EPO in tri?

ironguide · March 3, 2004, 8:18am

I was at my chiropractor’s in Antibes yesterday. Two little stories came up, one about a local amateur cyclist who was semi-pro awhile ago, who has nothing much in the way of results or career to aim for – but he’s on the juice (but still isn’t winning much). The other story is about the French championships a few years ago in Clermont Ferrad. The chiro’s sister-in-law is a nurse at the local hospital there and told him that in the days before the race when all the riders had arrived, the hospital’s entire stock of EPO went “missing” overnight!

Maybe doping is so rife over here that Marceau couldn’t possibly disassociate himself from those who use it because he’d find himself all alone! Then again, I shouldn’t generalize. There was a thread at another popular tri forum some time ago in which the North American writers were openly discussing which andro-including supplement would help them best and why they were entitled to take it. I know a late 40’s cyclist in Canada who supplements to help him tolerate his long rides every week. He’s stopped competing and justifies it in that way.

I could bring up another dozen stories of riders or triathletes caught, accused, or witnesses to doping. My favourite is about someone popping there head into the victory party of a major major triathlon years ago asking if anyone in the room could piss for him! Open and brazen. Anyway, I tend to keep more to myself than mix around, so I figure that if I have access to all these stories, it can only be the tip of the iceberg. Perhaps Bobo is right, the only way to stay sane is to adopt a cynical defense.

ironguide · March 3, 2004, 9:37am

I checked out Marceau’s site and the tests he posted. It takes courage and commitment to do so and I think it is commendable that he does this.

Now, take this with a grain of salt, because I’m going to play devil’s advocate a bit here.

Before the last Games, an athlete was required by their federation to go to a doctor and submit themselves for a full workup. The doctor was in Switzerland because the athlete was training there. Upon examining the athlete, the doctor asked “What would you like me to put on the form?” The response was shock and some dismay, but no surprise – the athlete simply said “be honest.”
Thereafter, the athlete’s coach had someone watch the waiting room of said doctor. A certain someone appeared regularly once a week. No comment on who/what/where/when/why – just an observation. This has nothing to do with Marceau, just a commentary on sports medicine in Switzerland.
If I’m reading Marceau’s latest results correctly , the Hämatokrit column for 02.01.2004 shows 0.50. I followed the link posted by François.

I am not making any comments on Marceau’s character or that of anyone else . He put the information out there, which says something. Obviously others are interested in what is going on or the links wouldn’t have been posted here. As someone above stated, the trouble is that we cannot know what is real and what is not. And so the efforts of those athletes who race “real” run the risk of contamination by the cynicism of guys like Bobo and increasingly myself. I used to believe that our sport was relatively clean and free of this, but I wisened up awhile ago.

The problem of drugs in sport is not an issue of the health of the abusers, it is an issue of the well-being of the clean and the real who give their all and make a total commitment only to find out they are up against corruption in the system and in their fellow competitors.

We watch sports and compete because it is a microcosm of our lives. We take inspiration from the achievements of those who prevail and win against the odds. We feel our spirits lifted when we hear the stories of the hurdles overcome by athletes who emerge as champions.

When we learn that these same figures were weak, that they were false cheaters, that they caved in to temptation, it demeans our spirit and our willingness to believe. It corrupts our optimism and faith in the greater good.

Former_User · March 3, 2004, 12:11pm

I have to admit that in the cycling world (and cat 1 in France was the last thing before pro when I was there, until they rename it elite 1 or 2 I believe)
and truly, I knew just a very few that were clean…many others would admit using something and I was offered “stuff” (pot belge, amphetamines, steroids…)…that said I didn’t care much, I thought I wanted to see how fast I could go, not how fast some stuff could make me and still managed good results.

Result: I have to deal with the fact that people cheat…ok…not any different than being a student…they were cheaters there too…

Now I could enter cynicism mode, but I decided not to. I recall a story that was VERY interesting (and hope giving)…A german and swedish physio lab (If I can find the reference I will put it here) wanted to show that you can reach your max level without drugs. Their theory was that the very efficient drugs in endurance sports (they focused only on endurance sports) were hormones we produced naturally and therefore, playing with training cycles, sleeping cycles and food intake, it should be possible to increase the amount produced in a natural way. They actually managed to prove this for EPO and growth hormon. They even contacted some professional cycling teams to tell them: there is an alternative to doping with adequate training, food intake etc…an insider told me the answer was “why would we do this, we can use injections”…

so, my take on drugs in (endurance) sports is that, there is an alternative. you have to be very dedicated, but you can do it without drugs, and be at the top. I know some guys at (or close to) the tops that are clean (people I know VERY well, that stayed home with me and have nothing to hide). I knew some in cycling (none at the top though)…

as for stories…we have plenty too… but I will keep my what you call naive take on the sport.

ironguide · March 3, 2004, 1:41pm

Hang on, I never called you naive! That was someone else. What I said was that you calling Marceau naive and a nice guy was reminiscent of what they said about Ben Johnson. I agree with everything you’re saying, but you came to a fork in the road where you decided to pursue sport to see what your own potential was, not to make a living at it or pursue it professionally.

I agree that human performance can be maximized without drugs, but what drugs do is enable the cheaters to reach the same or similar level without making the same sacrifices the non-cheaters need to make. That takes the soul out of it, more so when these people claim to be making huge sacrifices, overcoming hurdles, etc.

Back to the Marceau story. If you would be so good as to translate the story at the following link for the board

http://www.xclusivetri.com/01-mag/01-telegramme/articles/news151.htm

it would be make for an interesting discussion point. Marceau explains what happened, something like this: “I was riding with my cycling buddy and we started talking about banned substances. He told me that there’s products available that can help performance that are legal and without consequence for one’s health and that might help me reach my objectives. That’s where we left off… A couple of days later I get a note from this guy saying he knows someone who’s going to send some product to me, but I won’t be there to accept the package. Can I have him send it to your place?” etc. etc.

You get the picture. I have two problems with the statement:

i) In another news release it was mentioned the package was addressed to Marceau’s wife.

ii) I get registered mail sent to me here from time to time and when I’m not home to receive it, I head to the post office at my convenience to pick up the mail. Marceau’s buddy could have done the same. It’s not that hard.

It all doesn’t add up in my view.

Former_User · March 3, 2004, 2:55pm

There are doping stories around Olivier Marceau since the last world cup events in Nice, last september
Since the indicdent that happened on sept 10, 2003 and mentioned quickly and unclearly in L’Equipe, Oct 17 and 19, I feel the need to give frank and precise explanations about this incident.

I was riding with a friend (a cyclist) and we came to talk about the limits of doping (endless subject). During this discussion, he talked to me about legal and safe (health wise) ways to optimize my chances of success for my coming objectives. We then went apart during the ride, after these comments
A few days later, I get a phone cal from my friend who tells me “I know someone who will send me something but I won’t be there to get them, can I have them sent to you”.
I was surprised with this, but busy doing something else, I said yes.
Next day, phone call from the customs in Nice, telling me the package contained 5 vials of EPO. It is true that 3 days before the Nice world cup, in Nice, receiving this package…the scenario was clear for the custom officers and not looking good at all for me.
The report of the young cyclist who recognized being responsible for sending this without my consent, I was set free by the police.
But some people who must be bored to death in their lives, started spreading rumors, each adding his own little thing to the story to make it more juicy.
My team Poissy and myself went ahead and revealed everything before the team french championship.
The newspaper l’Equipe, also revealed the story in an article, correct, but not explicite. Several newspapers, radio and TV stations (specially in Switzerland) related the facts pushing forwards with
titles such as “Marceau in a doping story”, “France traps switzerland to steal away a chance of medal”, “Marceau risks 2 years of suspension for doping”, each wanting to be the first to reveal the information without veriifying the facts.

Let things be clear, I am an honest person, I have full confidence in my abilities as everything I did so far, I did it without illegal aid. I want to thank from the bottom of my heart the people who trust me and my team poissy who never gave credit to this story.

I entirely admit my lack of vigilance and being naive, but am still dedicated to be the best I can be etc…etc…

below the words of Remy Melano

I admit that comments of Marceau, and admit that I have put Olivier Marceau and myself in a delicate situation, without having measured the consequences.
«