Re: Zwift increases monthly prices by 50% [Rappstar] [ In reply to ]

Nov 17, 17 5:28

Post #101 of 247 (7175 views)

Rappstar wrote:

jkhayc wrote:

Yea, I don't see COD as being the type of game to need a widely available beta. I was mainly making a point to the government man that Zwift was, at one time, free.

I don't know. I tend to agree with GMan. Zwift was never really free. It was in beta. Beta is always free. At least, I've never heard of a public beta for software that wasn't free. So I don't really agree that the change from a free public beta to a $10/mo commercial product constitutes a price raise. But I suppose that's largely semantics... Anyway...

Ugh, you guys are being so difficult, but at least you aren't being a d bag. Semantics IS everything. Our choices of what words we use defines a lot of things about us.

I used Zwift. Zwift was free. Whether it was "in beta" or not is irrelevant. The product I was using was free. Then that product was $10. Now, in a year, that product will be $15.

I don't know why I originally started with this line, and now I wish I hadn't.

I posted the news originally for discussion. I like Zwift. I'll use it. I'd rather pay 10/mo than 15. GMan can continue harassing me like a dbag if he wants, but I don't really care.

Re: Zwift increases monthly prices by 50% [imswimmer328] [ In reply to ]

Nov 17, 17 5:30

Post #102 of 247 (7169 views)

imswimmer328 wrote:

I must say, I don't know much about the platforms you mentioned. However, Zwift isn't just a piece of software. They use a subscription model because it's actually more of a service than a good, if that makes sense. They provide the platform and host the servers required to keep it going. More like a gym membership. They also have to use a subscription because I don't think people would actually buy the product if they made it cost as much as they would have to.

PeriPedal and PerfPro are software more like TrainerRoad in that all they do is workouts, not video game group rides.

I would have more sympathy for the "servers" point if it weren't for two things:

1) Server time is fairly cheap, and the bulk of processing for this is done client-side. Blizzard managed to keep Battle.Net going without monthly subscriptions, and still doesn't charge for the multiplayer aspects of Diablo and StarCraft (or didn't last time I checked). And it was all 100% stone-cold free with the purchase of those games before WoW came along.
2) The software-as-subscription model is the direction just about everyone wants to go, "service" or not. TrainerRoad does, as does Adobe, and more that I can't think of at this hour before the coffee kicks in. Mainline, A-level franchise games typically go for $60 these days, yes? Maybe $70 at the most. I don't feel that Zwift is worth more than double a huge XB1 or PS4 game every year. Nor TrainerRoad. Bully for them that others disagree, but I'm not playing along. Or Take Adobe Lightroom - it costs almost as much per year of subscription as to buy the thing outright, only if you buy it you can use it for two (or more!) years between upgrades if you don't need the new features or support for newer cameras. And they don't even release new versions every year...

The point is, ladies and gentleman, that speed, for lack of a better word, is good. Speed is right, Speed works. Speed clarifies, cuts through, and captures the essence of the evolutionary spirit.

Re: Zwift increases monthly prices by 50% [jkhayc] [ In reply to ]

Nov 17, 17 6:10

Post #103 of 247 (7137 views)

Wow. And I thought $10 was too steep already! It's a good thing I left them > 1 year ago and love Trainer Road so much more now :-)! I was one of the early beta users too... but TBH, it got boring super fast.

Re: Zwift increases monthly prices by 50% [Toby] [ In reply to ]

Nov 17, 17 6:13

Post #104 of 247 (7132 views)

Toby wrote:

Maybe $70 at the most. I don't feel that Zwift is worth more than double a huge XB1 or PS4 game every year. Nor TrainerRoad. Bully for them that others disagree, but I'm not playing along.

I disagree. Easily worth more than double a video game.

Me after playing video games for 4 hours:

Me after BLOWING SHIT UP in a Zwift race, leaving bitches scattered all over Watopia:

Last edited by: trail: Nov 17, 17 6:16

Re: Zwift increases monthly prices by 50% [GreatScott] [ In reply to ]

Nov 17, 17 6:45

Post #105 of 247 (7100 views)

GreatScott wrote:

Good news for those of us committed to Trainer Road.

Scott

AMEN!

website/blog | Instagram

Re: Zwift increases monthly prices by 50% [jkhayc] [ In reply to ]

Nov 17, 17 6:50

Post #106 of 247 (7089 views)

jkhayc wrote:

Eric Min wrote:

The team too has grown. Every day we work at building the team that can bring you an awesome and constantly improving experience to help you improve your cycling performance and achieve your fitness goals. From a scrappy little team that could all fit around a table and share a meal, Zwift’s staff has grown to over a hundred people including programmers, artists, designers, testers, community managers, coaches, marketers, and an awesome support staff working to help Zwifters when they have questions.

In order to continue to make Zwift bigger, better and more beautiful, we are updating our membership price to $14.99 per month, effective today. As a way of saying thank you, however, to the awesome Zwifters who helped us get here, your pricing will not change for one year. If you happen to suspend your membership during this period and come back, you can still enjoy your current pricing level. (Visit our FAQ for all the details.)

The year of forgiveness is nice, but a 50% increase seems ambitious.

F zwift I ride outside, I'm from Canada... HTFU

Re: Zwift increases monthly prices by 50% [trail] [ In reply to ]

Nov 17, 17 7:10

Post #107 of 247 (7071 views)

trail wrote:

Remind CaptainCanada to turn off his webcam after his workouts.

i think he leaves it on purposely. it's a louis ck kind of thing. (if you choose to monitor your monitor, the blame is half yours.)

Dan Empfield
aka Slowman

Last edited by: Slowman: Nov 17, 17 7:13

Re: Zwift increases monthly prices by 50% [B.McMaster] [ In reply to ]

Nov 17, 17 7:29

Post #108 of 247 (7033 views)

B.McMaster wrote:

Rappstar wrote:

Lots of the common questions are answered in an FAQ we have regarding the price increase: https://support.zwift.com/...rticles/115005405146

I see every day what this increase is going to support. Zwift is today just so much more than it was 3yrs ago when we launched at $10/mo. (This is our first price increase ever.) And, based on most responses, I think most people generally understand the price increase; that doesn't mean they agree with it, but that's fine. I completely understand that people have budgets and they have to decide what something is - or is not - worth to them.

But I can promise that you are not going to be paying more for the same experience on Zwift. Will the changes and improvements be worth 50% more? That's for you to decide. But it's certainly our goal to deliver way more than a 50% better experience over the next year...

Can we get a decent user manual for the extra $5?

I generally ride once or twice a month (vs. 5 or 6 times a week on my standard CT courses) on it and even at that, $15 or $7.5 per ride doesn't bother me.

As for the enhancements - races, group rides etc. I don't do them outside, so why do it in an "virtual" world.

What other enhancements are a benefit - it already tells me my speed, watts, time, distance...

User guide (unofficial) for free: http://titaniumgeek.com/...ial-running-updates/

Re: Zwift increases monthly prices by 50% [ddub] [ In reply to ]

Nov 17, 17 7:40

Post #109 of 247 (7017 views)

Is the likely price jump due to people suspending accounts to basically only ride in certain time periods (IE winter)....was there an option of lower rates for "loyal" customers, besides the 1 year at $10 option? (i guess that was the loyal customer part)

ETA: I guess I'm asking is because Zwift is used as a side thing for people, a way for Zwift to sorta force you to be all in or all out? IE, raise the rate in the event that even if pissed off ST leaves it, the rest that stayed make up for it?

Brooks Doughtie, M.S.
Exercise Physiology
-USAT Level II

Last edited by: B_Doughtie: Nov 17, 17 7:50

Re: Zwift increases monthly prices by 50% [Nate Pearson] [ In reply to ]

Nov 17, 17 8:24

Post #110 of 247 (6981 views)

Nate Pearson wrote:

That is true. We grandfather in prices and you never get increased as long as you don't suspend.

Grateful for this - thanks Nate and the TR team!

Re: Zwift increases monthly prices by 50% [JT_Dennen] [ In reply to ]

Nov 17, 17 8:36

Post #111 of 247 (6969 views)

JT_Dennen wrote:

You don't have to get Starbucks.

Blasphemy.

-------------------
Madison photographer Timothy Hughes | Instagram

Re: Zwift increases monthly prices by 50% [Timtek] [ In reply to ]

Nov 17, 17 9:08

Post #112 of 247 (6913 views)

There should be a 120 dollar yearly subscription offering for those of us that don't cancel our accounts during the normal riding season.

Re: Zwift increases monthly prices by 50% [refthimos] [ In reply to ]

Nov 17, 17 9:16

Post #113 of 247 (6906 views)

refthimos wrote:

My guess is that this will increase their seasonal churn. I didn't use Zwift from June to October of this year, so probably 5 months or so of inactivity, but I didn't suspend my account. The $9.99/month was NBD and in some sense I just wanted to continue to support the platform. I would imagine others might feel the same at $9.99/month.

I'm not sure that I would seasonally suspend my account at $14.99/month, but I'll consider it more than I would at $9.99/month.

100% agree, I joined last year, spent the money on a smart trainer, sensors, extra cassette for my back wheel I no longer use outdoors to use on the trainer. I enjoyed it and decided not to cancel for the summer to support the platform, plus there were one or 2 weekends where it rained a lot and I jumped on Zwift instead.

I will keep my membership in the winter months at $15 even though I only jump on once a week, maybe twice, but may consider cancelling for the summer.

Re: Zwift increases monthly prices by 50% [Timtek] [ In reply to ]

Nov 17, 17 9:23

Post #114 of 247 (6889 views)

Timtek wrote:

JT_Dennen wrote:

You don't have to get Starbucks.

Blasphemy.

Completely valid point though. You get what, 3-4 coffees from Startbucks for $15. For $15 a month you get the thing for the entire month. Some stuff I don't mind paying for SAS and I get why they do it. Others are just pissing me off (Adobe).
This is still pretty cheap for what you get (and I don't use it).

Re: Zwift increases monthly prices by 50% [Nate Pearson] [ In reply to ]

Nov 17, 17 10:21

Post #115 of 247 (6841 views)

I am grateful for this as well, I signed up on day 1 and use it regularly while still paying the introductory price :)

Re: Zwift increases monthly prices by 50% [sorelegs] [ In reply to ]

Nov 17, 17 10:29

Post #116 of 247 (6829 views)

Funny people complaining about price hike in this sport genre that drop 3k + on bike, 1k+ on race entries, and the multitudes of tech. Pay to play people....

Re: Zwift increases monthly prices by 50% [synthetic] [ In reply to ]

Nov 17, 17 10:31

Post #117 of 247 (6825 views)

synthetic wrote:

Funny people complaining about price hike in this sport genre that drop 3k + on bike, 1k+ on race entries, and the multitudes of tech. Pay to play people....

pretty sure they complain about those too...

Re: Zwift increases monthly prices by 50% [Timtek] [ In reply to ]

Nov 17, 17 11:00

Post #118 of 247 (6790 views)

Timtek wrote:

JT_Dennen wrote:

You don't have to get Starbucks.

Blasphemy.

I mean I don’t use Zwift, clearly coffee is more important to me haha

Re: Zwift increases monthly prices by 50% [Toby] [ In reply to ]

Nov 17, 17 11:14

Post #119 of 247 (6759 views)

Toby wrote:

imswimmer328 wrote:

I must say, I don't know much about the platforms you mentioned. However, Zwift isn't just a piece of software. They use a subscription model because it's actually more of a service than a good, if that makes sense. They provide the platform and host the servers required to keep it going. More like a gym membership. They also have to use a subscription because I don't think people would actually buy the product if they made it cost as much as they would have to.

PeriPedal and PerfPro are software more like TrainerRoad in that all they do is workouts, not video game group rides.

I would have more sympathy for the "servers" point if it weren't for two things:

1) Server time is fairly cheap, and the bulk of processing for this is done client-side. Blizzard managed to keep Battle.Net going without monthly subscriptions, and still doesn't charge for the multiplayer aspects of Diablo and StarCraft (or didn't last time I checked). And it was all 100% stone-cold free with the purchase of those games before WoW came along.
2) The software-as-subscription model is the direction just about everyone wants to go, "service" or not. TrainerRoad does, as does Adobe, and more that I can't think of at this hour before the coffee kicks in. Mainline, A-level franchise games typically go for $60 these days, yes? Maybe $70 at the most. I don't feel that Zwift is worth more than double a huge XB1 or PS4 game every year. Nor TrainerRoad. Bully for them that others disagree, but I'm not playing along. Or Take Adobe Lightroom - it costs almost as much per year of subscription as to buy the thing outright, only if you buy it you can use it for two (or more!) years between upgrades if you don't need the new features or support for newer cameras. And they don't even release new versions every year...

Let's additionally point out that while Zwift is based in California, they save money by having their backend server work done by a team in Rio.

Re: Zwift increases monthly prices by 50% [spudone] [ In reply to ]

Nov 17, 17 11:25

Post #120 of 247 (6737 views)

spudone wrote:

Toby wrote:

imswimmer328 wrote:

I must say, I don't know much about the platforms you mentioned. However, Zwift isn't just a piece of software. They use a subscription model because it's actually more of a service than a good, if that makes sense. They provide the platform and host the servers required to keep it going. More like a gym membership. They also have to use a subscription because I don't think people would actually buy the product if they made it cost as much as they would have to.

PeriPedal and PerfPro are software more like TrainerRoad in that all they do is workouts, not video game group rides.

I would have more sympathy for the "servers" point if it weren't for two things:

1) Server time is fairly cheap, and the bulk of processing for this is done client-side. Blizzard managed to keep Battle.Net going without monthly subscriptions, and still doesn't charge for the multiplayer aspects of Diablo and StarCraft (or didn't last time I checked). And it was all 100% stone-cold free with the purchase of those games before WoW came along.
2) The software-as-subscription model is the direction just about everyone wants to go, "service" or not. TrainerRoad does, as does Adobe, and more that I can't think of at this hour before the coffee kicks in. Mainline, A-level franchise games typically go for $60 these days, yes? Maybe $70 at the most. I don't feel that Zwift is worth more than double a huge XB1 or PS4 game every year. Nor TrainerRoad. Bully for them that others disagree, but I'm not playing along. Or Take Adobe Lightroom - it costs almost as much per year of subscription as to buy the thing outright, only if you buy it you can use it for two (or more!) years between upgrades if you don't need the new features or support for newer cameras. And they don't even release new versions every year...

Let's additionally point out that while Zwift is based in California, they save money by having their backend server work done by a team in Rio.

.

Yay for out sourcing. Side question, would you be more willing to pay new fee if all work labor was guaranteed to be USA sourced?

Re: Zwift increases monthly prices by 50% [synthetic] [ In reply to ]

Nov 17, 17 11:36

Post #121 of 247 (6723 views)

synthetic wrote:

spudone wrote:

Toby wrote:

imswimmer328 wrote:

I must say, I don't know much about the platforms you mentioned. However, Zwift isn't just a piece of software. They use a subscription model because it's actually more of a service than a good, if that makes sense. They provide the platform and host the servers required to keep it going. More like a gym membership. They also have to use a subscription because I don't think people would actually buy the product if they made it cost as much as they would have to.

PeriPedal and PerfPro are software more like TrainerRoad in that all they do is workouts, not video game group rides.

I would have more sympathy for the "servers" point if it weren't for two things:

1) Server time is fairly cheap, and the bulk of processing for this is done client-side. Blizzard managed to keep Battle.Net going without monthly subscriptions, and still doesn't charge for the multiplayer aspects of Diablo and StarCraft (or didn't last time I checked). And it was all 100% stone-cold free with the purchase of those games before WoW came along.
2) The software-as-subscription model is the direction just about everyone wants to go, "service" or not. TrainerRoad does, as does Adobe, and more that I can't think of at this hour before the coffee kicks in. Mainline, A-level franchise games typically go for $60 these days, yes? Maybe $70 at the most. I don't feel that Zwift is worth more than double a huge XB1 or PS4 game every year. Nor TrainerRoad. Bully for them that others disagree, but I'm not playing along. Or Take Adobe Lightroom - it costs almost as much per year of subscription as to buy the thing outright, only if you buy it you can use it for two (or more!) years between upgrades if you don't need the new features or support for newer cameras. And they don't even release new versions every year...

Let's additionally point out that while Zwift is based in California, they save money by having their backend server work done by a team in Rio.

.

Yay for out sourcing. Side question, would you be more willing to pay new fee if all work labor was guaranteed to be USA sourced?

Maybe, if the company was public and I had a better idea of where the money was going.

Re: Zwift increases monthly prices by 50% [sebo2000] [ In reply to ]

Nov 17, 17 12:36

Post #122 of 247 (6659 views)

sebo2000 wrote:

jkhayc wrote:

Eric Min wrote:

The team too has grown. Every day we work at building the team that can bring you an awesome and constantly improving experience to help you improve your cycling performance and achieve your fitness goals. From a scrappy little team that could all fit around a table and share a meal, Zwift’s staff has grown to over a hundred people including programmers, artists, designers, testers, community managers, coaches, marketers, and an awesome support staff working to help Zwifters when they have questions.

In order to continue to make Zwift bigger, better and more beautiful, we are updating our membership price to $14.99 per month, effective today. As a way of saying thank you, however, to the awesome Zwifters who helped us get here, your pricing will not change for one year. If you happen to suspend your membership during this period and come back, you can still enjoy your current pricing level. (Visit our FAQ for all the details.)

The year of forgiveness is nice, but a 50% increase seems ambitious.

F zwift I ride outside, I'm from Canada... HTFU

Yeah but yer probably from Vancouver Island where they don't have real winter.... ;)

I tried zwift, personal preference, but I found it intensely boring, and the race I went into, where everyone was supposed to be ftp around 270, everyone magically raced it at like 400 watts...

Been on trainerroad for 2+ years and really like the structured workouts. 3 of us usually train together, we load up the same workout on each of our tablets, and then watch a big screen tv for entertainment (music, movies, race vids, etc).

The price increase was inevitable, they have a huge number of users hooked. I suspect Trainerroad will do the same before long.

Re: Zwift increases monthly prices by 50% [spudone] [ In reply to ]

Nov 17, 17 12:59

Post #123 of 247 (6644 views)

spudone wrote:

Let's additionally point out that while Zwift is based in California, they save money by having their backend server work done by a team in Rio.

Doesn't every startup? If they didn't manage their own team, they'd use a contract firm. Even if they have a good path to success, I'd be shocked if they weren't still running at a significant loss.

As a transfer pricing/tax valuation professional, I hope they have a good service provider... having an international structure at a young age means a lot of wires to trip for the unwary.

Re: Zwift increases monthly prices by 50% [Quantum] [ In reply to ]

Nov 17, 17 13:19

Post #124 of 247 (6617 views)

Quantum wrote:

spudone wrote:

Let's additionally point out that while Zwift is based in California, they save money by having their backend server work done by a team in Rio.

Doesn't every startup? If they didn't manage their own team, they'd use a contract firm. Even if they have a good path to success, I'd be shocked if they weren't still running at a significant loss.

As a transfer pricing/tax valuation professional, I hope they have a good service provider... having an international structure at a young age means a lot of wires to trip for the unwary.

Wouldn't surprise me if it's hosted on AWS but I didn't look into it.

Re: Zwift increases monthly prices by 50% [spudone] [ In reply to ]

Nov 17, 17 13:31

Post #125 of 247 (6591 views)

spudone wrote:

Wouldn't surprise me if it's hosted on AWS but I didn't look into it.

They have some content hosted at Amazon.

https://zwiftblog.com/...in-uptime-interview/

Last edited by: rijndael: Nov 17, 17 13:32

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