All of this Tour coverage and the speeds the riders were posting on slack angled bikes has me wondering about my own bikes. I seem to ride more powerfully with the slack angled road bike. I’m no speedster, I’m a heavy guy and a “masher”, working on bringing up my cadence and speed. I need to post pictures but lemme describe a bit, anyway.
Tri bike: older Felt B2, 54 cm, Syntace C2/bull bars, 650 wheels. My seat post is as far forward as it’ll go to get my arms in a comfortable position on the pads. The bike’s relatively light, I feel fairly comfortable on it (although my longest ride on it has been about 40 miles), and I “feel” like I’m fast on it.
Road bike: cheap steel Windsor Leeds, 56 cm, wide road bars, Ultegra, rack on the back, no clipless pedals. I commute on this bike with panniers and a rack trunk, and it’s very comfortable for long rides.
I did a time trial on Amelia Island last month on the Felt, and averaged 20.4 mph for 30k. It’s a flat out-and-back except for 2 bridges that you cross twice each. There was a light headwind coming back. I felt like I pushed pretty hard but my legs felt dead from a hard training week that week. Mediocre speed at best…
Today I rode the road bike in to work, as I do twice a week. My legs aren’t particularly fresh, I’m wearing running shoes. It’s 17.75 miles one way, relatively flat. The bike had to weigh 40 lbs…panniers with clothes, rack trunk with a six pack of Diet Mountain Dew in it… No wind this morning to speak of, and I averaged 20.4 mph. (!)
I think the next step is to ride the tri bike in to work on the exact same route…if I’m slower I’m going to start throwing a six pack of beer on the back of the road bike and ride it in my races!
Some people are faster on road bikes w/clip-ons than on a dedicated tri bike. Don’t know why, not supposed to happen, but it’s a reality for some people. I know a few. One friend is faster on his Soloist in the road position w/clip-ons than on his P2K steep. Go figure.
I was going to post this exact messgae. I’ve been riding a Trek 2300 for about 2 years with clip-ons and a forward seat post. Two weeks ago I set it up as a road bike is supposed to be and I’m riding about 1.5 mph faster on average on all my rides, long and short. I thought it might be because of the time of year (better shape) but it’s not. I can feel it when I ride, I’m simply able to pedal harder on a road set up. I’m going to race in September in the road set up to see what happnes.
Isn’t the real advantage of the steep angled bikes the fact they won’t kill your legs for the run. My legs always seem to feel fresh coming off my tri bike as opposed to my road bike. But then again when you bike as slow as me it isn’t tough being fresh off the bike.
Isn’t the real advantage of the steep angled bikes the fact they won’t kill your legs for the run. >
I guess you are the first triathlete to get in on this thread. You are exactly right, and for most people( I said most), they will ride faster on the steep angle bike. Remember that the tour guys cannot go foreward because it is against the rules. Many of them will circumvent that by cutting the nose of their saddle off, or just really push to the nose of the saddle. The foreward position allows you to spin more efficentily. Many of you who feel faster grinding bigger gears in a slack position, might be the victim of your own training. It takes awhile to train yourself to spin more efficentily, and faster. But as I always say, everything is not for everyone, many ways to get to the same goal…
“Isn’t the real advantage of the steep angled bikes the fact they won’t kill your legs for the run. >”
That’s the biggest thing I’ve noticed. I’ve never been any faster/slower steep/shallow but my hamstrings are toast going into the run coming of a shallow angle. The P2K is just as fast for me no matter which way the seat post is flipped but my legs in the run prefer the steep angle. Even with my Giant TCR my hamstrings were fresher at 75/76 with a neutral set back seat post than the road position. Ironically, my run times aren’t any faster (always very slow) but the pain in the hamstrings over the first 2 kms is a lot less with steep angles.
My wife on the other hand runs just as well off her road or tri bike with no hamstring issues.
I can ride at 275W for 20 minutes on my road bike. I can only do 255W on my Time Trial bike. I assume it’s because I only ride the TT bike 10-15 times per year, but I ride my road bike 200 times per year.
I can ride at 275W for 20 minutes on my road bike. I can only do 255W on my Time Trial bike.
That’s probably true. It takes practice.
A side question is: On which bike are you faster? You have 7.2% fewer watts on the tri bike. If your CdA drops by more than that, the tri bike is faster.
My CdA on my road bike (riding on the clip-ons) is ~0.30. It’s about 0.245 on the tri bike. That is more than a 18% drop in CdA, meaning that I could get away with a 18% drop in power on the tri bike and still be faster. I could be at 250 watts on the roadie, and only 210 watts on the TT bike, and the TT bike would be faster.
As it happens, my power is the same on both bikes, so I don’t worry about it.
From the southern tip, over the bridge to Talbot, down Big/Little Talbot, over the bridge, then back. The next one’s this coming Sunday; I plan to come out for it again. Details are at http://www.nfbc.us/arearides.html
Isn’t the real advantage of the steep angled bikes the fact they won’t kill your legs for the run. >
I guess you are the first triathlete to get in on this thread. You are exactly right, and for most people( I said most), they will ride faster on the steep angle bike. Remember that the tour guys cannot go foreward because it is against the rules. Many of them will circumvent that by cutting the nose of their saddle off, or just really push to the nose of the saddle. The foreward position allows you to spin more efficentily. Many of you who feel faster grinding bigger gears in a slack position, might be the victim of your own training. It takes awhile to train yourself to spin more efficentily, and faster. But as I always say, everything is not for everyone, many ways to get to the same goal…
I understand the thought behind this, and I’ve read everything Dan’s written on the subject here on slowtwitch. The idea makes sense; heck, I went out and bought the Felt.
However, just as you said “most” above, I want to know what works best for me, so I intend to experiment. I am working on the spinning part, and I hope it pays off. I am so slow on the run regardless that some extra bike speed sounds mighty attractive!
I’ve not done a TT on my road bike with clip-ons, so I can’t answer your question. I’m going to start riding my TT bike more so that I can go the same power on both.
Note though that velocity increases with (roughly), the cube root of power. So if my CdA were the same on the two bikes, I would only go about 2.5% ( (275/255)^(1/3)=1.025) faster on my road bike. IOW, my CdA would only have to be ~2.5% lower on my TT bike for me to go the same speed. These are *very *rough calculations, but the point is clear . . . Aero rules.
No wind this morning to speak of, and I averaged 20.4 mph. (!)