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Why aren't you guys buying Softrides??
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With all the buzz about the carbon P3, QR-L, etc, it amazes me that hardly anybody around here ever mentions Softride, especially considering that the frame tested quite a bit faster in the wind tunnel than the P3. Can't remember the exact stats, but it was quite a bit faster.

The Softride is one of the fastest available bikes aero wise, faster than any double diamond frame on the market. You'd think all the talk would be about Softride. Is it because Tom D doesn't sell them or something?

I've never owned or even rode a Softride but with this kind of superior aero data it would certainly be worth a serious look if I was in the market for a new frame.

So what is it with you guys?
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Re: Why aren't you guys buying Softrides?? [cerveloguy] [ In reply to ]
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They look funny.

(I would look at one, but I already have a Cervelo)

TriDork

"Happiness is a myth. All you can hope for is to get laid once in a while, drunk once in a while and to eat chocolate every day"
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Re: Why aren't you guys buying Softrides?? [tridork] [ In reply to ]
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If I was in the market for a bike I would get one.

________________
Adrian in Vancouver
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Re: Why aren't you guys buying Softrides?? [cerveloguy] [ In reply to ]
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Possible reasons, some of which I agree with, some of which I don't:

Weight.

They look funny.

Mechanical issues, and difficulty of getting them fixed, compared to mech issues with a conventional frame.

Fear of bouncing around and looking like a fool.

The aero benefits can't be realized without an expensive disc.

They look funny.

Soon to be roadie-illegal.








"People think it must be fun to be a super genius, but they don't realize how hard it is to put up with all the idiots in the world."
Last edited by: vitus979: Feb 13, 05 15:26
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Re: Why aren't you guys buying Softrides?? [cerveloguy] [ In reply to ]
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Because they are even heavier than Cervelos...

-
"Yeah, no one likes a smartass, but we all like stars" - Thom Yorke


smartasscoach.tri-oeiras.com
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Re: Why aren't you guys buying Softrides?? [cerveloguy] [ In reply to ]
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I know a couple of fast guys that ride them. The scary thing to me is watching these guys climb. Those beams seem to sway back and forth quite a bit.

What I'm curious about is the impirical data associated with the drag coefficiency of the beam bikes. I wonder the degree of difference it makes and what that would mean for a rider like myself over 112 miles. The other thing to consider is whether or not that beam would give my lower back relief from miles 75 on.

Rocketboy
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Re: Why aren't you guys buying Softrides?? [cerveloguy] [ In reply to ]
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I have owned a P3 for years. I am trying out a Titanflex right now. If the results are interesting, I will post them in a few weeks.

Softrides are pretty heavy. More importantly, they are not really designed around steep seat angle geometry. There was a real good thread on this board recently about that. Softride participated in the thread. I got the impression that they were listening and that they might fix that problem in the future.

I am trying the Titanflex in a search for more comfort for IM races. My first test was very promising. I would expect the same improved comfort from a Softride.
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Re: Why aren't you guys buying Softrides?? [cerveloguy] [ In reply to ]
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Good question Cerveloguy. The data you are referring to is here:

http://www.softride.com/bike/press25.asp

I found their latest ad in Triathlete Mag to be pretty compelling (second only to the Limar babe). If I was in the market for a new bike, I would definitely look into it. For some reason the new FasTT7 looks better than the older Rocket varieties, especially in that silver finish. Like many people though, I would like to see one in person first, and their lack of dealers may hinder them as much as anything in this regard.



-------
Andrew

"When will i learn, people do not want to hurt but will spend $500.00 bucks to go four seconds faster." - randall t
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Re: Why aren't you guys buying Softrides?? [zoomy3] [ In reply to ]
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Thanks for the data. 82 seconds over 40 kms seems like an awful lot. Amazing what a dog the Trek TT is. Says a lot about Lance's engine.
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Re: Why aren't you guys buying Softrides?? [cerveloguy] [ In reply to ]
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Like Art, I got a Titan Flex. At first, it was simply an attempt to be able to keep on riding, but, it's become more than that. I found I'm finally able to rotate my pelvis forward, so I can engage the gluteal muscles more. Hopefully, my quads will adapt to the extra work, and I'll be faster. If nothing else, it has eliminated the back pain that was previously associated with rough roads and riding in the aero position. I chose the Titan Flex over the Softride because of the Titan Flex's utter simplicity. Front to back adjustment with one allen wrench. Seat adjustment exactly like a regular bike. No joints to worry about. No weird seat-clamp thing. Normal top tube height...important during standing. Ability to take the side-to-side motion out of the beam, if needed, by inserting a flat light aluminum bar horizontially in the titanium boom. 100 year warranty on the boom. STIFF drivetrain. Good price.

The beam bikes have potentially better aerodynamics than a double diamond frame, if for no other reason than lack of a seat-tube. I don't know what the aerodynamics are on the Titan Flex...I just know I can ride it without the usual back pain. I can literally stay seated while going over railroad tracks. Really.

I've been happier with it than I thought I'd be. I'm sure many Softride owners are very happy with their choice, too. Beam bikes certainly make sense for us aging Age Group triathletes, since we aren't constrained by the USCF rules requiring double diamond frames. I'll be surprised if both of these bikes aren't more popular as the triathlon crowd ages, and/or gets more educated to their benefits. Even if they are only used as the workhorse ideal training vehicle...saves your private parts, your back, etc., so you can get more miles in. Then, hop on the rock-hard double diamond bike on race day if you have to.



Quid quid latine dictum sit altum videtur
(That which is said in Latin sounds profound)
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Re: Why aren't you guys buying Softrides?? [zoomy3] [ In reply to ]
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I absolutely refuse to belive there is that much diff. in 40K times between those 4 frames with a rider in a real world situation. I don't care what anybody says!!!
What do you guys think?
Last edited by: king1: Feb 13, 05 16:15
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Re: Why aren't you guys buying Softrides?? [king1] [ In reply to ]
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In Reply To:
I absolutely refuse to belive there is that much diff. in 40K times between those 4 frames with a rider in a real world situation. I don't care what anybody says!!!
What do you guys think?


I'd like to know the source of this belief. What is it that makes you so certain that nothing could change your mind.
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Re: Why aren't you guys buying Softrides?? [cerveloguy] [ In reply to ]
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In Reply To:
Thanks for the data. 82 seconds over 40 kms seems like an awful lot. Amazing what a dog the Trek TT is. Says a lot about Lance's engine.


There's a lot in the details. From the press release, "Identical components, set up and fit was identical for each test and independently verified." So if one frame allows the rider to assume a more aerodynamic position, this advantage is lost in this test.
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Re: Why aren't you guys buying Softrides?? [cerveloguy] [ In reply to ]
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duhhhh,

Only one in 50 threads is allowed to be about any bike other than a Cervelo. Even with all you Pluto haters dropping dimes on the P3/2/SL/CARBON every 12 seconds, that's a long time to wait before we can post about something else.

"Nobody gets out of here alive."
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Re: Why aren't you guys buying Softrides?? [cerveloguy] [ In reply to ]
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Well I would buy another Softy but let me wear out the two that I currently own. I have both a roady and tri bike from Softride.

You can analyze the aerodynamics, the weight, yada, yada, yada.

I own a Softy because of comfort. My lower back can not handle the harsh ride of beer can aluminum frame.

As far as the numbers go, the drag and weight issue is such a joke for the average AGer. Do you really think .75-2lbs less weight or a marginally lower drag coefficient will make a difference? I don't.

Throw on a a couple water bottles, and all the other crap we have to carry during IM and weight is a non-factor.

As far as aero, the bike can have ZERO drag but when you put two different riders on the same bike the numbers can be completely different. I can't have a super aggressive position as it loads up my back. My back just can't handle it. Someone else who weighs the same as me with no previous back issues and perhaps more flexibility that can get super aero will have better drag numbers. Same bike, drastically different "real" numbers. My point, the rider and his/her position is the bigger factor than the bike..........

Now ask me how my butt and back feel after a 6 hour training ride and the Softy (and beam bikes in general) will win over conventional frames hands down. Softy's rule :)
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Re: Why aren't you guys buying Softrides?? [cerveloguy] [ In reply to ]
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I had a Zipp....it was too flexy in the rear.........I could scrub the rear stays under hard acceleration.......never been on a Softride .

I shall never misuse Rex Kwon Do
I shall be a champion of freedom and justice
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Re: Why aren't you guys buying Softrides?? [cerveloguy] [ In reply to ]
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I already look stupid enough in my "queer eye for the straight guy" shortie shorts, tight areo tank and dumb velcro strap shoes....

You want me to ride an over-sized boomerang as I bounce on down the street drinking from a giant strawed-bottle attatched to my handlebars?

C'mon.
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Re: Why aren't you guys buying Softrides?? [cerveloguy] [ In reply to ]
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I was considering one - but ruled it out for life when I learned that the beam only had a limited warranty....life or nothing in my book.
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Re: Why aren't you guys buying Softrides?? [cerveloguy] [ In reply to ]
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already riding one...sold all the other ones I owned after loaning them out to friends (4 and counting). I ought to get a sponsorship from Softride for all the secondary sales I've made.
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Re: Why aren't you guys buying Softrides?? [cerveloguy] [ In reply to ]
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Because TitanFlex is nicer!!

Rob
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Re: Why aren't you guys buying Softrides?? [cerveloguy] [ In reply to ]
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I'm on an old school Power V from the early to mid 90's and love it. It is a few pounds heavier than an average bike, but the way I see it I can loose more wieght off of my personal chassis than I can afford to buy or at least buy and match the awesome aerodynamics the softride provides. It is also by far the most comfortable frame I have ever owned.
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Re: Why aren't you guys buying Softrides?? [Kentiger] [ In reply to ]
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I think has two big problems.

1. Marketing. If half of the pro field were to all ride softrides in the major races next year, you'd better beleive that Softrides sales would go up about 400-500%.

2. Retail. They simply have less sales outlets than other brands. And having a smaller market share causes retailers to be less apt to carry lots of demo models (which they might not be able to sell by years end).

I think there is some stigma too with buying into the different look. I know some guys who won't buy a softride until they are "really good". They would feel bad about being on a "special" bike and then getting passed by the guy on the Huffy.

I ride a Softride Rocket TT and I will never go back. Too comfortable. Too fast. I don't agree with most of the perceived negatives either, such as bouncing, or lack of steep angles. They really are great bikes and you have to try one before you buy another bike. You are cheating yourself if you don't.
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Re: Why aren't you guys buying Softrides?? [BenDavis] [ In reply to ]
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good thing I don't hold to the 'waiting until I'm fast enough to warrant it' theory..I'd never own anything...maybe a Smart car (but then again maybe not;-)
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Re: Why aren't you guys buying Softrides?? [ajfranke] [ In reply to ]
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I'm going to be in the market for a bike in a couple of months. Have been seriously looking at the Titanflex but would like to at least see one but prefer to ride one. How did you get one for a test. Please post what you find out.

Larry

Don't be afraid to ride too long or too hard. That's what cell phones are for. Rich Strauss
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Re: Why aren't you guys buying Softrides?? [letter] [ In reply to ]
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They give up a bit on the steep climbs. You can't really slide back in the saddle and use the glutes. I know the canned response to that is "you should be spinning" but it's nice to have to option to bring in some other muscles for a little relief now and again when the going gets steep.

I test rode one and didn't find the comfort to be as much as I expected. Your butt is pretty isolated alright, but a great deal of road shock comes through the front wheel and fork, especially riding aero. The beam didn't seem to help on the front end much at all. There could have been some difference in forks, but I found the Kestrel KM40 to be more comfortable overall (and bought it).

I think adjustability is a strong point, but as long as a bike fits you really don't need so much adjustability.
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