3rd pair of them (and counting). No issues ='s happy feet.
I have very narrow feet. Street shoe size is 9**B - yes B. **
So, as far as I am aware, the shoe brands that tend to run (pun intended) narrower are pretty much Adidas and Nike. (Pls correct me if I’m wrong)
From Adidas it seems the best “fit” in terms of weight and price would be the Cubato Plus. Light (7 oz) and not too spendy ($75). Adistar Comps are slightly heavier (7.6oz) and mo’ money ($85). Still worth considering.
From Nike - I dunno. The Zoom Pegasus Racer is only a fraction lighter than my Bostons, and more $ to boot. No real benefit there.
The Mayfly is silly light, but $50 for a disposable shoe (100k lifespan? get real.) is just silly. I’m not that fast (and never will be). I might pick up some Free’s to do my Strides in, for when I can’t get to the nice grass to run barefoot. But, I don’t think I’d wanna race in 'em…
I know the Brooks T3 and various Asics models get props, but would they (or any other worthy flat) work for my skinny feet?
The shoe that the pose guys seem to like are the Puma H Streets. I just got a pair of Nike Waffle Racer 3’s that are very nice and they only cost $35 at Foot Locker!
I just ordered H Streets… I am having a small problem with training in flats: I have been doing it for 2-3 years, and it does mess up my ankles sometimes. Interestingly, the cure for that is some barefoot running thrown in. It doesn’t matter how minimalist the shoe is, it is still very different from barefoot. I think shoes makes “pawing” difficult. BTW: barefoot has its own problems: stubbed toes, gnarly trails, glass,…
I have been spending a pretty penny of late on running shoes, mostly the Boston Classic, since I seem to start to have some fatigue and aches after about 250 miles in them. That has equated to about a pair per month. I can’t see how someone could wear shoes for 500 or a 1,000 miles without having issues. Not that I am doubting some of you, but I have not had that experience. If one is going to go to a lesser shoe, do I need to work my way into it, or should I quit “normal” training shoes cold turkey? Any thoughts.
A quick question for you- I have had ITBS in both legs for quite awhile now, on one leg I just had surgery on a torn meniscus. I have a relatively high arch and tend to put a lot of pressure on my outer foot. I am thinking when I start running again to use the Asic DS Racer or the Nike Free. What would you suggest.
A quick question for you- I have had ITBS in both legs for quite awhile now, on one leg I just had surgery on a torn meniscus. I have a relatively high arch and tend to put a lot of pressure on my outer foot. I am thinking when I start running again to use the Asic DS Racer or the Nike Free. What would you suggest.
Thanks-
I’m not Lawoof, but I have recently made the progression from the DS Racer to the Nike Free. Ran 24 km. in the Frees on Saturday and felt awesome, but I’ve been training in flats for over a year and I am a decidedly forefoot striker. If you’ve never trained in flats before I would suggest trying the DS Racer first to make sure you develop a good feel for your midfoot or forefoot strike and build better fascia strength before perhaps moving to a more minimal and far more flexible shoe like the Free.
do you use the waffle racers for running on pavement? I’ve been using asics tiger paw for all of my training now, and I’m liking it a lot more. Still, it feels like the heal is just a little high now that I’ve changed my style to a mid foot landing instead of a heal strike. On the rair occasion I run in my old trainers I feel like the big cushy heal is just getting in the way and is completely unnecessary.
I’m not sure if the waffle racers would work for me anyway…nike are generally too narrow for my feet.
I do about 30% of my running on the road. So far I don’t see very much wear on the shoes, although the wear probably depends on your running style more than anything else. The is little padding on these shoes so the heel is very low to the ground.
I have average width feet and the shoes feel pretty good in that respect. The shoes are definitely sized small, so you must buy it at least half a size up from your normal shoe size.