When you told her, did she say "get off your stupid triathlon forum!" ??

A disproportionate number of those incarcerated are African Americans. Specialized naming a bike the Shiv is disrespectful to the black community, especially so when the bike is targeted at triathlon, a sport favored by beneficiaries of white privilege. The name cannot be an accident. Obviously the marketing department at Specialized is peopled by bigots, quite possibly members of the Klan, and the name is a subtle signal to racist buyers. I suggest we censor all mention of this bike through black history month. #ShivAnotherFourLetterWord

Indeed. And the plumbers are already in an uproar about "plumber's crack", no need to contact them.

How did I miss this thread so far? I guess it fell through the cracks.

But we should really stop cracking jokes here. No, I'm serious - keep it up and folks will think we're crackpots. No more wisecracks, OK?

So we pull up to the parking lot for Master National's TT and the woman in the car next to us is putting air in the tires of her TT bike. She asks "Can you give me a hand with the hash pipe". My first thought was "Wow, talk a generation difference. All the 20-somethings I know call it a "crack pipe"".However, if you graduated from High School in the 80's it is definitely a hash pipe.

FFS. It's Specialized! Not Cannondale.

Yeah. Aside from MTBs, I stopped buying non-custom bikes a long time ago, so I wouldn't know.

I am crackin' up laughing while reading some of the posts. It is only February and this tread has the potential to become an epic tread of the year. Gotta remember it in Dec.

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PushThePace wrote:

Your posting deeply offends me and I'm not joking here

Wow. Just being asked to be more considerate of language deeply offends you? And I'm the one who should HTFU as someone else here said. Wow.

PushThePace wrote:

This is a subculture, we are endurance athletes,

You forgot to point out that the subculture generally skews white and affluent. And on this board, male. That's the subculture too. So those terms are quite a bit less loaded in that respect if you're part of those.


The context of crack pipe, for many black people in cities, is so horrible that even if you're not talking about an actual crack pipe it's evocative. Now, some of yall don't know that. I don't blame you for that. That's not your context. I'm not ordering anyone to stop using it. I simply ASKED people to learn about it and said I hoped they'd stop.


I'm asking you to be considerate. But I guess that's too much to ask.


And not only do you not want to change (which you could do by ignoring my request), you mock me for asking and claim it's offensive to even ask. Wow.


But hey, don't be "bullied" by people outside your group asking you to reconsider words. In fact, push back and rub it in their faces with more mockery and anger. You win. Congratulations bro.




PS - I recently used a term that an Irish person found offensive. I had no idea of the original meaning (few people in the US do). She explained it to me, and I've stopped using it. It's not a big deal to change, or at least think about changing. For me at least. I didn't jump up and tell her to HTFU and emphasize that she can't "bully" me and that I was offended by her request. YMMV.

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http://www.jt10000.com/

Who knew that asking people to be more considerate and intentional would bring out so many insecurities?

Are crackheads offended by our use of the term crack pipe though? Because I'm tired of being told I can't use certain words by people not part of the group that might be offended but hasn't actually said they're offended.

I'm usually on board with being PC because all it really means is thinking about how your words and actions affect others, but that makes sense when it comes to words like retard, which are intended to be hurtful. But crack pipe isn't, and given all the problems crackheads cause are we seriously supposed to worry about hurting their feelings?

Like I said, I'm usually on board with being PC but things are getting out of hand. I actually saw a woman on Twitter a few weeks ago offended by the word female. All these uber sensitive people need to consider the intent behind the words before getting all worked up.

No one is arguing or making fun of the idea that we should be careful with the words we use.


We are making fun of the specific choices of words that you chose to find offensive, because they seem less like something that is actually offensive, and more like you're just reaching for something to use to virtue-signal how "woke" you are.

While I don't doubt that some ST'ers may harbor some insecurities, it seems like you're painting with a pretty broad brush*.
(* I realize this is a colloquialism which may be offensive or hurtful to overweight watercolor artists. My apologies in advance.)

I would think that a crackhead would be excited or dare I even say aroused by the term crack pipe.

Your response would indicate that I’m ignorant, white and privileged. The fact of the matter is your assumptions and your ignorance to OUR subculture, regardless of its makeup is what lead to my words.

I’m far from those things and it would seem you purposely excluded the portions of my post where I clearly indicated I know when something is being overtly offensive. What you’re essentially asking us to do is to walk around on eggs shells for the edge case participants who may or may not find those terms offensive. Rules are made for the majority not the edge case and alterations are made from there to try and include edge cases.

I’ve traveled the world, I’ve educated myself on other cultures, traditions and etiquette. I’m offended that with all the effort I’ve put into not being offensive you still find things offensive when they aren’t. I’ve lived in the inner city and first off, it’s not only African Americans who smoke real crack pipes. This sentence alone showcases your bias and your prejudices. Affluent white men, poor Latin women, affluent African American and many other groups have been affected by the crack epidemic. The fact is, when we say crack pipe here, it has zero to do with any of that as it’s refering to a piece of equipment with no relationship to that.

Yes I am offended that you’d push people to alter their language and behaviour based on your discomfort or believes in a word or phrase. Yes I’m offended you’d even continue to debate this with the members of this board as it’s an absurd request. It’s you who is offended and that stems from whatever principals or believes or experience you’ve had. Projecting your believes or your agenda for the word is a sign you may lack tolerance for others and their beliefs.

That’s the core of what’s truly offensive about your request. “I know better than all you and I will scold you for deviating from my belief system and subjecting me to another”. Furthermore your blatant disrespect towards people insinuating that nobody here understands the impact the crack epidemic has had on the world because they are affluent white men is just ghastly. With all due respect let’s agree to disagree on the topic. We won’t ever change either of our mind regardless of how many ways in which we say it.

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"Train so you have no regrets @ the finish line"

You really don't get it, do you?

People are responding with mockery, because in general the term "crack pipe" isn't particularly offensive. Yes, a small subset of people may find it offensive because it is associated with a horrible epidemic, (earlier in the thread you yourself used the term "so-called" epidemic, which is far more offensive in my eyes than referring to a bicycle toolbox item by a name commonly associated with illegal drugs, but I digress). But the term has never, to my knowledge, been used to denigrate drug addicts, its just a description of a piece of drug paraphernalia (sp?). It hasn't been used in an offensive manner, and as such, in my eyes anyway, isn't really offensive.

That said, if we were having a private conversation and you said that you didn't want me to use that term, I would try to accommodate your request since I'm not a dick, in the same way that I don't swear around my parents or my children. Swearing may be crude, but isn't necessarily offensive, there are lots of instances where someone can swear and not offend anyone. But I'm not going to try and say that no-one should ever swear ever, since someone might be offended somewhere. That's trying to impose my will upon everyone else.

As for "popping one's cherry", that just isn't really offensive. It may be crude, but truly offensive? It's slang for losing one's virginity, and IMO, its trying too hard to find something to be offended about. I mean, back in the '70's all-girl punk band the Runaways had their hit song "Cherry Bomb". You can probably find all kinds of things to be offended about just in the name of the band and the title of the song, let alone the lyrics, especially since they were intentionally edgy for the time. Or, you can just enjoy the music.

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Swimming Workout of the Day:

Favourite Swim Sets:

2020 National Masters Champion - M50-54 - 50m Butterfly

I am really Butt Hurt that I can no longer refer to the tool that assists in inflating my tires on my Disc Wheel as a Crack Pipe

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All I Wanted Was A Pepsi, Just One Pepsi

Team Zoot, Team Zoot Mid-Atlantic

You are way too sensitive.

Wait... am I offending people with sensitive skin? Dermatitis is no laughing matter.

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How does Danny Hart sit down with balls that big?

I have to moisturize daily.


#offended

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Swimming Workout of the Day:

Favourite Swim Sets:

2020 National Masters Champion - M50-54 - 50m Butterfly

Tom A. Is offended by disc brake. We should stop using that term.

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Paging slowman, we have a "Wow. Just wow" sighting...

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How does Danny Hart sit down with balls that big?

I don't understand why people get so up in arms about a request that they modify their vocabulary.

I will always have the right to use these terms, and there's a good chance I will continue to do so. But, knowing that you find them disturbing means that someone else might as well, so I might choose a different word next time.

I don't get why it's such a big deal. It's really not hard to accommodate these kinds of wishes but it is hard to propose them so I wish people would give you a little more respect.

Gorilla cage. PETA anyone?

Irish Car Bomb, or paddy wagon?

Yeah, as much as I disagree on some points, I don't think you're out of line at all.
Incidentally, you've got me curious about the term found offensive by the irish person. Don't suppose you'd share it?
Is that an actual irish person or an american of irish ancestry?

I know someone at work named Shiv Patel, so assuming SHIV is only offensive to the black community, is probably offensive to the Indian/Pakistani community

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"What's your claim?" - Ben Gravy
"Your best work is the work you're excited about" - Rick Rubin