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zipp 900 axle movement
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scighera
Aug 13, 14 10:20
Post #1 of 9 (3520 views)
Hi,

I was able to get my hands on a nice used CD0,1 with a Zipp disc in it (looks like an nimbled 900 tubular), problem: The hub is smooth as expected, but there is movement in the axle.

I opened the hub, and noticed the movement is between the axle and the hub bearings (it looks likes the bearings inner size is a bit too big, or there is movement in the axle itself)

Bearings are JNK 6802 VRS for the hub (I googled is, and 6802 is the recommend size for the Zipp 900 )

My question: is this normal? (I tightened the axle with 5mm allen keys tight enough, but still able to move the disc a bit,wit sound in the hub from the bearing and also touching the break pads.)
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Re: zipp 900 axle movement [scighera] [ In reply to ]
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wasfast
Aug 13, 14 12:47
Post #2 of 9 (3493 views)
It's not normal. Something's off but too challenging to tell in ASCII. The ND axle cover has to somehow touch the inner race of the bearing. If it doesn't, things move. Quick fix might be a shim on the axle-to-bearing to make sure it contacts. You'll need to measure how much side to side play there is to know what thickness is necessary. Perhaps some standard feeler gages could work.
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Re: zipp 900 axle movement [wasfast] [ In reply to ]
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scighera
Aug 14, 14 4:09
Post #3 of 9 (3439 views)
I removed the axle again (easy, I don't need force to get the axle out, with a cycleops or AC hub I need a hammer)

Axle is going out smooth, I tested the axle in both the hub as the freewheelbody, both has movement, And it looks like the movenment is in the bearing itself, but of course I can't be sure. Even when te axle is tightened with wto allen keys: stil movement, so, it looks like the bearings.... I can't find C2/C3/C5 etc on the bearings....

It looks like a 182 rearhub: http://www.slowtwitch.com/...-_Zipp_182_3300.html




Last edited by: scighera: Aug 14, 14 4:13
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Re: zipp 900 axle movement [scighera] [ In reply to ]
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scighera
Aug 14, 14 5:46
Post #4 of 9 (3431 views)
From Zipp website:



The 2002-2008 Zipp hubs are different from most hubs in that they do not side load the bearings to remove play in the hub (think traditional cup and cone set-up). Our hub is designed such that the bearing race on the axle is aligned with the sealed bearing when the end caps on the axle are properly torqued. Since the axle is not press fit into place it will have some lateral movement when the wheel is unweighted. Once a rider's weight is added to the system, the bearing becomes loaded vertically and the play then disappears. By designing the hub this way, it is possible to extend bearing life and make a hub that will turn much smoother leading to a faster wheel.
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Re: zipp 900 axle movement [scighera] [ In reply to ]
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beston
Aug 14, 14 5:57
Post #5 of 9 (3427 views)
As you just found, ..yes, it is normal.

I ran into the same issue when my buddy asked me to fix his newly acquired (but used zipp wheels). He complained of lateral play when it wasn't weighted (as in rider on the bike).

I found the same answer as you: The lateral play is meant to be there.

You can reduce the lateral play by tightening the axel down. But of course, you always need some play in the wheel.
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Re: zipp 900 axle movement [beston] [ In reply to ]
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scighera
Aug 14, 14 6:26
Post #6 of 9 (3412 views)
Thanks :)

Tightening te axle down is no option, I have it allready tight enough, and as it only builts pressure on the inner ring: the lateral play itselfs stays...

I'll ride this wheel next saturday in a short race, hopefully it doesn't rubb the brakepads :)
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Re: zipp 900 axle movement [scighera] [ In reply to ]
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wasfast
Aug 14, 14 18:24
Post #7 of 9 (3373 views)
I worked on a buddies Zipp 303 with similar vintage internals a couple months ago. In his case, it was the bearings that had gone south. You should be able to test the bearings with the freehub off just with your fingers to push/pull on the inner portion for play. There should be absolutely none and they should turn freely with no "feelable" grinding, rubbing etc.

When you describe "lateral play", is this with the wheel in the bike and pushing/pulling on the rim edge or is it just when feeling the axle with the wheel in hand?
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Re: zipp 900 axle movement [wasfast] [ In reply to ]
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scighera
Aug 14, 14 22:09
Post #8 of 9 (3361 views)
I feel the lateral play when pushing on the rim-edge.

a little vertical play in the bearings, no grinding and smooth running bearings (I have replaced lots of damaged bearings, and these are almost perfect)
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Re: zipp 900 axle movement [scighera] [ In reply to ]
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wasfast
Aug 15, 14 4:54
Post #9 of 9 (3343 views)
I missed your quote from the Zipp site about the design intent, interesting design idea but certainly not common practice. The custom shim idea I mentioned near the beginning may still be an option if the play really annoys you. It will take some careful measuring and shim making to avoid side loading the bearings.
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