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Why I own American cars, and American car company stock
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Now, before you say, "this belongs in the 'off-topic' forum, read first.

As we all know, there is a culture of "trial by internet" that attends this medium (not Slowtwitch.com, but the internet in general). There is less often seen trial by internet where the "victim" gets exonerated.

As most of you know, we teach people from all over the world how to fit their customers to their bicycles. Ours is arguably the most popular bike fit school worldwide, and is certainly so by an order of magnitude when it comes to "timed racing."

We've got a packed room of subjects from all over the U.S. showing up Monday morning upcoming, bright and early, for three days of bike learnin'. Problem is, the "workshop" in which this "workshop" takes place has gone cold. Literally. The HVAC system, specifically the furnace that will heat this workshop, blew a circuit board this week.

Modine makes this furnace, called a Hot Dawg (how's that for U.S. branding?). Its distributors are out of this circuit board (my electrician checked). So, Modine, a company of more than 8000 employees, found someone, who found someone, who found someone, who's going to have this unit sent from its main factory back East, next day air, to me, and I'll have this unit day after tomorrow. They made all the internal phone calls, they did all the arranging. I explained that I'd be happy to pay freight, and for the new board, but I have so far not been asked for any payment information.

None of this happened because I own an online magazine. I neglected to tell them this. They don't know me from Adam. All they know is that I need a functioning furnace by Monday morning 9AM or I'll have a cold room and I'll need a lot of blankets. They reacted to the emergency, not to the person who had the emergency.

This sort of Midwestern ethic is why, of the three vehicles my wife and I own, all three were bought new and they all came from Detroit. Modine's main business is as a supplier to these car companies. I hope I have many Modine parts in my diesel truck, my fuddy duddy sedan, and my wife's Jeep.

Modine's company is much bigger than mine, but my online "mouth," so to speak, with our 200,000 monthly unique visitors and 6 million monthly pages served, is much bigger than Modine's. So I thought I'd use that mouth to tell people why the bikes you're riding will be fit underneath you by retailers who'll pay more attention to their lessons next week.

I've been all over the World, done business all over the World, and built and run factories much smaller, but qualitatively like, those run by Modine. My years in industry have shown me that you can find this sort of over-the-top service in other countries, but it's exceptional when you do. It's rather commonplace to find this kind of service in America, and that's why I buy American whenever I can. It's not because I'm patriotic, really, it's because of the value that attends this sort of after-the-sale service.

I have long felt that America's secret weapon is service. What I found in my time as a manufacturer is that, when you sell a product, you get a customer. Ironically, it's not until that product malfunctions that you have the opportunity to build a loyal customer. Service is what separates the good from the great.

Dan Empfield
aka Slowman
Last edited by: Slowman: Jan 7, 09 15:10
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Re: Why I own American cars, and American car company stock [Slowman] [ In reply to ]
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Modine sounds like a very good company with exceptional service.

I wish that was the case with GM, Ford, and Chrysler. If it was, I would buy their products, too.

No offense intended, just my opinion.
Last edited by: PaperChase: Jan 7, 09 15:16
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Re: Why I own American cars, and American car company stock [Slowman] [ In reply to ]
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Of course it could be a bad day for Modine if Monday is a bit chilly out at the ranch.

I try to buy American for the same reason I do non-IM races -- I want them to thrive. So I ride a Cannondale and drive Ford family cars.
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Re: Why I own American cars, and American car company stock [PaperChase] [ In reply to ]
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"I wish that was the case with GM, Ford, and Chrysler."

well, here's what's interesting. the wife and i went out three times over the last 4 years to go new car shopping. first, it was for a truck. i would've bought anything, made by any company, i was not loyal, i was not patriotic. i walked out with a dodge 2500 diesel 4x4. part, i must admit, was that my prior truck was a dodge 4x4. but the one before that was a ford diesel 4x4 and i was very happy with that.

so next, i needed something old-mannish. a sedan. to go courtin' with my wife. again, i drove hondas, subarus, blah blah, and it was just freak luck maybe, but by far the best thing going was a chrysler 300. i still love that car, 3 years later.

then this past year the wife needs a new car to replace her 15 year old toyota camry. she looked at land rover, she looked at the japanese cars, but danged if she didn't end up with a 4 door, 4x4 jeep something or other. sahara i think it is.

so, all 3 by chrysler. we're very happy with them all. and the service after the sale has been superb. great dealership, great company, great service dept, great warranty service when needed. no complaints.

what i really want to buy for my wife -- and i will when i can scrape up the money because my wife's wonderful and she deserves it and she would look really really good in it -- is that $100,000 2-door convertible roadster by cadillac. but it's just way out of my reach right now. one of these years...

this is the cost no object car i'd love to get my wife. and even if i had $400k to spend, i'd still spend only the $80k or $100k for this caddy, over a euro version that costs double or triple the amount.

i just think america makes the best cars and i would still think so if i was chinese or hungarian or moroccan.


Dan Empfield
aka Slowman
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Re: Why I own American cars, and American car company stock [Slowman] [ In reply to ]
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Dan, I'm very happy that your heat will be on for Monday morning, but what does that have to do with the American Auto industry? Would you get such good service if your Big Three dealership didn't have the part? I don't think so. The last time I had anything to do with GM was the middle eighties and of course the car had a recall. I got the post card, made the appointment, dropped the car off at 8am, and went back to get it at 5. ''We couldn't do anything.'' Why. ''We didn't have the parts''! I never went back to see them again. I drove Ford Rangers for 20 years. I drove 5 of them for between 135,000 and 240,000 miles with really very little work being don't other than maintenance and a trans in the 240,000 mile one. But now I've got a Nissan. Why? Because they are still selling the same truck that came out in 1982. I couldn't take it anymore. The Big Three have made their bed and we will have to bail them out, but I think that most of us are fed up with the way they do business.

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''Sweeney - you can both crush your AG *and* cruise in dead last!! 😂 '' Murphy's Law
Last edited by: Sweeney: Jan 7, 09 15:29
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Re: Why I own American cars, and American car company stock [Tri N OC] [ In reply to ]
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"Of course it could be a bad day for Modine if Monday is a bit chilly out at the ranch."

;-)


Dan Empfield
aka Slowman
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Re: Why I own American cars, and American car company stock [Sweeney] [ In reply to ]
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"Dan, I'm very happy that your heat will be on for Monday morning, but what does that have to do with the American Auto industry?"

the point of my post is that there's something, maybe it seems amorphous, about buying products from american companies, better yet if they're made by americans.

almost all the bikes i personally ride are built by a fellow who, yes, is an immigrant to america, but just about the best day in his life was when he got his american landed immigrant status. he's going to run, not walk, to his swearing in when he becomes a citizen, which will someday come.

he's not born american, but he's got that sort of pride of workmanship that attends american craftsmen. so, nothing against anything any other countries make, but american companies and american workers tend to take personal "ownership" of the work they do. as a national ethic, that's unique to this country, in my experience.


Dan Empfield
aka Slowman
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Re: Why I own American cars, and American car company stock [Slowman] [ In reply to ]
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with all due respect, if american car companies had this level of service (unfortunately, they don't) and had superior design and superior quality, they'd be king of the hill, plain and simple. and they'd deserve to be king of the hill.

but, unfortunately for them (and for their many many hard-working employees), they don't have these things.

the market is a harsh mistress. but in the end, the companies that think beyond the next quarter tend to prevail.





Where would you want to swim ?
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Re: Why I own American cars, and American car company stock [Slowman] [ In reply to ]
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In Reply To:
Ironically, it's not until that product malfunctions that you have the opportunity to build a loyal customer. Service is what separates the good from the great.

Well then the American auto manufacturers have had LOTS of opportunities to build loyal customers...and have come up wanting. Saturn started off very well, and did just that sort of after-sales service, but were ultimately pulled back into the GM umbrella and are now just another name-plate. All in all, the big 3 have improved in by most accounts, but there are years of foisting poorly engineered and produced vehicles on the public that they are now paying for.

ps. oh, wait, forget all that other stuff, they did that to us and we are bailing them out.
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Re: Why I own American cars, and American car company stock [Slowman] [ In reply to ]
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Dan, we love you man but the big 3 make a lousy product. The wife and I both drive a Lexus but we do have a Ford SUV (for events and transporting bikes and gear). As far as the stock, I sold a boat load of GM end of December to take the loss for tax purposes but I think Ford is actually a buy right now. They are still troubled companies but as Bud Fox told Gordon Gecko, "Don't get emotional over stock.."
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Re: Why I own American cars, and American car company stock [Slowman] [ In reply to ]
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"...but american companies and american workers tend to take personal "ownership" of the work they do. as a national ethic, that's unique to this country, in my experience. "

Well, you had yours and I had mine.

Manufacturing by americans has been steadily on the decline of the last decades.

You citing an recent (eastern european?) immigrant as a shining example for the current status of american manufacturing (as in manufactured by citizens actually born/raised and trained in the US) just proves my point.

I drive a Ford. But I drive it for the european designed engine and not for the shotty body and assembly in south America.

There is still good manufacturing by "Americans" to be found, but it sure is too little and to give "built in Amerca" back it's once good name.

I also wonder where the components for your circuit board come from?

___________________________________________
Ego numquam pronuncio mendacium,
sed sum homo salvaticus
Last edited by: de-tri-mental: Jan 7, 09 15:59
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Re: Why I own American cars, and American car company stock [Pedalsaurus_Tex] [ In reply to ]
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"we love you man but the big 3 make a lousy product."

hey, i'm all for letting the market sort things out. but i really wonder how much of this is just groupthink. i'm very impressed with all of my 3 chryslers and, jeez, i sure wish they were an advertiser because i feel like i'm wasting all this gushing.

but i feel the same way about trek, c'dale litespeed, IF, all the u.s.-based manufacturers. no melamine in any of these bikes. it seems the bikes built by u.s. brands that have trouble tend more to be those manufactured in the orient. those made here are generally made by bike riders, so the bike builders know what they're building.

i made the world's best triathlon wetsuits, bar none, which is why i had a better than 50 percent market share. but then i had the only u.s. factory, and my guys all knew what they were making. and we were absolutely committed to the product, the function, and the service after the sale. we weren't hoping the quality would be good in the products we were importing from people who didn't know a wetsuit from a pantsuit. we made them all ourselves.


Dan Empfield
aka Slowman
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Re: Why I own American cars, and American car company stock [Slowman] [ In reply to ]
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Dan, I believe in the American worker. I better, I'm one of them. I'm a proud member of Local 45, United Brotherhood of Carpenters, New York City District Council. I'm a heavy construction carpenter foreman for the largest infrastructure contractor in the City and most of our guys are immigrants from the Caribbean and eastern Europe who have become citizens as soon as they were able to.
I took this picture in 2004. All three guys are naturalized citizens, coming from Antigua, St. Vincent and a country in Africa. All great workers, all living the American Dream! (a little side note: That big beautiful American flag was torn in half by the wind the day after George Bush was re-elected)

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''Sweeney - you can both crush your AG *and* cruise in dead last!! 😂 '' Murphy's Law
Last edited by: Sweeney: Jan 7, 09 16:21
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Re: Why I own American cars, and American car company stock [Sweeney] [ In reply to ]
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nice story. and a nice ending ;-)

Dan Empfield
aka Slowman
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Re: Why I own American cars, and American car company stock [Slowman] [ In reply to ]
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The best customer service is building the product so that it doesn't need customer service.

That said, I believe most Americans want to do good work and put out a great product. The loss of excellence in american manufacturing is due in large part by the legalized piracy of the country's managerial class, which rewards itself for shipping production overseas, and by the general cultural ethos that it is cooler to work in the marketing, finance, or legal department than on the factory floor or in engineering.

Will this ever get qet reversed?


-------
Joe

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Re: Why I own American cars, and American car company stock [Slowman] [ In reply to ]
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As every mechanic I have ever dealt with tells me

"Pay them now, or pay me later".
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Re: Why I own American cars, and American car company stock [Slowman] [ In reply to ]
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I have always owned American made vehicles and I will be buying a new one in Feb. It will not be American made. I believe that it would be a disservice to our economy in general, and the American auto industry specifically, to reward Detroit for their atrocious behavior and horrible decisions, by purchasing a car from them.

The Detroit 3/UAW business model DOES NOT WORK. To continue to reward them with economic bailouts in the form of Gov't loans or by buying their cars for any reason other than because it is a better car than the other guys, will do nothing but prolong their demise.
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Re: Why I own American cars, and American car company stock [Slowman] [ In reply to ]
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In Reply To:
"Dan, I'm very happy that your heat will be on for Monday morning, but what does that have to do with the American Auto industry?"

the point of my post is that there's something, maybe it seems amorphous, about buying products from american companies, better yet if they're made by americans.


Problem is that more Hondas and Toyotas are made in America than the Big 3. A recent Consumer Reports auto edition had a map of where exactly what auto plants in the US make what cars. The Japs have more manufacturing facilities in the US than Ford or GM. My Ford Focus is Mexican made, as are most Ford cars. GM or Chrysler had a lot of plants in Canada and Mexico. Check the sticker on the car on the lot before you assume it was actually produced here.
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Re: Why I own American cars, and American car company stock [Slowman] [ In reply to ]
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I will admit a bias as I count 2 of the big three as clients, as well as many other manufacturers. The view that american cars are not engineered as well as any in the world or that the quality is lacking is nonsense. In the mid to late 80's maybe, now, not a chance. A big part of the issues facing the big 3 right now are the result of state laws and the fact that they employ union workers. The big 3 can't close dealers which are not profitable as they are prevented from doing so by state franchise laws. Further the foreign manufacturers who build cars here now all do so in "right to work" states which means that you generally have the right to work and shut the hell up. Further, Toyota Honda etc are not forced to pay health care and pension benefits for their workers in any where near the amount that the american companies do. IIRC GM pays about 6k per vehicle it sells in the US for health care and benefits for its workers.

Also, through the years each of the big have changed over production to military vehicles machines when they were needed, do you really think that Honda is gonna do that for us?
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Re: Why I own American cars, and American car company stock [Sid] [ In reply to ]
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In Reply To:
I have always owned American made vehicles and I will be buying a new one in Feb. It will not be American made. I believe that it would be a disservice to our economy in general, and the American auto industry specifically, to reward Detroit for their atrocious behavior and horrible decisions, by purchasing a car from them.

The Detroit 3/UAW business model DOES NOT WORK. To continue to reward them with economic bailouts in the form of Gov't loans or by buying their cars for any reason other than because it is a better car than the other guys, will do nothing but prolong their demise.
'big 3'? what is that, anyway? What 'bailout' did Ford receive? What sort of government assistance have the foreign manufacturers building cars in the US received? I don't think things are necessarily as black and white as you make them out to be.
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Re: Why I own American cars, and American car company stock [Slowman] [ In reply to ]
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Oddly the service I get when purchasing a new Mercedes, Audi, BMW, Mitsubishi, Jaguar is FAR superior to the two times I purchased a new Oldsmobile and Pontiac. Oddly, with the imports I also didnt need to worry about service as it was not often that the cars needed any...the Olds on the other hand was traded out thanks to the lemon law.

----------------------------------------------------------

What if the Hokey Pokey is what it is all about?
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Re: Why I own American cars, and American car company stock [Slowman] [ In reply to ]
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Same experience here. The Big 3 seem to do a good job at the product and dealership level, but their corporate governance sucks. We have a 06 Tahoe and an 08 Ford Fusion. Both outstanding cars with great dealers to back them up. I got the Fusion after owning three Accords in a row dating back to the early 90's to support American companies.

_________________________________
I'll be what I am
A solitary man
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Re: Why I own American cars, and American car company stock [Slowman] [ In reply to ]
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Thanks for the sentiment Dan - nice read.

I'm a car guy and was just perusing Jay Leno's Garage videos (cool site - he has forgotten more about American cars than I'll ever know). I guess I feel guilty about about both my cars being German :(

____________________________________
Fatigue is biochemical, not biomechanical.
- Andrew Coggan, PhD
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Re: Why I own American cars, and American car company stock [Slowman] [ In reply to ]
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I made the world's best triathlon wetsuits, bar none

You made DeSoto's?

_________________________________
I'll be what I am
A solitary man
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Re: Why I own American cars, and American car company stock [Slowman] [ In reply to ]
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The plural of "anecdote" is not "data."

For every solid experience you've had with an American manufacturer, there's someone who had an equally bad one.

I bought a GE microwave a couple of months ago. I needed to replace the two hanging bolts with longer ones. The spec sheet said they were one size. They were not. I talked to a number of customer service people, all of whom told me the bolts were as specified, despite my indicating that trips to 5 different stores showed that not to be the case. Finally called GE corporate headquarters, spoke to someone who answered the phone "Chairman's office." Eventually got to speak with a real GE engineer (in Kentucky). He couldn't tell me either. I had to figure it out myself.

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"Go yell at an M&M"
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