“Please explain the Mid-Evil warming period, and why they were producing wine in England during this time.”
We can only surmise that Cavechild asked this because he thought Michael Steele was correct about his global warming assertions. But, while that thread included commentary on GW, it was more about Steele’s qualifications. So, I bring you another thread for folks to ignore. Or comment if you like.
Anyway, regarding that question, here is one link for review. I haven’t read any articles declaring that winemaking in England during medievel times somehow disproves that GW exists or impacts made by man, but many right-wing commentators make that claim repeatedly.
Another way to put this concept is that we have tree-ring data that indicates that there were forest fires thousands of years before humans entered the picture. Therefore, it is impossible for a human or humans to cause a forest fire. Further, we know of thousands of species of creatures that have gone extinct without any human influence. Therefore, it is impossible for humans to cause the extinction of any species.
I’m just curious what others’ thoughts are on this. Is there a school of thought that I’ve missed that suggests a warm medievel Europe disproves humanity’s impact on global temperatures? Are there articles out there that concisely describe this thought?
** Further, we know of thousands of species of creatures that have gone extinct without any human influence. Therefore, it is impossible for humans to cause the extinction of any species.**
lol, did someone actually assert this?! What kind of logic is that?!
Further, we know of thousands of species of creatures that have gone extinct without any human influence. Therefore, it is impossible for humans to cause the extinction of any species.
lol, did someone actually assert this?! What kind of logic is that?!
Same logic as saying that the earth was once warmer than today and therefore we have had no impact. What’s wrong with it?
I just watched the history channel show on the “mini ice age” so I’m an expert. During the mid to late middle ages, there was a period of several centuries where the temperature dipped by a pretty goodly amount - a bigger shift than we are going through now. It got cold, crops failed, the Thames river froze on a regular basis, it snowed in June in places were it doesn’t snow much at all now, there was even a “year without a summer” etc.
We did not really come out of it until the early 1800’s. Wine grapes did use to grow in England back in the day. It was near the start of the cold period when the wine industry in England went to hell. (According to the opinions expressed by the History Channel, that’s when northern Europeans started drinking beer in larger amounts so it was a good thing but I digress).
“Global Warming” is really a seperate thing from climate change. There is definitely natural climate change and it appears there is developing agreement that there can be human caused climate change but the two are not mutually exclusive.
The fact the climate was different in the past really has nothing to do with proving or disproving “Global Warming”. I personally tend to think that since we have already endured climate swings similar to what the reasonable predictions of GW are, we are going to survive even if GW is true but the fact that the climate changed in the past without human intervention says nothing about whether or not humans are currently affecting the climate on a global scale.
Well, as far as I can understand it, the English made wine for a while. Then they stopped. Then they started again. Then they stopped. And now they are starting again.
This corresponds roughly with known warm periods. Since this is an example of a warming period that happened prior to human intervention, it leads some to believe that the current warming period is also unrelated to human activity. At least I think that is the reasoning. Or maybe it is that warming is good because we’ll get some fabulous English Zinfandel in a few years.
Well, as far as I can understand it, the English made wine for a while. Then they stopped. Then they started again. Then they stopped. And now they are starting again.
I’ve had English wine. We’d all be better off if they just stopped once and for all!
Well, as far as I can understand it, the English made wine for a while. Then they stopped. Then they started again. Then they stopped. And now they are starting again.
I’ve had English wine. We’d all be better off if they just stopped once and for all!
That’s actually one of the points from the article I linked to in the OP. Let’s see, the English could make their own crap or they could get good stuff cheaper from France.
Pre-prohibition, NC was one of the top wine-makers. Several groups have tried to make wine again and I’m trying to figure out if pre-prohibition people had no taste buds or if the climate and/or soil has changed here during that time, because I have yet to taste a decent wine from my state. Neither cheap nor good may be a more important factor than changes in climate.
It was good wine because the weather of England was similar to the South of France today. This increase in temperatures allowed for Europe to “rise” out of the dark ages. What was the cause?
But hey I’m with the Global Warming. We base the “history” of the earths temp on one inch diameter circles of one spot. But then when it’s pointed out that Antartica is getting colder, we’re told that’s local you have to look globally.
Were told all the ice is melting, yet the ocean heights are not higher. But that’s tough to measure.
With the extinction analogy? You’re kidding, right?There are numerous species of animals that are known to be extinct due to human activity. The best known example being the Dodo bird.
