It seems that ST leans towards Cervelo and Zipp.
I’m most likely buying some race wheels this summer when I visit the states, and I was wondering if there is such a huge difference between Blackwell, Zipp and HED race wheels?
I currently weigh 188lbs. Will be down to around 185 at the end of july so I would still need some wheels that won’t buckle under me.
Any thoughts? Zipp 808 or maybe Blackwell 100mm?
Honestly, you wouldn’t be making a bad choice with Hed, Zipp, or Blackwell. The differences between the top end wheels is pretty marginal.
I’m 180+/- and have raced my new Hed Jets 60/90 on my Felt twice. Love em. They seem to be very stable for my weight. I’m far from the podium, so the extra grand for Zipps wouldn’t be cost-efficient for me.
Here’s a recent thread…
A grand? Why does the HED mafia always say a grand? The difference between Zipp 808s and HED 3Cs is $660. For that price why settle? Go with the better and faster wheelset and get the Zipp 808s.
Jet 60/90 -vs- something comparable: 404/808 approx $770 diff. if I say a grand, who cares? the OP can do the math.
Or get a used set of zipp 440s for $250ish off Ebay, and extend your trip to include another couple races.
Stephen J
I’ll wait and see what the different stores offer in St.Paul.
Like you said, I probably won’t notice a difference. Until they crack and I have to replace them and the one set costs “a grand” more than the others.
Who knows I might sell my Transition and buy a new bike aswell. Maybe a Cervelo…
Better and faster is debatable and there is plenty of (independent) proof that says that the Hed3 is still faster than the 808.
Shouldn’t the real comparison be between the Stinger 90/90 and the 808? In that scenario I can’t see how an 80mm wheel can be faster than a 90mm wheel. Had both, and there is no justification to the extra cost of the Zipps.
Gear is probably your best bet if you want a bricks and mortar store, but they only carry Zipps (and I think Mavics). NOW only has Mavic. Penn has Zippl, Easton, Bontrager, and Mavic.
If you want Hed, go to them directly.
Or go on ebay, like someone else suggested 
You can save a ton that way.
Where is this independent proof? Why doesn’t HED publish graphs of their wheels in the wind tunnel test the same way the Zipp does? Based on the test by the German magazine, the 808s were faster, and undimpled rebadged 404s were also faster. Show me the link of where it says HEDs are faster.
Here you go.
http://www.biketechreview.com/aerodynamics/808_trispoke.htm
There was also a post a while back where someone from RA Cycles posted data for all the wheels. You should be able to find it easy enough by searching the forum.
Oh I forgot. All of Hed’s data is on there website. It may be simple drag data, but it is there. Of course if you’re looking for data supplied by them that shows they are faster than other wheel manufacturers you wont fine it. Interesting after all these years that the Hed3 is still the wheel everything is measured against.
BTW- I am not bashing Zipp. I have owned (in this order) 404, 909, 999, and 808. They are great wheels. All I am saying is that they are not faster than Hed. I would also say the same about Hed. They aren’t faster. People can split hairs all they want, but in the end it is probably impossible to clearly state if either is statistically faster than the other.
Here you go.
http://www.biketechreview.com/aerodynamics/808_trispoke.htm
There was also a post a while back where someone from RA Cycles posted data for all the wheels. You should be able to find it easy enough by searching the forum.
Where should I start with biketechreview.com?
They never follow the manufacturer’s recommendations so their tests are never valid. Cause in point, they are using 20mm tires. Zipp does not recommend that tire size and the 808 is not designed for that width.
They are testing the wheel by itself, with no fork. The HED3 makes a whoosh sound everytime they pass a fork blade. This sound energy created is a loss that is not accounted for.
After rolling resistance test, biketechreview lost all credibility.
Why should I have to pay $19 for the report, have you?
And the post that I saw, the 808 was first, but then maybe you were looking at a datapoint atf 30 degrees yaw angle where the HED3 was first. But how many times do you see a 30 degrees yaw angle?
As I said before, why does HED hide their data? Show me one graph where they display their wheel data.
There are a few problems with the report. The first thing that caught my eye was the tire width. It wasn’t optimal for either wheel. Yes, I paid for it. Back before I bought my 808 set last year. The data is still worth looking at. Do what you want with it, but at least look at it.
I don’t think Hed “hides” their data. I am not sure why you do. Teh Hed 3 is the most tested wheel of all time and is still the wheel everything is compared to. It still is fast, probably as fast as anything out there. If it is still being used by teams in the tour it must be fast. You seem to think that the 808 is the greatest wheel out there and well worth the extra money over a Hed wheel. If that’s the case that’s cool, but you can’t say it is a faster wheel. There is just too much (mis)information supporting each side to make this determination.
In the end I don’t believe, and have not been convinced that Zipp makes a faster or better wheel than Hed. The 808 may be faster- or it may not be than a Hed3. My guess is neither is faster or slower. Since I have neither at this time, I really don’t care. My point is that you can find data that supports either wheel. Most of the stuff favoring Zipp comes from them though and that needs to be considered. Like I said before- I think a better comparison is the Stinger 90 versus the 808. I can’t se how the 808 would be faster than the Stinger 90, but I am sure Zipp will come out and prove it is if they have to.
I’ll tell you what. I’ll conceed the 808 is faster than a Hed3 based on my unscientific observations. Now you tell me how much “faster” you think it is over say a 40k course. Well?