Does anyone believe Palmeiro?

Triathlon Forum
1

Okay, so Palmeiro says he unknowingly used steroids. Implying that it was in some contaminated protein powder or other nutritional supplement. Then we find out he tested positive for stanozolol, the same thing that Ben Johnson tested positve for. No way that was in some product in GNC. So we have a couple options:

  • Palmeiro was really stupid in knowingly used a drug that has been detectable for 15-20 yrs or so.

  • He thought he was getting something else (the “clear”?) but was really getting stanozolol. That something else was obviously not something that was commercially available, probably some special “potion”, otherwise no test positive.

My guess is that it was option 2. Hey, he’s getting old, he wants to get to 3000 hits and 600 home runs. Asks the “doc” for a little something to help him deal with the aches and pains. Except he didn’t ask the right “doc” (was it Canseco??).

2

there was a poll on espn.com today like 50k voters and 93% didn’t believe him
.

3

Isn’t he the guy with the square jaw that needs Viagra?

Definitely innocent.

4

I believe that he’s really stupid, but also that he knowingly used. Now everyone’s starting to believe Canseco, who was very specific on his details of the use by Palmeiro and others. How about George W. saying he sided with Palmeiro? That seems to be a slight contradiction to his previous threat to remove all steroids from the game.

5

Baseball is among the least athletic of all sports, so why are steroids such an issue?

You would think that steroids would be a bigger problem in the NFL, NHL or NBA. Baseball players spend most of their time standing around. Presumably, steroids are used to help players hit the ball. With most players hitting less than .300 and the ‘power’ hitters hitting a bit above .300, it seems like a waste of time because the remaining .700 of the time, they’re striking out and hitting grounders.

6

just one comment…

Only 10 freakin’ days??? WTF???

7

No
.

8

good timing. i wrote about that and stuck it on slowtwitch this afternoon.

9

Presumably, steroids are used to help players hit the ball.

This has been addressed in another thread. The #1 benefit of steroids, in baseball, is recovery. During a long season (more practice hours than game hours), steroids help you to “not break down as the season goes on”. Essentially, you get to stay at your peak for months. The majority of players caught have been pitchers. Steroids also enable pitchers to build strongers legs, trunk, and back. Just as in other sports, the lower body and trunk are where the power originates.

Also, awhile ago being 35 was a “death sentence” in baseball. Your speed, reaction time, reflexes, etc all declined to the point where you were pushed out. Now, there are guys 35 or older having the best seasons of their careers.

Skill helps you hit the ball. Hitting a round ball with a cylindrical bat with less than half a second for reaction time is the single most difficult task to do.

because the remaining .700 of the time, they’re striking out and hitting grounders.

That’s because pitchers are flat-out the most talented, handsome, wonderful, majestic, athletes of any sport. Guess which position I played?

The difference in length ont he bat of the strike point that determines an out and a hit in incredibly small. With the talent of pitchers, the positioning and talent of fielders, and the strategy on tendencies of the hitters, it’s amazing they get any hits at all.

Baseball is among the least athletic of all sports, so why are steroids such an issue?

Only if you define “athletic” as “non-stop movement”.

Anyone ever try fielding a grounder coming at you at 80mph? Let alone fielding one not hit at you) It’s amazing how easy pros make it look. They make it look so easy that there’s thousands on people on the radio claiming to “be able to do it”. Peter Reid and DeBoom make winning an IM look pretty easy too.

With the exception of Bo Jackson and a select few others, I cannot imagine someone being more athletic than Rickey Henderson or Willie Mays.

I would love to take some of the posters here to a baseball game and just “talk baseball” with them and explain the difficulty, skill, and thinking that goes on in a typical, boring, standing around game. In return, I would ask them to take me to a triathlon and explain what’s really going on. I would enjoy that insight.

Oh, do I believe Palmeiro … I believe Palmeiro as much as I believe Pete Rose. In other words … No.

Turns out the big, dumb, lying Cuban (not my words) may actually be knowledgable and credible on the subject of steroids and baseball. I wish we hadn’t lost Caminiti, I’d like to hear more of his perspective (former MVP, admitted steroid user, died in the last few years)

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I’m guessing the Pres wouldn’t have made those comments if he knew what steroid Palmeiro tested positive for. Of course Bush does a lot of things that I would have guessed he wouldn’t…

11

“I believe Palmeiro as much as I believe Pete Rose. In other words … No.”

one guy bets on baseball, gets the bums rush right out of the sport… forever. the other guy cheats on baseball, gets 10 days… maybe.
in all likelihood palmeiro gets in with 3000 hits, and rose doesn’t with 4200 hits.

12

he doesnt look like he uses them
.

13

No, I don’t believe him. I didn’t before, and I have even less inclination after it leaked out today that the steroid he tested positive for is considered a stronger/designer steroid that would be unlikely to somehow ingest accidentally. This is from the AP story:

"Palmeiro, who plays for the Baltimore Orioles, tested positive for the powerful steroid stanozolol, a person with knowledge of the sport’s drug-testing program told the AP on condition of anonymity…
"Two New York newspapers reported Tuesday night that Palmeiro tested positive for stanozolol, a potent steroid that almost certainly could not have been taken by accident, and a source with intimate knowledge of the matter confirmed it Wednesday morning.
“If it’s true that he used that particular drug,” said committee member Rep. Stephen F. Lynch (D-Mass.), “it’s even more damning of Mr. Palmeiro’s conduct in this case.”
"Drug experts say it’s difficult to imagine a scenario in which an athlete could inadvertently or unknowingly consume stanolozol, which is known as Winstrol or Winny. Stanozolol is the drug for which Canadian sprinter Ben Johnson tested positive at the 1988 Olympics.
“Stanozolol, which has a very distinctive structure, is not found in dietary supplements and has not been associated with supplement contamination as have steroids such as nandrolone.”

I suspect the only excuse he’ll have soon will be the one about someone wanting to get back at him and slipping him something contaminated to set him up.

Ten days. What a joke. The only teeth in the policy is that a positive test is made public, but even then Palmeiro is reported to have found out in May. None of these guys should make the Hall of Fame. I think baseball should also pull McGwire’s home run record after his non-denial in Congress earlier. Hopefully Bonds will have the common sense to retire.

14

Presumably, steroids are used to help players hit the ball. With most players hitting less than .300 and the ‘power’ hitters hitting a bit above .300, it seems like a waste of time because the remaining .700 of the time, they’re striking out and hitting grounders.

I don’t want to say you know nothing about baseball, but… it’s way to obvious you know nothing about baseball. The ‘power’ hitters are ‘power’ hitters because they hit the ball long, not because they bat above .300. There are tons of ‘power’ hitters that don’t even hit .300.

In any case, Palmeiro is a liar, so is Bonds, and probably Clemens. Screw them. I hope these leagues (and federations) keep the drug tests of all the athletes and take back all the medals and awards these cheaters have won (and ban Palmeiro from the Hall of Fame)

15

“Gee wizz, I must have accidentally fallen on a syringe full of pharmaceutical enhancements”.

16

in all likelihood palmeiro gets in with 3000 hits

One of three guys with 3,000 hit AND 500 HR’s … he’s in.

**he doesnt look like he uses them **

Neither do many cyclists.

Different steroids have different uses … and effects. Not all steroids are used for “gains in muscle mass”.

Many steroids, such as those used by wrestlers, powerlifters, and other “weight-class” athletes, improve performance (namely speed and strength) without a significant increase in muscle mass.

If all steroids turned people into muscleheads with tons of acne and unruley roid rages … drug tests would not be necessary.

In any case, Palmeiro is a liar, so is Bonds, and probably Clemens.

I wonder about Clemens. He’s always been a big Texas power pitcher with an incredible workout regime. Ironically, one of the indicators of steroid use is a guy’s ability to work his butt off … all the time (my red-flag for Lance and others). I have friends that use steroids and they often talk about doing workouts day after day, when those workouts used to kill them for 2-3 days afterwards.

Clemens’s career … especially being as good as he is late in his career, without suffering many injuries, or missing many starts, is a red-flag to many.

I remeber an interview with Curt Shilling. He was asked, “When was the last time you felt 100%”. His reply, “When I was 17.” These guys, by using steroids (not saying Shilling does), are literally, reclaiming their youth. It will not be long, when the possibility of everyday guys using small amounts of steroids and growth hormone (very expensive right now) to sustain testosterone levels to fight the aging process will be common (my speculation).

“Gee wizz, I must have accidentally fallen on a syringe full of pharmaceutical enhancements”

I hate it when that happens. Steroids? I thought I was using Flex-All 454!

17

This just show the tip of the iceberg in sports like you mention. They and others make baseball look like a corner dealer compared to a crack house. My best friend tryed to play division 2 football and he was one of very few not on the “juice”, well for a month and he too caved and gave it a whirl. Like most of you I live in a football crazy town, and if they were to random the high school team it would make your heart sink. I would also see validity in many pro’s not knowing what they are being given, or perhaps they know but to a degree, but don’t ask as it certainly eases the guilt.

18

Does Nina Kraft look like she takes EPO? How about Tyler Hamilton does he look juiced? Hmmm, who else…Ahnuld? My 2 cents - Who really friggin cares? Why not have a doper class, like the clydesdales or masters class? Let the athletes (dopers) take as much as they can and let the drug companies try out all kinds of new and exotic chemical compounds to see if it is possible to do a sub seven hour Ironman race. That would be awesome! Be advised, there are recreational athletes that are on the cutting edge of steroids too. And high schoolers who are trying to get the full pop ride into an NCAA program. This is bigger than you think.

19

“If they were to random the high school team it would make your heart sink.”

This gets to the heart of the issue and is the response I give when I hear someone talking about “they’re all doing it so what’s the big deal?” or about having a “level playing field.”

My local high school football team won the 4AAAA state championships this year for the first time. I read the local newspaper article and it said that the average lineman on the team was something like 305-310 lbs. And most of these kids aren’t even 18! I know I went to a small town high school, but I’d bet there were only a couple of guys on the entire team over 220 or so, and they were obese, not these ripped Hercules types you see all over nowadays. I can’t believe the parents don’t storm in to the principal’s or superintendent’s office demanding an explanation.

20

Let the athletes (dopers) take as much as they can and let the drug companies try out all kinds of new and exotic chemical compounds

Hey … a bodybuilding fan! =)