So I’ve seen the video and I’ve read the “choke vs. no choke” thread. My take on viewing the video is that Eric Garner died of a stroke or seizure caused by the stress and trauma of the encounter mixed with his pre-existing conditions. The hold around his neck area was only applied for ~19 seconds, and he was talking after it was released. My version seemed reasonable.
However, that is not what the autopsy report says. The autopsy says primary cause of death was “compression to the neck” (I couldn’t find the original document, but that is what has been reported). Is that the same as saying Eric Garner was strangled to death? That is way different than saying “he died of a stroke” (what I have been thinking up until now).
When all is said and done, what are the facts here?
I think it’s important to keep in mind the medical examiner would have had no way of knowing this case would have turned into what it has. Would he have even known a cop was involved in applying a choke hold to the guy? I have no idea what information they receive before doing an autopsy.
I do have a little bit of confidence that he/she has a bit more expertise in determining these sorts of things than some guy on the internet. But maybe I’m being presumptive and you do have training and expertise in this area?
I should note that I haven’t read the autopsy report. I’ve only seen reports about it. I can’t find it on the internet. Anyway, after searching more this is the best description I’ve found…
The autopsy from the medical examiner attributed his death to homicide – meaning death at the hands of another party, not murder, in medical parlance – and stated that he died thanks to “Compression of neck (choke hold), compression of chest and prone positioning during physical restraint by police.” But the autopsy further noted that Garner died thanks to acute and chronic bronchial asthma, obesity, and heart disease.
So he died of… neck compression, chest compression, asthma, obesity, and heart disease. Obesity did it?
He was a fat fuck with a heart condition. He resisted arrest, his heart went nuts and he died. I really don’t think that the choke played that big a role. I think that if they had simply tackled him and shackled him without the choke he probably still would have died.
I should note that I haven’t read the autopsy report. I’ve only seen reports about it. I can’t find it on the internet. Anyway, after searching more this is the best description I’ve found…
The autopsy from the medical examiner attributed his death to homicide – meaning death at the hands of another party, not murder, in medical parlance – and stated that he died thanks to “Compression of neck (choke hold), compression of chest and prone positioning during physical restraint by police.” But the autopsy further noted that Garner died thanks to acute and chronic bronchial asthma, obesity, and heart disease. So he died of… neck compression, chest compression, asthma, obesity, and heart disease. Obesity did it?
Sounds to me like someone’s covering ALL the bases so as to not wind up on one ‘side’. Just label the death as ‘due to the fat guy being fat and unhealthy, and the officer doing some choking, and maybe everything in between too’ and you’ve got your own ass covered
It’s been a long time since my (admittedly limited) law classes, but would the eggshell skull rule not come into play here with the deceased being a “fat fuck” and all?
Eggshell skull rule
Doctrine that makes a defendant liable for the plaintiff’s unforeseeable and uncommon reactions to the defendant’s negligent or intentional tort. If the defendant commits a tort against the plaintiff without a complete defense, the defendant becomes liable for any injury that is magnified by the plaintiff’s peculiar characteristics.
In my experience as a coroner, any competent ME will try to obtain as much background information about the circumstances as possible. It’s pretty safe to assume that the ME had at least a preliminary report by the police.
The agreement, reached days before the deadline to file suit in the death, appeared to be among the biggest reached so far as part of a strategy by the city comptroller, Scott C. Stringer, to settle major civil rights claims even before a lawsuit is filed. Mr. Stringer has said the aim is to save taxpayers the expense of a drawn-out trial
I’ve been choked worse than that hundreds (possibly thousands) of times (he was still conscience after 19 seconds in that hold. That’s one shitty choke) and I’m still alive.
We have thousand upon thousands of practitioners of Jiu Jitsu and submission wrestling spanning the course of decades where much more viscous and effective chokes are applied day in and day out. And nobody is dying.
That dude died because he was a fat fuck trying to work around confiscatory tax laws enacted by nanny state politicians.
I’ve been choked worse than that hundreds (possibly thousands) of times (he was still conscience after 19 seconds in that hold. That’s one shitty choke) and I’m still alive.
We have thousand upon thousands of practitioners of Jiu Jitsu and submission wrestling spanning the course of decades where much more viscous and effective chokes are applied day in and day out. And nobody is dying.
That dude died because he was a fat fuck trying to work around confiscatory tax laws enacted by nanny state politicians.
