No need. How did he build bikes for tall people before carbon?

well I just dont like the way they look and cant see the point even though Ves, Slowman and my coach thinks they make a positive difference. Might change my mind yet. Wife has them but cant tell me if they work or not as she doesnt have anything to compare against. Its not like there is anyone (maybe other than slowman) who has two identical bikes set up other than the stays for a valid comparison. PM Slowman, in one of his articles he mentions they made the bike stiffer. If you here from him, share please !

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Simple Simon
Where's the Fried Chicken??

How stiff does stiff need to be? And, what did Ves do before? There just is a point where one has to say STOP! One crash on a bike and it can be all gone.

Dave

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Dave Campbell | Facebook | @DaveECampbell | h2ofun@h2ofun.net

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Lions don't lose sleep worrying about the sheep

all valid points against, course theory is they let have you comfort of carbon & performance of aluminum, which is best of both worlds. my concern has always been durablity of joining two together.

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what means this word 'change'? .....
Rappstar

I have both, there is no difference in ride quality, and they both climb very, very well, but the BB of the carbo does move less when it is mounted to the trainer.

Who knows, dont think it can be measured with any ease but its at least in theory more objective than the comfort reasoning that is typically given.

Hey you must be the one keeping Ves busy, I have had a rant from him for 4 or 5 days!

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Simple Simon
Where's the Fried Chicken??

Wow, you coverd that question in at least three different threads :-) . I hope someone can give you a good answer because I'm curious about the answer.

I bought a used Yaqui Carbo with the Carbon Stays. I love the bike, fits very well, rides very well, and just has a good feel to it. It's stiff and still pretty comfortable. Is it because of the carbon - maybe, maybe not. Can I notice the carbon in the rear, no not really. I like to think that it makes a difference by dampening vibrations or something but I'm not convinced that it does. Of course, I might add that I don't have a Yaqui without carbon to compare it to. Also, my other tri bike is a Softride, so everything jars your teeth after riding that.

From a quality perspective, this bike has quite a few miles on it and the joint between the carbon and aluminum is absolutely flawless. I like the look of hte carbon stays and I have no question that it's a durable connection.

There I wasted a whole post and didn't tell you anything useful. How bout I love my Yaqui and would rather ride it than my roadbike or other tri bike.

bk

This was my first reply back from him in a week, so wasnt me. Not that I did not ask lots of questions though.



Dave

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Dave Campbell | Facebook | @DaveECampbell | h2ofun@h2ofun.net

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Lions don't lose sleep worrying about the sheep

Buying used it great. I already lost my wallet on the last bike I built getting all top of the line parts, and then eatting it on resale.

So, I am not seeing anyone jump out and say its a must to have.

Now, you are saying you enjoy your Yaqui more than your SF? I was so close to getting a TF. Still may, but, I want to try the handling of the DE frame everyone brags about!! Now, if I could handle a bike, maybe it would not matter.



Dave

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Dave Campbell | Facebook | @DaveECampbell | h2ofun@h2ofun.net

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Lions don't lose sleep worrying about the sheep

Skip the carbon stays.

And I say with all due respect to Ves.

Yep, I just wrote him back and said I have to pass. The boss is really trying to make sure I do not go nuts again!!



Dave

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Dave Campbell | Facebook | @DaveECampbell | h2ofun@h2ofun.net

Boom Nutrition code 19F4Y3 $5 off 24 pack box | Bionic Runner | PowerCranks | Velotron | Spruzzamist

Lions don't lose sleep worrying about the sheep

Dude. Pay the money. Ves knows his bike. If you amortize the 400 dollars over the life of the bike it will be negligible. Cut out a few coffees per week and you will make up the money. You have been talking about this bike on this forum for so long, it is clear you want an awesome bike. Pay the extra money. Enjoy it. And stop worrying so much.

Get the carbon stays. I am getting the mariola without, and hopefully taking delivery in a week or so. I admit that i have kept Ves a little busy, but only a few emails/phone calls. We'll have to compare notes after a few hundred miles to see if it was worth it.

Good luck.

Tommy, now why are you saying I should spend the money? Did your frame come with them standard?

Did you buy a complete bike? Which components did you go with? I really am thinking about the compact cranks like Dev has. Seems a 48/34 with a 12/25 or a 50/36 with a 12/27 would be great.

What other hints can you give me?



Dave

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Dave Campbell | Facebook | @DaveECampbell | h2ofun@h2ofun.net

Boom Nutrition code 19F4Y3 $5 off 24 pack box | Bionic Runner | PowerCranks | Velotron | Spruzzamist

Lions don't lose sleep worrying about the sheep

Man, take a deep breath and relaaaaaax. You're going to get a kick ass ride. Be excited that you are getting a great present for yourself, don't stress about it

As for gearing, I'd go 50/34 with either a 12-21, 11-23, or 11-25, depending on the terrain.

Here's my take on it. I have a round tubed Scandium Ocotillo w/ carbon stays. I went with the carbon stays solely based on Ves' recommendation, having told me that they would be stiffer than alu. I don't believe comfort ever came into the equation when making that particular decision.

Now here's the thing: As a few other people have pointed out, I don't have an otherwise identical bike to do side-by-side comparisons. And even if I did, those "tests" would be purely subjective and not worth beans to the scientific proof crowd (yes, I miss Andy Coggan).

BUT...

Why did I buy a Yaqui over a QR or a Cervelo or a TitanFlex? I bought it because of Ves' wealth experience in building triathlon bicycles. I bought it because I trust his opinion and judgement, and wanted his expertise. Why then would I not go with something he specifically recommended?

You have a unique "problem" in that you are purchasing two bicycles at once - so a $400 upgrade is really likely to be an $800 upgrade. Suddenly the money involved is a little more significant. Be that as it may, how easy is it to drop $400 at a given point in the future for a new set of bars, or cranks, a wheel, or an aero fork? Those are all upgrades that can be made at any time. Having carbon stays is an upgrade that can only be purchased prior to the bike being built.

If I were in your shoes, I would take Ves' advice and purchase the carbon stays. This is not to say that if you opt for alu stays you will not love your bike - but you will have deliberately strayed from the optimal path set before you by the man whom you have entrusted to design and build your bike. Effectively, you will have (in a small way) sabotaged your "perfect dream bike" in a manner that cannot be later remedied without starting over with a new frame.

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<If you're gonna be dumb, you gotta be tough>
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Don't you know carbon stays are a farce? Skip the carbon and send the $400 to Tibbs.

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Lewis

Sorry I can't respond quicker. Slowtwitch gets second and often third billing behind barbie.com and leapfrog software in my three kid household.

I am getting a complete bike, but my size is right on the borderline of 650/700c wheels. According to ves and a couple other "good" cyclists I know, a 53/39 on 650 wheels spins like a 50/34 on 700c wheels. I am going with the 650 53/39 because Ves says my measurements fit this size better on the CAD and like Khai and many others...I trust him. I am going to run a 12/27 on my training wheels and have a set of new 404's built up with 11/23 for races. I will always be able to switch to the 12/27 cog if I ever do a race with really big climbs. The hilliest place I ride is Austin once or twice a year, and here in North Houston, you have to ride an hour north to find 100' changes in elevation. We are the Coastal Plains...FLAT and Windy.

I think that you are going to really have to work hard to find something to be unhappy about the Yaqui. It is a bare bones race bike, which is exactly what I want, and it sounds like you want as well. If you wanted bling, you'd be hemming and hawwing between the P2C/P3C or which carbon QR frame to get out of the three new ones. These are all incredible bikes, but it will be much more fun passing all that composite material on a tin can now won't it! And if you crash it, you can always take it to the junkyard and get $10.00 for the aluminum:-) Try that with busted carbon. That is the best argument I have herd yet against carbon seat stays. Why do you think ABG went away from them on the Saber? More value on the wrecked frames at the junk yard!!! It is clear to me, why can't everyone else see it.

Take Care,

Tommy