Cross fit?

Triathlon Forum
1

The other day I watched some crossfit championship.

Yes they are fit, yes they are strong, and an 80 foot long hand stand walk, skills for sure. Hardly any can swim worth a damn, but like IM, the swim is a formality only.

My question is, “is there PED drug testing in Crossfit?” It doesn’t look like it to me, but I could be wrong. From the body type of quite a few of them, I think there’s some steriod or HGH use going on. Anyone have any insight into this?

I’ve learned from being a Lance fanboy, that you gotta get proof before you admire someones achievements, and I really don’t want to admire those crossfit people if they’re all just pumped up freaks.

2

Looks like you are bored today and are trying to stir up some good old Slowtwitch entertainment…

Gym-junkies doping, surely that would ever happen.

3

Not really bored today.

I admire their dedication (regardless of drug use or not). I admire their various fitness skills. It seems to me that crossfit is quite similar to triathlon in that it’s a manufactured event to somewhat determine who’s the fittest. The details of their sport (for lack of better term) are different than tri, but they are attempting to achieve a similar goal in the end.

I think my life would be better if I do some of what they do, but I don’t want to be led down the garden path towards PED use. At least in tri, any drug use isn’t blatantly obvious. WE don’t look like pro wrestlers, but the top crossfit guys certainly do.

Back in the day, Sean Connery (James Bond) was Mr Olympia or Mr Universe. (I forget which one) He worked out a LOT and never looked like “Arnold” Personally I would aspire to be and look more like Sean, that Arnold. The crossfit dudes are impressive, but not if they are juiced. If there is no testing, then getting on the juice is very tempting.

My original question really was legitimate and I’d like to know. I know for example that here in New Zealand, there are body building champs,and there’s a separate “clean” body building championships. they guys look quite different from one another. I suspect that as the top crossfit guys don’t look much like the “clean” body builders, they juicing is likely. I was hoping for a more definitive and possibly insightful answer.

4

My question is, “is there PED drug testing in Crossfit?” It doesn’t look like it to me, but I could be wrong. From the body type of quite a few of them, I think there’s some steriod or HGH use going on. Anyone have any insight into this?

I’d be careful of making this assumption based on appearance. What you saw was most likely theCF games, I looked it up before so I"m just going from memory but the average male competitor I think was 5’10 and 185lbs or so. That in the grand scheme of things is tiny and pretty much anyone can get to that with dedicated time in the gym 100% clean. For those of us “gifted” to gain muscle mass looking at some weights that isn’t even big, I’ve been 180lbs lean mass not even trying and eating like crap (I"m 6’1) lifting 2-3 days a week.

That is not to say there is no PED use at all, but assuming they are on something because they appear big, they really aren’t that big. If anyone is using some sort of outside assistance it is most likely more for recover then directly for building mass. For example, again haven’t looked it up recently, when Arnold was competitive in body building he was something like 225-230lbs and juicing at probably a lower BF%. That is a big jump in mass that does require some help. Just to put it into a perspective most of us can picture.

5

The simple answer is that you can get fit,strong and ripped without the use of PED’s…Crossfit is just another form of cross-training that has been used successfully by people for decades.

There is no requirement to dope in any amateur sport,professional sports however are a different animal.

6

The size and shape of the guys makes me suspicious, and that raised my initial question.

The big thing for me was the “puffy abs” appearance, not just theor overall size. From what I know, that is a common byproduct of both steriod and HGH use, particularly HGH (like Andre the Giant, the wrestler from back in the day, although his HGH was natural, and not from a syringe). From my experience, abs from training clean, don’t project out to being in line with a guys nipples. They are inset further, if you get what I’m trying to say, with the pec’s sticking out further (yes I realize there it’s possible to train abs but not pecs, but that’s highly unlikely)

7

There’s a quarter million dollars on the line (for the championship). Of course there is doping.

8

I get that shape as well, never used hgh or any other PEDs. Never had a six pack either when I was sub 5% bf at the end of hs 90% of that was probably over my abs… damn you genetics!!

if I tense up my abs and ignore the layer of fat over them (currently ~20% shooting for sub 10) they stick out like that. Not claiming as big or even remotely that defined but they are “puffy” as you described.

So for me that is just a shape some people have never looked at it as a sign of hgh use, could be just not something I considered.

9

Remember, HGH is natural. Andre the Giant had an over abundance of it, naturally. His look, with protruding abs, pronounced jaw, and big forehead (much like a classic neandertal) is a stereotypical byproduct of excessive natural or man made HGH use.

Many of the top Crossfit guys had a look similar to that, but not as extreme as Andre.

That look raised my suspicions. I just want to know if crossfit is drug tested. Is PED use an issue in crossfit? Is it as rampant/entrenched as in cycling and body building for example?

10

There’s a quarter million dollars on the line (for the championship). Of course there is doping.

I suspected and assume there is doping, based purely on the look of the guys. I don’t like to accuse without something more than a suspicion tho. If there is no testing, then PED use is more likely. And so many other related questions.

while $250K would be nice, it pales in comparison to the money made by that famous cyclist from a few years back.

11

As a true test of strength and endurance, I’d like to see them walk/run 5km carrying my credit card debt on one shoulder and my mortgage on the other. That would break all but the best of them!

12

Personally my guess is it is less than both cycling and body building, that it exists in the sport but no I don’t think they test. The majority of those top athletes own a cf gym, testing would seriously injure their business model if people started popping up positive. Mot that this condones it (or that I care actually) just why I think it isn’t tested.

And yes I’m aware these things occur naturally, so based on that why must a handful of successful people in a sport automatically be doping when they may just have found their niche? Again not saying it isn’t happening.

I have a pronounced jaw, normal forehead, protruding abs and according to every girl I’ve ever been with big balls so maybe I’ve got high natural levels :slight_smile:

13

Yes and no, basically just like what I’ve seen so far with Triathlon, or baseball…

There are “local” crossfit competitions that aren’t policed. They’re hosed by a “Box” (douchebag speak for “crossfit gym”, usually one-off or annual events. Just like local triathlons, or church league softball, these aren’t policed, and can have a wide breadth of participants, all the way from soccer moms to the top competitors.

Then there is the Reebok sponsored Crossfit Games, or more appropriately Crossfit Series. These consist of the Open, Regionals and Games. This series is “strictly” policed for PED’s, and filters its way down from ANYONE AND EVERYONE to the cream of the crop professional Crossfitters (kinda like IM down to Kona).

The Open is, well, “open”. The Open consists of a series of “WOD’s” (douchebag speak for “Workouts of the Day”) that get released on the website. There’s then a submission period for each workout where athletes submit videos to qualify for the next phase. When you submit for the Open, you also submit a release to get on the PED testing roster, which puts you up for testing at any time (within 24hrs of request I believe), and travel restrictions, etc etc.

The next phase is the Regionals, which is a proper event where athletes around the country gather at their respective Regionals meets and compete side by side to qualify for the Games.

The Games is the National or World championships. I’m not aware if anyone can even get to the Games without already being tested, although I’m not sure everyone gets tested before Regionals. I’m not 100% sure if they’ve settled on a fixed time within the Regionals and Games cycles where they test EVERYONE, I’ve heard that it’s sort of random, but that they get through every qualifier by the time they get to the Games.

Once you’re on the testing roster, as I understand it, you have to ask to be removed, otherwise you are open for testing at any time (not sure why they would unless you’re a top guy, or in question). I know there have been guys that have tried to play the “timing” of the competitive season cycle, but I’m prone to believe it doesn’t work very well, considering that people know about it because they got caught doing it.

Guys get ejected from Regionals and the Games, so I’m prone to believe that they’re at least trying to make it seem like they’re policing it fairly tightly, but inevitably, you’ll have people try to play the system, just like triathlon, pro football,or baseball…

There’s no doubt that they could benefit both from muscle building as well as endurance enhancing PED’s, probably as much or moreso than any other sport, since there’s no way to hide behind technique. A smooth wrestler or fighter might be able to hide behind good technique, a tailback behind blistering speed, but Crossfit doesn’t have anything to hide behind. Either they’re strong and have the endurance to maintain, or they don’t. Especially considering that the Open is usually more endurance based, and Regionals more strength based, then the Games the combination of the two. Strong guys without endurance don’t make it through the Open, and high endurance capacity guys without strength get knocked out at Regionals, so the structure forces them to have both.

I’ll also agree that you can’t look at the athletes BODIES and assume that they must be on PED’s. They’re not that big of guys. I’ll admit, when you look at their numbers it’s easy to get suspicious, but just based on looks, it’s REALLY easy to be a muscled up 5’10", 190lb, 28yr old guy. It’s really not even that hard to get to the strength numbers that the AVERAGE Games guys put up. The top few guys out of each year put up pretty impressive numbers, but the AVERAGE among them wouldn’t be remotely competitive as an Olympic or powerlifting competitor. Having the strength AND the fast-twitch endurance is what’s impressive about them, even though their strength alone or their endurance alone wouldn’t be impressive in its respective exclusive platforms.

14

Thanks for that info. Much like I hoped, but still my suspicions stand. I re-iterate the considerable difference in appearance between Sean Connery and his peers, back in the day, and the top crossfit guys of today.

If you compare the swimmer Johnny Weismuller (sp), Tarzan, back in the day, and Olympic swimming champion, compared to swimmers of today, sure there are differences, but they are also pretty similar. If you compare various strongmen, (circus strongmen, or body builders up until the 1970’s) there was a pretty similar body type. With the advent of PED’s given similar training to back in the day, there has been a significant difference in resulting body type.

I haven’t tested crossfit champs, I haven’t seen what they eat or drink, or seen them train, but based on their body types, they look way more like Arnold than Sean. It’s great that they test for PED’s. However, we found how successfully cheating can get past testing (Lance). I don’t know if the top crossfit guys are juiced or not, but they have fantastic looking bodies that look like they are juicing, when compared with guys back in the day.

I readily admit my suspicions aren’t scientifically or evidence based, and they are just suspicions. I was just hoping for some better information to see if they are likely clean or likely juiced. I think the jury is still out, but this thread is still alive and kicking. Maybe we’ll get an answer one way or the other :slight_smile:

15

There’s a quarter million dollars on the line (for the championship). Of course there is doping.

I knew guys in the gym who doped simply for a chance at the hot girls.

16

What exactly are you waiting for,one of the Crossfit World Champs to come here and admit to doping?

In the gym scene in general people look way more ripped now than they did "back in the day’ training is harder and nutrition is better so it is no wonder that people look way more ripped.I used to work in that industry 20 years or so ago and we never saw as many super ripped “everyday folks” as you see now.Jane Fonda is in Oz touring and if you compare how she looked in her fitness videos back then to the fitness chicks now the difference is amazing.That doesn’t mean that all the gym chicks are on drugs.

I could walk down to the beach right now here in Surfers Paradise and pick our plenty of folks who are super fit and ripped but I don’t expect they are all on PED’s.I imagine that the drugs in Crossfit are just as common as you would find in most other sports.

17

The info from Chokebait above was very helpful and illuminating, to me at least. THAT was the kind of info I was looking for.

As I’ve mentioned in other threads, my son used to own a gym. He was interested in helping real people get real benefits from training, to improve their lives overall. He is a nice guy and wanted to help people be better. His business partner was not so decent, and was more interested in being buff and getting other self loathing people to be studs on the beach. My son and I both suspected him of being juiced and of many of his clients being on PEDs as well. In the end, my son didn’t want anything to do with that crap. Neither wanted to give up the business and it ended up my son sold his half to his business partner, and is glad to be out of that racket. Those guys at that gym were doing PED’s just to look better. That is really sad. Many of them had the same distinctive look that I see on many of the crossfit guys, that I, with my limited information, believe is from PED use.

While I don’t expect any crossfit guy to come out, here on ST, if anyone here does crossfit, then they may at least have their ear to the ground in the crossfit community and be able to at least empirically say that PED use is common or NO, it’s shunned?

I’m not trying to piss anyone off, just get some more info and/or opinions about the possible drug use of top crossfit guys. Much like we all question TdF riders (can they really go that fast for that long, and still be clean?) I also question whether it’s possible to look and perform like top crossfit guys and still be clean. Can you really get that big and strong on chicken and rice?

18

I also question whether it’s possible to look and perform like top crossfit guys and still be clean. Can you really get that big and strong on chicken and rice?

I gained roughly 18lbs of muscle (tested in a tank same technician) in about 6 months half assing it, 100% clean on chicken, eggs, beer, and pizza. Bf% stayed the same so going a little cleaner on diet could have been good, oh well.

So yes people can, not saying you or the next guy but yes people can.

Guy next to me at work is 5’9 maybe and I think he said 190? He’s the type of guy who if he doesn’t go to the gym for as week loses 5lbs even if he eats the same. So he was a small guy and I didn’t know him then but believe he was 150ish before he started lifting. He eats all day long, probably a lbs of chicken a day just while at work plus rice broccoli and spoons peanut butter into his mouth. He’s 100% clean. He doesn’t look like a cf guy, nor does he do it but he has significant mass.

19

Just look at the Rugby League guys these days compared to 20 years ago.They are totally ripped and are stronger,faster but not taller than the boys were back in the 80’s,sure some are on drugs but not everyone.

Here is something for you to watch.He is pretty heavy for his height and would be really short to be an MMA guy at the 190-200lbs weight division so that might say something about the demands of Crossfit versus MMA for example(which is a where a lot of the CF training came from)

http://www.youtube.com/…?v=XhHMGXazeUA#t=205

20

Just look at the Rugby League guys these days compered to 20 years ago.They are totally ripped and are stronger,faster but not taller than the boys were back in the 80’s,sure some are on drugs but not everyone.

Here is something for you to watch.He is pretty heavy for his height and would be really short to be an MMA guy at the 190-200lbs weight division so that might say something about the demands of Crossfit versus MMA for example(which is a where a lot of the CF training came from)

http://www.youtube.com/…?v=XhHMGXazeUA#t=205

Based on the current widespread drug scandal in Australian League, I’d have to say that many/most of the league guys ARE on the juice!