Hey all,
I am debating race wheels (hence the flurry of posts) but am thinking of 404’s vs. 404/disc. The only discs I’ve seen have been as people pass me quickly. I’ve never passed a person riding a disc. I’m a much better swimmer than cyclist - can ride 22-23 mph on a sprint, 20-21 mph on a oly, and 19-20 on a half. I feel a bit intimidated about running a disc though I know its the fastest wheel. I have no qualms about running 404’s. What do you think?
Dave
A disc is the fastest wheel. The % of time saved is always the same so as a % the actual amount of time saved is more the slower a cyclist you are.
Remember - a disc is disc is a disc. In otherwards you can spend $$$$$ or $69.95 for a CH Aero disc cover that will be just as fast.
Run the disc. Then you’ll be faster and feel like you can justify it 
Besides, if anyone thinks you’re a poser with a disc they’d think the same with a pair of 404s. And they’d be wrong anyway.
"if anyone thinks you’re a poser "
That’s the nice thing about a CH Aero cover - nobody thinks you’re a poser and the dummies who spent the big bucks who everybody else thinks is posing don’t know that it’s just as fast.
A disc is a disc is a disc.
if you’ve got money to burn, great, buy the disc. i did this season and i’ve only run it once. why? i’m just more comfortable on my training wheels. if i had it to do again, i would wait until i’m so close to a kona slot that a couple of minutes might matter. better to get a coach or swim lesson imho.
The actual amount of time saved with aero wheels vs 32 sp box rims is discussed here
I’ve heard that the second most regulated bicycle offense ( other than excessive stem spacers) is unwarranted use of a disc. I think there is a chart post on-line indicating a sliding scale factoring in age and speed and if you don’t meet the grade and are found riding a disc, your entire bike will be confiscated.
Seriously, making your self happy (and faster) is your primary concern. A disc will make you faster, however, will the increase in speed be proportionate to the cost? (that is a hard arguement many components we use in this sport). That is a subjective question based on your priorities.
I say buy a disc and don’t look back
these aero covers are easily fit onto any wheel system? Including the Ritchies on my Dual?
And by someone who is the Mr. Bean of bike mechanics?
If you can afford it, then get it
Or get the Renn
If weight is a concern, go with 404’s
The disc cover weighs 550 gms, so add that to a 1000 gm rear Mavic Cosmos wheel and you are at 1550gms!
Compare that to a 950 gm Zipp 909 and you are saving 600gms of rolling weight!
Go with the Zipp
NO
They definitely don’t fit the OCR’s.
I tried the OCR’s, kysriums, and only succeeded with plain old mavic 32 spoke box rims.
At those speeds not many people will be passing you, get or make a disk. I made my for $25 in materials and allways get compliments on the color (red).
jaretj
The disc is faster and it stabilizes the bike better in a crosswind. It counters the wind steer caused by the deep front.
The disc … stabilizes the bike better in a crosswind. It counters the wind steer caused by the deep front.
That’s an urban myth tossed about by cyclists, wheel companies and bike magazine writers.
It is faster, that’s for sure. But it doesn’t enhance front-end stability.
I agree that a disc doesn’t enhance front end stability. But, I disagree that it doesn’t affect handling, often positively, when paired with a high-surface-area front wheel.
When the wind come from the side, it pushes the front wheel away which tries to turn your handlebars…since the front fork is positioned with the axle ahead of the headset. Pick a bike up off the floor with a straight ahead wheel, and have someone turn on a fan to your side…the wheel will turn away from the fan.
As for the rear disc, the wind still pushes it away and “out from under” the rider. Assuming you are familiar with counter-steering, this front end turning away, followed by a leaning into the wind, is a good description of counter-steering…the net effect is to swerve a little, but keep a fairly straight direction.
I’ve ridden an H3 up front with a regular-spoked rear wheel as well as with a disc. The H3 up front with a regular-spoked rear is harder to keep straight in a crosswind than if paired with a disc rear.
I don’t want to overstate the beneficial steering effect of having a disc rear with the H3 front; of course, a disc rear and regular spoked front is easier to keep straight than the H3 front and disc rear. And spoked front and rear are least affected of all these combos.
daveinmammoth,
Perhaps the parallel question is, “Can you be slow (relatively) and ride an expensive bike?” One sees it every day! I rest my case.
Next question?
I tried it with an Open Pro rim and it was OK but the cover/rim interface isn’t that great. I’d highly recommend a plain box rim, nothing deeper.
I have 2 H3’s for races. (Wish I had a disc instead of the H3 rear. I tried a friend’s disc with my H3 front for 10k after my 2 H3’s for 10k in a significant cross winds. Clear difference.
When you are tilted over to counter a cross wind (let’s say it is from the right), an decrease in the wind makes you steer right because of the tilt. An increase in the wind makes you go left.
When you have a disc at the rear, the wind pushes your tail around to the left trying to steer you right. An increase in the wind increases this steer to the right, countering the winds tendency to push you left. A decrease in the wind, lessens this rear push, decreasing the right steer countering the increased right steer cause by the decrease in the wind while tilted to the right. (I hope that’s clear and right.)
i’ve listened to you praise the virtues of the CH aero cover as being the equal of a disc (regardless of brand) for sometime now, and am curious, do you not believe that the stiffness of a disc wheel contributes to a more efficient transfer of energy from the rider into the wheel, and therefore would translate into a quicker velocity when compared to the CH cover, even if the aerodynamic qualities are identical?
Why would a semi-hollow-honeycomb-mesh-whatever disc be stiffer than a 32-spoke box rim wheel?
“I tried the OCR’s, kysriums, and only succeeded with plain old mavic 32 spoke box rims.”
I’ve got a Mavic equipe and I can’t fit the cover without at least one hole being over a spoke. Can I just drill a new hole for the mounting screw?
Which Mavic rim do you have - I might just go and get a new wheel.