More material on that than my frame…
€1650 isn’t as bad as I’d thought though.
Which means exactly what? I mean you and other testers here have come on with complete opposite results in all kinds of different measurements for different individuals, so isn’t this just another that what is good for one may not be for another? Everything from those top tube bottles, to angle/height of bars, calf sleeves, etc…
I would imagine Lucy has done a lot of testing, so either it is faster, or she needs it for comfort, both great reasons to have them I would presume…Or she is clueless, guess that is the 3rd option…
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Well, let’s take Steph as an example. The company that makes her bars describe their process. Guess what ? Aero testing in not part of their process. It’s all “fit” and pictures.
So yes, Lucy probably/maybe tested before, probably/maybe tested the final product, but there are pros that are not testing and going on the “hey other pros are using it, must be faster”. And it isn’t always. Granted many of these pros are not paying for this, so their waste of money is not as much as the AGer that mimick them.
And some of the guys I tested and found they were slower, had not tested.
Yes of course, but we are talking about Lucy here, not sure I would put her in that category. She “looks” to me to have one of if not the best Cda in the pro ranks. And of course the way she has to race makes that number so important, virtually always having her nose to the wind…
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This is just n+1
You say ask any age grouper . How many have you asked?
I’m British, raced IM Frankfurt 7 times ( first was 2008 ), also various other tris in Germany and never had a problem.
In Frankfurt in particular I usually end up having a chat with them in the bike. They’re volunteering, and do their best on a long day in the heat.
They enforce the rules, I don’t see the issue.
We spend most of our time complaining about rules not being enforced. When it happens, people still complain.
And then the racism of “being German” comes out as well.
The real issue here was not the enforcement, it was the communication.
At some points the German TV crew was being asked to relay referee information. This is a bigger issue.
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I mean yeah he technically dropped the cup 5 feet after the sign, but isn’t it still within a reasonable range of the feed zone? It’s not like he took the cup a quarter mile up the road and ditched it in the woods. I think it’s still in the general area of the aid station and didn’t put an unreasonable burden on the volunteers there.
Perhaps Ironman felt the same after the race and cancelled the penalty and the DQ by extension.
Why have a sign at all then? Just generally in the area is fine?
We as a society crumble without laws.
Did Magnus originally get a yellow card ? Was the red card a result of not respecting the yellow card or was red the direct result of the the littering offense ?
Not that anyone saw. Regardless of why he was being penalized, he and his coach did not respond in a professional manner.
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No he didn’t get a card at all, and I think that led to the confusion. And it was suppose to be either a blue (time penalty) or red (DQ) card (littering in this case). TO whistled/pointed for Ditlev to stop but that’s not generally the protocol, which then I think got him agitated, and then I think in response to the agitation, the TO gave the red card. I think he actually gave it more out of “unsportsmanlike” than actual littering. So the TO kinda fumbled the procedure of handing out the penalty, sorta re-grouped after what 10-15s and then showed him the red card. It doesn’t seem like the TO wanted to DQ for the offense. He just f’d up that part of the “penalty” which then got Ditlev bothered by how the TO was behaving.
I think if he would have originally shown him the blue card and he still didn’t stop, a DQ would be justiifed in that instance. Whether you think it’s a good or bad calll, if you get a penalty, you have to serve it. Telling an official you don’t have to serve it, isn’t likely how we want athletes to respond to questionable penalties. That would be a bit too chaotic. At some point we have to respect the officials call if we are going to give them the power to officate a race. I just think in this instance he sorta bumbled the initial penalty interaction.
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But there was a whole incident involving Kasper that happened at T2 that instigated all of this. He got into a heated argument with a TO who threatened to DQ his athletes. Kasper describes all of this on the TTH podcast.
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Yes but I don’t think that TO was then “out to get Ditlev” imo (it wasn’t the same TO I don’t think that Kasper had an issue with). If he dropped the trash beyond the litter zone, whether we think it’s a “bad penalty”, that’s by the rules allowed to be pinged for. So again I think the initial weirdness of how the official trying to penalize Detliev by not showing a card but telling him to stop was the confusion which led to the anger by Ditlev.
If an athlete breaks a rule, show the proper card to the athlete and then the athlete is required to stand down (or stop at next PT on the bike). Whistling/pointing to an athlete without showing a card, to stop I don’t think does anything but add confusion. That’s the importance of the card system, you know as an athlete what you basically did (minor- yellow; major-blue; DQ-red)
Are you sure? On the video that was shared by ST on Insta it looked like he gave a yellow then when Dietlev didn’t stop the ref slowed caught back up and gave the red.
Every video I’ve seen of the incident that is never a yellow card shown. Maybe I’m missing the angle, but I only see the yellow card hanging from the TO’s lanyard, he whisltes and points. Am I missing where the actual yellow is shown?
The 1st thing he does is grab for whistle, whistles and then “points” for him to stop. Then all I see is him and DItlev sorta arguing over the penalty. Then what ~25-30s later he pulls out the red card.
Maybe I missed it, but for the 1st 10-12s of the interaction no card is show and he’s “talking” to Ditlev after whistling/point for him to stop.
Have I missed something?
You’re right he reaches for it, fumbles it but never actually shows it.
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My thoughts exactly, saying what he said in the heat of the moment is not cool, but understandable. But the way they have gone about the situation post race hasn’t been the greatest. I don’t know what the ref said exactly, but how did he know he had to serve a littering penalty violation? It definitely looked as if he was not going to serve any kind of penalty, which based on the video, he deserved one. If he was claiming that he did not see the yellow, then show it again and then if he still refuses to accept it, give him the red card.
Funny how we complain that rules are not being enforced, but if they are enforced we have to reckon that “mistakes” and mistakes would be made.
Magnus saying, “You can’t disqualify me!” was funny. Yes, of course he can.
Does anyone really fully decelerate at the spot of the sign when the speed limit changes?
The trash zone is designed to allow efficient cleanup by the aid station crew, and in that spirit I don’t think there was any harm done with a cup landing 5 feet from the sign. I bet a few cups dropped at the sign end up getting inadvertently kicked past the sign anyway. The real harm is when athletes open up gels and toss the trash when they’re nowhere near an aid station where it can be cleaned up.
He sorta was riding like I do when I am coaching a run session and I have 3 stop watches hanging around my neck and I’m trying to look at one and the other 2 get in the way. He basically bumbled the most important part of the penalty, actually notifying the athlete of the exact penalty. I don’t think a “verbal” penalty is part of any rules procedures currently? I think it’s strictly card based right?
I don’t think that excuses the manner in which Ditlev responded, but I think connects the dots of how/why he responded in the manner. He’s initial reaction is more “huh” and then after being “talked” to by the official Ditlev kinda ramps up the agitated response. I think that’s why we have the card system that we currently have.
When did they start doing stop start penalties? Is that new and was it communicated before the race? Was that part of what triggered Magnus?