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dumb questions benefits of wheel upgrades
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As the title states, just some dumb questions. Of course I know about weight savings that are a big benefit of wheel upgrades, and aero benefits for different designs, but was curious on getting perspectives on other benefits. I have a specialized allez with the basic axis wheels (well the front is an axis, the rear wheel is a powertap pro hub with g3 internals and velocity a23 rim).

When I'm riding by myself, it really doesn't matter what I have, since I don't necessarily care about speed, but I've recently been out with people and there were times where I was increasing my watts (I'm about 4.2w/kg ~300w ftp) and I was still losing contact with the wheel in front of me. I think there's an obvious component of needing to ride with groups more often, but I was thinking about the notion of responsiveness that people cite when talking about wheel upgrades, and that lighter wheels would be a bit less sluggish and close down those gaps with just a little less effort. So I was curious if there are more than just marginal improvements that can come with wheel upgrades in a group scenario. Like I said, the likely answer is to ride with people more and focus on reducing the gaps and reading the group dynamic, but my curiosity is getting the best of me!
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Re: dumb questions benefits of wheel upgrades [347CX] [ In reply to ]
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347CX wrote:
I was increasing my watts (I'm about 4.2w/kg ~300w ftp) and I was still losing contact with the wheel in front of me.
If you are getting dropped at 4.2W/kg, wheel weight is probably not your problem. It is aero and skill. You might benefit from 60mm or 45mm deep aero wheels to help.
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Re: dumb questions benefits of wheel upgrades [347CX] [ In reply to ]
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I had an odd experience recently on my road bike. I slapped a set of Vision TriMax 30's that came with my tri bike on and instantly it seemed that it took so much more effort to hold my usual cruising speed. I tried switching the tires from the Vittoria Rubinos to Conti GP4000s which made a small difference but not back to "normal". Checked for any frame or brake contact and there was none... After a few rides, I switched back to the regular Felt wheels that came with the bike and GP4000s and I was back to "normal". The original wheels just felt snappier, more responsive, and like they required less effort to maintain speed.

I'd also say that I have a set of deep section carbon Reynolds Strikes and they feel even more responsive but I typically just leave them on the tri-bike and use the regular aluminum wheels for road riding. I would consider switching them if I was doing a road race or wanted to be group competitive for whatever reason.

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Re: dumb questions benefits of wheel upgrades [347CX] [ In reply to ]
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Aero wheels, depending on which model you choose, might end up being a pound lighter than your current wheels, and will make next to no difference in your speed from that weight diff.

As for aerodynamics, the differences are in the order of something like 6 minutes over 180km (I think, based on some data from flo).

Depending on your average speed, that means the wheels are making somewhere in the range of a 0.3 mph speed increase.

The point being, if you are getting dropped on your group rides, its NOT because you don't have aero wheels.
Last edited by: SBRcanuck: Apr 23, 19 7:21
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Re: dumb questions benefits of wheel upgrades [exxxviii] [ In reply to ]
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Yeah, no doubt on the skill thing. I've never been one to think about gear as the solution, for me fitness is king (along with practicing group dynamics), but I see so much attributed to wheel upgrades that I couldn't help but wonder.
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Re: dumb questions benefits of wheel upgrades [347CX] [ In reply to ]
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347CX wrote:
there were times where I was increasing my watts (I'm about 4.2w/kg ~300w ftp) and I was still losing contact with the wheel in front of me.

It's not about the best possible day with nailing an effort that equates to some power/duration.

The stress on the system in some groups and races just don't work like that. It's a lot different warming up and nailing out your ftp at some steady effort and constantly going WAY over then under.

Think about it this way.........these two things are not the same:

300, 300, 300, 300, 300, 300, 300, 300, 300, 300, 300, 300, 300, 300, 300, 300, 300, 300, 300, 300

And

150, 150, 600, 240, 240, 240, 350, 350, 150, 150, 150, 400, 400, 400, 240, 240,150, 600, 150

Get the idea?

Also, knowing when to fold your cards and when to play them is key. All the while feeling out your self during the ride.
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Re: dumb questions benefits of wheel upgrades [347CX] [ In reply to ]
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347CX wrote:
Of course I know about weight savings that are a big benefit of wheel upgrades, and aero benefits for different designs
Wheel weight is a small fraction of total bike weight + rider weight. Wheel aero drag is a small fraction of total bike drag + rider drag. Therefore, you your self make up the majority of the overall weight and drag. Upgrading to lighter and more aero wheels only helps a little.
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Re: dumb questions benefits of wheel upgrades [RichardL] [ In reply to ]
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RichardL wrote:
347CX wrote:
Upgrading to lighter and more aero wheels only helps a little.

Especially when it come to holding a wheel in front of you.

OP, where are the gaps opening? Is the group pulling away from you ridings steady state in the flats? On climbs? Coming out of corners?

"They're made of latex, not nitroglycerin"
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Re: dumb questions benefits of wheel upgrades [exxxviii] [ In reply to ]
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Well, it could be fitness too. Ftp makes zero difference when you get dropped on a 45 second hill because everyone else is doing 800 watts.
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Re: dumb questions benefits of wheel upgrades [347CX] [ In reply to ]
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347CX wrote:
Like I said, the likely answer is to ride with people more and focus on reducing the gaps and reading the group dynamic, but my curiosity is getting the best of me!

Sorry, equipment is just not going to do a lot.

Focus on staying in the draft as close as possible (it isn't always right behind the guy in front of you), and practice intense intervals. The later is probably the main issue; you have to put out a lot of power to hang when there is a surge.

The biggest bang for buck in equipment is fast tires and latex tubes.
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