I’ve completed two IM’s in the MOP - feel that I can go faster given my OD times (who knows if such analyis is valid though) - and have the following issue in long distance races.
My legs fatigue much more quickly then my heart. In other words, during the second loop of the run in an IM - I’m unable to go hard enough to raise my HR …I seem “stuck” at top of Zone 1 less 15 - 20 bpm. My legs are in such pain and are so fatigued, I’m physically unable to increase the effort.
Pacing on the bike and nutrition seem to be fine…don’t have power stats for last IM, but HR was consistently in the LTHR less 25 - 30 bpm range. Energy levels seem fine, as 250 - 300 Kcal per hour seem to work for me.
Any thoughts on how to address such an issue in training? My guess is to try and increase run frequency this year…
Well, that pretty much sums up most of the MOP field in an IM event. Finishing around 14 hours means easy biking and slow running or some walking the mary. To get under 11 or better, you can swim easy (say, 1:10) bike easy, but steady (need under 6 hours), and then run easy (no walking at all). This “plan” seems easy, but it is not. As most would say, FOP or Kona people - the IM “race” begins at the 13.1 mark turnaround of the mary. Until then, LOTS of people are sitting fine and feeling OK. Those last 13 miles need some serious leg strength and separate the times by hours. If you can run that last 13.1 well under 2 hours - you are likely golden for your overall time.
Basically, there is no substitue for LOTS of running miles. And I mean LOTS. But, that includes LOTS of bike miles to set yourself up too. So, we are back to the more is MORE philosophy There is no free lunch. No need to track work or special workouts (although biking hills is always good) unless you are biking 250+ miles/week and running 60+ miles/week.
I don’t run a lot by any stretch of the imagination. I also do very consistent track workouts and they seem to have a big impact. WE are all different, and what works for one, doesn’t work for all of us. This has been successful for me. Running “a lot” is open to interpretation, but 3x per week for me (max) doesn’t sound like a lot does it?
No, not really - we are not all that different. We will all respond to MORE volume. You may not think you “need” it for your goals, whatever they may be, but it works. I love my trackworkouts as well, I just dump them during IM builds. 3 x week, even if you ran 10 miles at a time would definitely not be a lot. Most running coaches would choose consistency (i.e. 7 runs/week) over pure volume though. 60 miles/week approaches a lot, unless you are Francois when 100+ miles/week starts to be something
Yeah…I respond to more volume…PF, worn down, and yes, I don’t get any stronger or faster. 25M per week is a big week. Keep in mind, I am 50 years old. I’ve done the bigger running and mileage and for IM training, it doesn’t do it for me. If I was “just a runner”, then I am more in your camp bro.
I think what rroof is saying that if you look at the collective not the indivudalistic experience, those with higher run volumes tend to do better, especially in the late stages of the IM marathon.
Everybody is different, and it’s hard to know what to suggest. Some folks are successful training low miles; others do big miles. But, whether a successful IM runner runs a lot or a little in training, here’s an observation:
If you walked up to one of them at any given moment and said, “Hey, let’s go run for 4 hours on some trails,” they could do it. Can you get up from your desk right now and go run steady for four hours? If not, then you need to start running more often and longer. You’re “falling off the curve,” as we say. The only way I know of to develop a missing ability to cover 42k at a predictable pace (and not walk) is to do miles.
My legs fatigue much more quickly then my heart.
And, BTW – fatigue is not cardiac in nature. Your heart doesn’t get tired, ever (short of heart disease). Even the fastest folks get tired legs.
I am still in the process of collating the survey that I just did but the trend for the faster guys to do more bike and run volume is pretty blatant.
My opinion is that for most 11+ hr guys, it is basic endurance that is limiting and just because you feel the effects on the run doesn’t mean you shouldn’t emphasize bike and run volume in order to improve.
I have a long version of the mesa trail run here in Boulder. It has a lot of elevation gain and, when I’m fit it takes me about 3hrs to run (steady-mod). I consider it my key run for the week and I know of no other run that simulates that “legs have been beaten with a rubber hose” feeling that you get at the end of an IM. I guess the hills and stairs fatigue a lot of the bike fibers in the same way as the bike does in an IM. I’m not sure on the mechanism but the feeling is unquestionably similar.
I know I’m in shape for an IM run when I can run that whole thing so I think a 3hr steady-mod trail run on a hilly trail is a great indicator of run performance.
There is no free lunch. No need to track work or special workouts (although biking hills is always good) unless you are biking 250+ miles/week and running 60+ miles/week.